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Bert Pieke

TI4600 Performance.

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I just installed my new TI4600 on my AMD 1 GHZ machine with 768 MB of SDRAM PC133. I have been using this system for two years. I previously had a TI200. I was wondering why I have not seen a significant improvement in FPS. I have tried everything. I have tried different resolution. This card should be a powerhouse. Is it beacause of my Processor and MEM. If I replace this system with a 2.53 GHZ processor with DDR RAM will it help? Or is FS2002 max frame rate capacity still 10-15 fps. I am frustrated. I want POWER and speed. ThanksAbep.s. I would appreciate some setting scenarios you guys have tried out.

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Yes you need new CPU there is going to bo no difference in Ti4200 vs Ti4600, not in fs anyways.. you need new (faster) CPU to start with anyhow.Also do not waste your money getting some 1.6GHz you will continue to be dissappointed go at least 2 times, I went from P3 866 to P3 2.53 and I am happy, but if I chose P4 1.8 for example I still would not be sutisfied.Hope it helpsAndy

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Abe, Indeed your CPU is a bottleneck but not as much as you may think. Your memory is as much if not more of a bottle neck than your CPU. Try these settings and let me know how you do...FSAA 4XANISFilt. 8-16XResolution between 1024x768 and the 1200X region no more. Try setting sliders at around 80 percent and see what type of framerates your pulling. Are you running the latest motherboard chipset and video card drivers. This can have a tremendous impact on the performance of the graphic subsystem in your machine. To answer your last question...Like a night and day difference!! LOL. That CPU memory combo will easily pull a steady 18-25 FPS w sliders almost maxxed. Also, if your going to run DDR use nothing less than the new Nforce boards w Duall DDR support. Your other option is to run PC1066 Rambus at 4x if the motherboard supports it. YOU WON"T BE DISSAPOINTED EITHER WAY !!Let me know how you make out.Bobby

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>I just installed my new TI4600 on my AMD 1 GHZ machine with >768 MB of SDRAM PC133. I have been using this system for two >years. I previously had a TI200. I was wondering why I have >not seen a significant improvement in FPS. I have tried >everything. I have tried different resolution. This card >should be a powerhouse. >>Is it beacause of my Processor and MEM. If I replace this >system with a 2.53 GHZ processor with DDR RAM will it help? >Or is FS2002 max frame rate capacity still 10-15 fps. I am >frustrated. I want POWER and speed. >>Thanks >>Abe >>p.s. I would appreciate some setting scenarios you guys have >tried out.Indeed your FS2k2 feeds on raw CPU power as well as a decent video card if you want to use Antialising and unfortunatly the GF4TI is not that much better than your old GF3 when it comes to that, should see about 5-10% improvement MAX with minimal AA settings.Since you have waited two years I would suggest to you to wait at least till mid summer as the new Athlon 64 will be out June 3rd and by september the PR3800 version will be out as well as a P4-4GHz following soon after that or if you can't wait:Bang for buck: Nforce2/AMD-XP2600Money no object: P-4 3GHz with the Granite Bay Chipset. All systems above take advantage of dual DDR.For the best use of your present setup Turn your mesh detail down as well as turn some other settings down or off that eat CPU power like Aircraft shadows, scenery shadows, water effects and limit your visibility to less than 50 miles or so.Also if you have to use AA do not go above 2x and if you feel the need to use Aniso above the trilevel filtering do not go above 4x and do not use "texture sharpening" as enabled in the display drivers menu.Hey, just fool around with your settings one at a time until you are satisfied.Take care,Paul

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Ok, here is a recap. I am getting around. 12-15 fps. with the settings booby provided me. I have the latest 4-in-1 drivers. I am using the latest 41.09 NVIDIA drivers. Not good at all. I noticed when I turned off the AA and A-filtering my frame rates went up. It only went up 2-3 fps. This is almost the same for both 1024x768 and 1280x1024. So the bottom line is I am looking at an INTEL MB and a 2.53 GHZ Processor. I was wondering if I can pull out my old Motherboard and Processor and install the new set-up with affecting the boot up procedure and WIN XP PRO operating system. Any suggestions?Abe

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Are you saying the TI4600 is 5-10% better than the GEFORCE 3 TI-200

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>Your memory is as much if not more of a bottle >neck than your CPU. While it is true that faster memory helps the above is most Definitely not true.Try these settings and let me know how >you do... >>FSAA 4X >ANISFilt. 8-16X >Resolution between 1024x768 and the 1200X region no more. Not sure why you would reccomend this Bobby as AA will kill what little performance he has especialy anything as high as 4xAA, and 8xAF? !!! 16xAF? Do you think you should be trying to give advice Bobby? Its nice to help, but not really wise if you don't really know what you are saying dont you think?You have a great video card on your system but didn't even know you weren't using AA in FS while you even posted pics described as using 6xAA :-lol!> Are you running the latest motherboard chipset and >video card drivers. This can have a tremendous impact on the >performance of the graphic subsystem in your machine. Another great Myth being spred here.>Let me know how you make out. >>Bobby :-lol!

