>Microsoft has designed their flightsims with no centering on >the FFB sticks. That was their call on purpose to satisfy >the "real as it gets" crowd. I may have to disagree on this, on at least my system.I have found that my MSFF1 stick will not have centering forces when I start FS2k2 but if I click on calibrate joystick and then the properties tab from within 2K2 the centering forces and trim forces will initiate but without the other FF effects. Otherwise I get the "floppy" joystick with weak FF effects but no centering. I decided the centering/trim forces were more important so I use it that all the time without problem.

Yes, I've done that. The sim closes to the sys tray and then I just click to reopen it and I have the same centering forces. Works good for flying the helicopters that way. Otherwise, I've found the other forces are defined by the airfile. Some aircraft have strong forces and some really weak. I just swap out airfiles when needed till I get one I really like and I'm all set. So, the strength and weakness of the forces are defined in the airfiles, IMHO. I can always tell immediately when an aircraft designer is using a joystick without feedback cause the feel of the aircraft is usually all screwed up. No big deal to do some quick swapping to get that just right feel for my stick though.

Thank you for this information. One thing that comes to my mindis that there are more force feedback joysticks than Microsofts.Maybe they are better with regard to being whimpy? AlthoughI asked a dealer which FF stick was best. MS or Logitech and hesaid MS, but I don't think he has tested them both.Also if you would fly a big jet and wish to have non force feedback,is it not possible to temporary disable a FF stick and use it as aconventional?Otherwise what is better than MS FF 2 at about the same price?

>>Also if you would fly a big jet and wish to have non force >feedback, >is it not possible to temporary disable a FF stick and use >it as a >conventional? I haven't tried it to see what the effect is but you can disable FF effects within FS2K2.

I've tried FS2k2 with FFB disabled on the #1 stick and the stick is a limp noodle. No centering forces with FFB disabled and therefore no good without the FFB feature. With it on, I love the stick in both FS2k2 and CFS2 and it's really great in EAW with FFB on.