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KevinAu

The complex L.A. class B airspace (help)

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HelloI fly VFR around L.A in FS2002 and I try to make it as real as it gets with ATC communications etc, and and I just bought the Terminal area chart and the sectional chart to use in FSFlightMax.I am a bit confused, and I have searched the Internet for hours now trying to find out what I can do and what I can not do in this class B airspace today (it seem to change very often). for example:* Is it allowed to fly without radio contact under or above the class B airspace surrounding big parts of Los Angeles (I think I have read that it is not). If not I can

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RonThanks for the information, gives some ideas about Hollywood and Shorline transit, but the rest of the information is very related just to KLAX, runways there etc unfortunately. I am more interested in the class B airspace there in general withthe questions above.I have also searched google, very good search engine, but I did not find really any ansers to my questions.ThanksMichael

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>* Is it allowed to fly without radio contact under or above >the class B airspace surrounding big parts of Los Angeles (I >think I have read that it is not). If not I can

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Hi Michael,I'm a pilot, although not in the LA area, but in the Denver area, where we also have a Class Bravo airspace (protecting KDEN).To answer some of your questions:It depends on whether you are an IFR (instrument rated) pilot, or a VFR pilot. If IFR, you need to flying with a "Clearance" (which you get from ATC before departure). This supports a point-to-point route (no loitering of circling or going off route, your route structure from one point to the other is highly defined). But, as you are in ATC control at all times, the Class Bravo is seamless, you don't need to be aware of it's existence. You just fly as ATC directs, talk to whom they tell you to, and if ATC isn't directing (vectoring) you, then you fly EXACTLY as your clearance mandates.VFR is another thing totally, and I expect it's that which your question is based on. In VFR, you are your own person :). you can go whereever and however you wish. As long as you are not in an ATC area with positive control. Class B, C and D areas are all ATC positive control areas. In those areas, you must do as you're told, and talk to a controller (either tower or TRACON, in Class B it's usually a TRACON (radar) controller. In Class B, although you are VFR, you must act like you were IFR in regards to having a point-to-point transition through the Class B (there's nothing more likely to annoy a controller than loitering in a Class B!). As a VFR pilot, you must also hear these words "[your aircraft ID] is cleared into the Class Bravo". Those exact words you must hear, or you will be busted. Before you hear them, you must have established contact with the controller, who will ask you your intentions (in IFR he/she knows your intentions, it's on your IFR flight plan strip, right in front of him/her). You don't have to talk to ATC either above or under the Class B. If above though, the controller would appreciate a call with your intentions. I don't have an LA sectional here, but I believe you are referring to some VFR corridors through the Class Bravo.I hope this helps. Bruce.BJC, Jeffco, CO.

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You might want to check out the info on the VATSIM Los Angeles ARTCC page at www.laartcc.org - they've got a bunch of good info there.Ryan

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>>* What is the Transit routes Hollywood Park, and Shoreline >used for. Are they even in use anymore, and what is the >transit Special VFR area above KLAX all about? is it only >used some hours a day? If you can fly VFR without radio >contact under/above class B airspace what is the need for >these transit routes when one can fly as he wants anyway >here. I understand that a small area surrounding KLAX >reaches from Surface to 10000 feet and passing there without >a transit route will not work, but the Hollywood park >transit is far away west from this perticular airspace, and >flying around the "SFC-10000" feet airspace is not a big >deal, it is not very big area right? >The Hollywood Park and Shoreline transitions have been adequately answered by others. They are merely published routes which can be used commonly by VFR pilots, with clearance from SOCAL, to transition the area. The Special VFR area above KLAX is the SFRA, Special Flight Rules Area, which allows VFR pilots to transit the core of the B without clearance and without talking to SOCAL. The procedures are outlined on the TAC which you have ahold of. Basically, VFR aircraft can fly through the airspace directly above LAX by following the 132 degree radial from SMO at 4500' and 3500'. The pilots are required to squawk 1201 when operating within that area and are to use a common traffic advisory frequency to announce position to other traffic within the area.The SFRA made transitioning the LAX B extremely easy. Although for people departing closer airports such as Torrance or Santa Monica, they would have had to circle a few times to climb to the proper altitude before proceeding through the SFRA. For those people, the Shoreline transition would have made more sense, SOCAL permitting.

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