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So what will give me a 100% increase in system performance in FS2002 with the TI4600.Abe

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>So what will give me a 100% increase in system performance >in FS2002 with the TI4600. >>Abe You would have to wait till this falls CPU and Chipset releases as I posted above.or...You can get close to 70-80%% better with what is available now as posted above...up...there. :)

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Abe - If you measure performance by the framerate, it's definitely the CPU that's holding you back. FS2002 FPS numbers scale in a fairly linear fashion with CPU speed. If you go with the 2.53 and the new memory I'd really be surprised if you couldn't double your current framerates. The only problem with the faster processor is that you'll soon be getting into more and more complex sceneries and AI ('cause it runs so much better) and then you'll want even more horsepower. It's a never-ending cycle :-) .Trip

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Thanks guys. I think I will go for the HT 3.06Ghz. Unit. I am a little confused about the DUAL DDR. I dont think this will be any better than the standard DDR PC2700 Modules we have today. I think what most of you are getting at is that with FS2002 the TI4600 is not that much of an improvement unless I have a powerhouse CPU. Then both can act together seamless with at least 30 fps with some tweaking. Next, I take it the TI4600 will be awesome on my current CPU with all the other first person shooter type games, etc.......FInally. I think with the upcoming release of FS, I believe Hyperthreading will be utilized. According to some reviews on the web.Final question is will 256 MB of DDR be enough or should I go with 512MB? And I hope you guys can answer my previous question. Can I just swap out my old MB and processor for the new one?Thanks alotAbe

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>Next, I take it the TI4600 will be awesome on my current CPU >with all the other first person shooter type games, >etc....... Hope you don't take this the wrong way, but if your card is real new I would take it back and at least get yourself a ATI 9500Pro as a GF4TI just wont cut it in the long run.>Final question is will 256 MB of DDR be enough or should I >go with 512MB? And I hope you guys can answer my previous >question. Can I just swap out my old MB and processor for >the new one? >>Thanks alot >>Abe Go with at least 512 and you WILL have to reformat your OS partition and re-install the OS and in that case anything less than win2k is not supported very well with the new chipsets.

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Let me ask you a question Paul as you seem to have all the answers to everything and enjoy shooting people down who may not agree w you.What happens after we die...Finally a question that can't be answered.If some of the people who posted here spent as much time reading everything through instead of looking to pounce on the first person who may have a different opinion on the matter, the flame level would be significantly lower.I asked him to start there as a baseline. I knew fully well he would not be able to fully run those settings w his CPU/Mem Combo but I was curious as to what he would get as a framerate so that he would be able to see an improvement or no improvement as he changed things.It's funny because he did what you reccomended he do and gained a whopping 2-3 FPS. Wow now theres an improvement.Why would you tell someone that Video Card drivers and Chipset drivers make no improvement in Framerate or quality??? You cant be serious?? So what your saying is an old revision of a chipset driver and an old video card driver are just as good as the newer ones?. Other than game fixes and patches why release them than. As far as my card goes there was a conflict between Radeonator and Rage Tweak3D. In a moment of confusion I thought I removed one of them and didnt. Both were trying to run at the same time. Even though 6X AA was checked in one it seemed to be disabled by the other. But I geuss you'll tell me that could never happen either.Abe good luck with the system whatever you choose. Oh and by the way maybe it was a misprint but calling someone who is trying to help you by a joke name instead of their real name just because they Stated nothing wrong just something that was different than another person...Pretty petty if you ask me...Good Flying..Bobby

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>Let me ask you a question Paul as you seem to have all the >answers to everything Well thanks dude! :)and enjoy shooting people down who may not agree w you. Never, I do however have a problem with those that try to post misinformation as fact.>>What happens after we die...Finally a question that can't be >answered. Gen. 3:19:

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Flightsurgeon,Almost everyone knows that FS2K2 is CPU hungry, so upgrading to a high-end AMD or P4 2.4Mhz+ system should provide you a big boost in performance. However, before you make that committment in funds, let's try one simple test to see just how it improves your performance.First, switch to the 29.42 Nivida drivers as recommended by Andrew Tingle. Download his Nividia Tweaking Guide and Riva Tuner to set your system to the recommended settings. I followed the instructions implicitly, and I have the smoothest flying environment I have ever experienced with any set of drivers and settings. You should definitely see an improvement.I would be curious to know your results, so please post them. BTW: I have an AMD Athlon XP 1700+ processor (1.44 Mhz), 512 MB DDR PC2100 RAM, GEforce Ti4600 128 MB card, and running with Windows 2000 PRO operating system. With FPS locked at 20, it always stays at 20. No, the sliders are not all maxed, but the smoothness of flight was the result I was trying achieve.Good Luck!KeithP.S. The above recommendations won't cost you one additional cent to improve your system.

