My small thoughts about this :Take it as a good practice: Fly the holding by hand !! Thats the real thing! On a good chart you can see what to doWhat will you do if a holding pattern is technical not possible due to a failure in the system ? What will a pilot do in a ckeckride if the checker asks him to do a holding without any AP support ? So be a pilot not a computer user :-)If a VATSIM Controller orders a hold, so tell him you are unable and request 360-ties or Orbits how ever you name it...Try it out, specially with the JS41 it is a real fun I can promise.Best wishesSteffen Rabenau

Flying the hold isn't an issue with me... the entry is lol I get confused as to what entry to use even after studying them.Can't see the wood for the trees I think is the expression.John Ellison

My small thoughts about this :Take it as a good practice: Fly the holding by hand !! Thats the real thing! On a good chart you can see what to doWhat will you do if a holding pattern is technical not possible due to a failure in the system ? What will a pilot do in a ckeckride if the checker asks him to do a holding without any AP support ? So be a pilot not a computer user :-)If a VATSIM Controller orders a hold, so tell him you are unable and request 360-ties or Orbits how ever you name it...Try it out, specially with the JS41 it is a real fun I can promise.Best wishesSteffen Rabenau

I did say in my post "Flying holds Manualy" is quite a task when doing it online, especially combined with either hand flying them, or using the autopilot in some form. I pointed out the lack of hardware support in this product adds to the difficulties of this.In reference to your comment about being a pilot not a computer user, interesting, because most pilots are just that, and in the real world,being unable to enter a hold in that way, or any other failing in the FMS to that degree, would result in not manual holds but asking for vectors from ATC. Flying in the EGLL stacks, in a busy online enviroment, and asking for that, or tring to communicate, and manually fly just isnt really on.my post still stands its confusing to see the entry in the manual then the product not have it, and also although your suggestions are genuine, if we take that to the limit, then actually why even bother to buy the JS41, might aswell stick with a default aircraft and do the whole thing manually! Isnt the point in paying for advanced aircraft simulations, being that you can use the advanced simulation that they offer!

FS9 Flying Lesson can teach you to hold "bye hand" and I think FSX can too. I fly hold entries all the time to get into a course reversal for VOR/NDB/DME Approaches in FTX. Hold's are an art and not a science. Throw some wind in there and the J41 will keep you busy.Please do buy this product. Seriously its the best airplane I've ever had. She makes you work, work very hard but its fun as hell. I swear to God don't miss out on her, she has a VC that nothing can touch.

FS9 Flying Lesson can teach you to hold "bye hand" and I think FSX can too. I fly hold entries all the time to get into a course reversal for VOR/NDB/DME Approaches in FTX. Hold's are an art and not a science. Throw some wind in there and the J41 will keep you busy.Please do buy this product. Seriously its the best airplane I've ever had. She makes you work, work very hard but its fun as hell. I swear to God don't miss out on her, she has a VC that nothing can touch.

I can fly holds quite fine manually, including the required entry, I can even land it manually, and virtually always do, but my point is if it didnt have an autopilot, then i wouldnt be very pleased of paying for it. there are many other functions of the Bendix that are missing that are seen in the real world, many of which again you can work round through some manual intervention, however the lack of hold function to me is one too far for a "Payware" product that advertises the function in the manual.like i say, and you also point out, flying them manually, when online, trying to click things with a mouse, due to lack of hardware support, start to verge on making it become to much like a game and not accurate enough for a sim. I fly mainly the level D 767, this has many more automatic functions than a JS41, both real world and in the sim, however I often fly it manually leaving the automatics there as a backup, when it gets very busy online, or weather is such that manual flying workload is too high then i can revert to the automatics, but that point is often higher in the 767 becasue of the hardware support that doesnt require me to be a mouse clicking demon.Dont get me wrong as I stated in the original post, the JS41 is a great product, visually, and in the systems that it does replicate, I just think it could be a whole of a lot better with the simple inclusion of a few of the items that actually appear in the manual but not in the sim itself!

I can fly holds quite fine manually, including the required entry, I can even land it manually, and virtually always do, but my point is if it didnt have an autopilot, then i wouldnt be very pleased of paying for it. there are many other functions of the Bendix that are missing that are seen in the real world, many of which again you can work round through some manual intervention, however the lack of hold function to me is one too far for a "Payware" product that advertises the function in the manual.like i say, and you also point out, flying them manually, when online, trying to click things with a mouse, due to lack of hardware support, start to verge on making it become to much like a game and not accurate enough for a sim. I fly mainly the level D 767, this has many more automatic functions than a JS41, both real world and in the sim, however I often fly it manually leaving the automatics there as a backup, when it gets very busy online, or weather is such that manual flying workload is too high then i can revert to the automatics, but that point is often higher in the 767 becasue of the hardware support that doesnt require me to be a mouse clicking demon.Dont get me wrong as I stated in the original post, the JS41 is a great product, visually, and in the systems that it does replicate, I just think it could be a whole of a lot better with the simple inclusion of a few of the items that actually appear in the manual but not in the sim itself!

I agree 100%. I mean you could use HDG Select to enter the HOLD's. I need an airplane like this, something to make me work. Seriosuly, dare I say lol, I am more excited about the Dash-8-300 then 737 NG. I use to refuel Dash 8 100 and 300's that flew for AC Jazz our Windsor (CYQG) and there the coolest plane to me on earth.