Hi!I just discovered that the B767 AOM says that "for a 3-degree glideslope the attitude should be 1-1.5 deg ANU". (thank you Martin :))This is confusing, as I remember some IRL 767 pilot here posting that the approach should be done ~ 2.5 deg. ANU and the flare should be pulled back to 5 degrees ANU. So there's a slight difference, and now I'm wondering what is the right thing to do. Obviously, an AOM is an AOM and has good, valid data, but all my PIC flights and approaches have gone well with the "2.5 deg on approach and 5 deg. in flare" -technique. If I set up an approach with speed back to Vref + 5 kt, the nose seems to want to be at 2.5 deg ANU to get a perfect descent rate...Could some of our IRL pilots here now clarify just HOW it is done IRL, AND what are the differences in B757 in this issue. (BBall??)best regards,Tero

Tero, according to the 767 flight manual , they show a diagram of the body angle during the flare phase.On a 3 degree glidepath, flare distance is approximatley 1000 to 2000 ft past the threshold, flare times range from 4 to 8 seconds. the flare will commence 20 ft above the runway increasing 2-3 degree's, the thrust levers idealy should reach idle by main gear touchdown.airplane body attitudes are based on vref 30+5 and should be reduced 1 degree for every 5 kts above this speed.the diagram shows at 50' above threshold a body angle of 2 degree's and at touchdown 4-6 degree's .the 757 shows the exact same info on the approach, except there is a note for the 757-300 indicating the pitch attitude will be 1 degree lower than the 757-200

Wallace,This is some very interesting information that tells that what I have done before is correct.However, it does not explain the remarks in the B767 AOM I have.Thanks for the info!Anyone else care to comment?regards,Tero

Hi TeroThis is probably not the answer you're looking for, but here it goes anyway...You don't fly the plane to maintain a specific pitch attitude - you want to maintain a specific speed and glide path. Then you just accept whatever pitch attitude it gives you (unless it's totally unreasonable, in which case you'll want to look at the "Airspeed Unreliable" checklist :-)).Maybe the 767-200 has a higher ANU pitch? I don't know.Martin767 fetishistIt's a lot like life and that's what's appealing

I cant find anything about annunciated angle on approach, like martin says ,its a matter of flying the approach path angle at the appropriate vref to maintain the 3 degree glideslope.Angle on approach will vary depending on speed above vref, so pitch angle is incendental, maintaining the glideslope is the target.

Martin,Yes, I know how the approach is flown and what things are "desired" ;). I haven't flown anything else than PIC in over a year...My interest in this was because I have noticed, that WHEN I fly the Vref+additives and keep the bird in the G/S, it wants to pitch up ~ 2-2.5 deg ANU. Now, once I'm over the fence and at 30ft AGL I usually start to pull back the throttles, so that they are at idle approximately @ touchdown. I also pull the plane up to 5 deg. ANU, and keep it there, and accept whatever the descent rate I'm given at that point. ^^^ Usually results in a smoooth touchdown, yet NO ballooning. (and not even CLOSE to a tailstrike)And this is why I was so surprised to hear that the deck angle was SUPPOSED to be 1-1.5 @ 3-deg g/s and +1-2 deg. @ flare. I'm NOT flying the bird to "match" any deck angles...regards,Tero

Replying to myself ;).To correct some confusing remarks in the initial post:I'm not trying to fly the plane at any specific deck angle, no, not at all.I just want to figure out, WHY my approaches usually result in that 2-2.5 deg ANU attitude, while the AOM states more like 1-1.5 ANU.Furthermore, I would like to know, if the technique of raising the nose to 5 deg. ANU at flare is correct (and done IRL) ? I find that it works perfectly, but if it's "wrong", then I might want to reconsider it...Tero

Tero the deck angle on approach is 2 degree's if you add 2-3 degrees for the flare that would put the deck angle between 4-5 as you would expect, so it looks correct what your doing.

Gee guys, all these pitch and ANU talk.My eyes are usually on the center line and watching the RA making sure it's not dropping too fast. WAAAY too busy to have an eye on the FD and see at ANU.:( (but that's why IRL they have COPILOTS!)

>You don't fly the plane to maintain a specific pitch >attitude Howvere it should be noted that jet flying is pretty much "attitude flying" and even some aviation writers advocate it for GA flying. The attitude should be used as the ultimate target reference. Of course other factors must be right too.Michael J.

Simple solution... fly whatever attitude you need to achieve the desired descent rate!A few points... the -200 will be a slighty higher attitude than the -300.Attitudes from the manuals assume Vref+5, however this is usually the minimum speed anyone will fly, in reality you may be 5 knots faster than this, lowering the nose attitude by 1 degree.In the flare you should raise the nose 2-3 degrees, which will give you about 4 degrees nose up.So I'd say a normal approach atittude could be anything from 1 to 2.5, and flare from 3-5.At the end of the day its just whatever works in the prevailing conditions.

Hi!Thanks guys for all the answers, I think I got the information I wanted :).Michael says something interesting about attitude flying. While it is true that the attitude is not among the things that are "chased" in the approach, it certainly is a good reference.If you're doing Vref+5 and the plane is either nose down or already 5 ANU there's something wrong, and that should be detected by the pilot... like Martin said, time to pull the "unreliable airspeed" chart from the sidepocket...best regards,Tero

Here's a site that has some very interesting information about the 767 including a section with the differences between the 767 and the 757.I found it VERY helpful and interesting.http://www.b767.org.uk/index.htmOh, just a note... For some strange reason (yeah, right!) the site only works with IE5 or higher...Fly safe,George DorkofikisAthens, Greece