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Well, I really appreciate your input but the link for the benchmarking of a GF3 and a GF4 is somewhat incorrect. My cpu is set-up just like his. I FOUND THE PROBLEM. ATC, turned off incread frame rates to 20-25 with everything maxed out. Most of you immediately jumped the bandwagon and stated that it was not the TI4600. The review also stated there was a 10% increase at best with a TI4600 when stepping up from a GF3. I tested both cards and I got some amazing frame rates. AA was set to 2x and A-filtering off. I agree with all of you on the processor issue and memory. I find that review to be incorrect. I do my ATC'ing on VATSIM with no problems at all.ThanksABE

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Depending on your budget, you may consider saving some money by not going for the "latest, geatest" CPU.. Intel prices their processors so that you pay quite a premium for the newest technology.Based on what you've got today, you can accomplish your goal by spending $150 for a P4-2.4, another $150 for a quality board, such as Asus P4PE-L, and $60 for 512 Meg PC2700 memory. You'll have a great system that will consistently deliver 24 fps and you can stop fretting about the new video card not delivering.A 3 Gig CPU will not give you much perceived performance over the 2.4 unless you are into running bechmarks for fun..

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____________________________________________________________________p.s. I would appreciate some setting scenarios you guys have tried out.____________________________________________________________________Abe; build your system identical to the one Bobby has in the thread below. IT's the best bang for your buck. The PIV2.53 is priced extremely well for the performance. The ATI video card can keep the graphics going so you'll see no blurs and no lags. Just a very pretty picture with 4xAA & 16xAF. The PC1066 ram is the fastest on the planet although there is some new DDR stuff trying to catch up. FS2002 wants a fast processor, fast ram and a high end fast video card. Bobby has all three of those as do I. Good hunting!!!

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Abe, You may want to look into some of the new PC4200 Rambus that is out. There is a beautiful board from asus that can take advantage of the newer 232 pin RB. The stuff absolutely screams for about what you would pay for a new Dual Channel DDR board. The difference is although DCDDR is closing the gap it cannot compete. especially w the newer PC4200. According to some people here I know nothing but I do know how to build a good system w solid dependable components. Follow mine and Big's layout and you WILL not be dissapointed."Booby"

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I think we may be mixing up two questions:1. what is a "great, well priced" system for running FS20022. what is the "newest, best" system for running FS2002Every 30 days, advancing technology brings us a new candidate for "best" system.. but taking $$ into account, it may be worth considering that "newest, best" technology often has double the cost of "great" technology..Current examples: Rambus 1066 RAM cost = 2X DDR 2700 Ram cost P4-2.8 = 2x cost of P4-2.4In each of these examples the benefit might be 20% and the cost difference 100%.. Since these questions often relate to a "limited budget" system, we should take $$ into account before responding only with what is the absolute fastest at time of writing, but also with what is the best "price-performer"..

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Bert, I would agree w you on most points except that in his very first post he stated that he wanted power and speed. How fast you want to go depends on what you want to spend. If I was building the system I wouldnt worry about the hyperthreading or the amazing clock speed. I would spend my money on a solid 2.5 or 2.66 P4 running on a P4T-533 board, 9700Pro and 512 Megs of Samsung RDRAM. This system will easily run at 2.8-3.0 Ghz all day without breaking a sweat, throw down amazing numbers and not wreck your wallet. Current prices for DDR are around $295 for 1 gig of PC2700 to $337 for PC3200. Unless he buys a board that supports Dual Channel DDR he could easily see the same performance from 512 Megs of Rambus vs 1 Gig of PC2700 for about $3 More. Your right though that sometimes we get caught up in the Bigger, Faster mentality but in all honesty, isnt that what most of us are after....Bobby

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Fair enough.. bigger, faster is an exciting part of the hobby..I'm sure your system would make most (me included) green with envy..Still, with PC2700 selling at US$65 for 512Meg, it is hard to justify the price difference for Rambus.. lets see how the memory technology race develops.. Current price quote in CAN$: 512MB PC-333 PC2700 DDR 95.00 256MB PC-333 PC2700 DDR 55.00

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I'll take 4 Gig for that price..LOL But seriously Yes there is memory out there for that price. I just figured that if someone is going to spend the amount of money needed to build a machine like he speaks of he should use top quality memory to extract the performance he is looking for. Just out of curiosity, who makes that memory?. For that money my wifes machine just may get an upgrade. :)Bobby

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