What are the dynamics of a real world approach to landing on a Carrier? By this I mean for the normal complemnt of Jets (i.e. F14's, 15's, 16's and 18's) at what altitude, speed and distance is the final approach set up? Is the primary approach ILS or visual? At what point are flaps (or wings in the case of the F14), gear and tailhook actuated?I am sure that we all have seen videos of this from the deck of a carrier from a relatively close up view, but just wondered in the real world exactly what the steps are as to when, where, and exactly how the complete cycle to a carrier landing is setup.Any real world carrier pilots out there that SimFly as well that can give a credible answer to this?While you are at it, if there are any real world old timers out there who can answer the same question from times past for World War II Vintage approaches it would be nice to know as well. I also wonder if all types (i.e. B25's) actually landed as well as took off or were some loaded at dockside and made takeoff's only landing back at some other land location.(Please don't be offended by the "old timer" reference. I am one as well as an old CFI, but never flew anything but the light stuff.)Hope this is not a boreing question. Anybody else interested in this info?Thank you and Happy Flying.RTH

I don't know about real world but when I fly from/to carriers in FS I usually go for around a 5 mile final( ILS or visual) - about 1500ft at 5 miles- getting everything down( gear/ flaps/hook) while on the base leg so that once on final I can concentrate on finishing up in the right place at the right hieght and speed.Re the B25s ( Doolitles Raid ) they were loaded at the dockside- took off from the carrier for the attack on Japan then flew on for landing in China- theres a whole website about this somewhere.Dave

I can't give you an exact answer, but... Consider a few things and then awe in total respect of these guys.1. An ILS system releases radio energry and is by it's nature tracable, it's a NAVAID after all. So, NO carrier captia in his right mind would turn the ILS on in a combat zone. Same for VORTAC. Although I suspect they might have encoded military equivs for this.2. At night the deck is only lit very, very dimmly in red and landing lights are not used for the same purpose, keeping the carrier hidden to the enemy. I have heard that the phosporous activated by the props on the carrier causes the wake to glow white/green at night and paves a trail that can be seen for miles leading up to the deck the pilot can't acutally see at all until a mile or so out.3. In reality the deck pitchs in rough seas and the ship is moving forward at 20 to 40 knots (in to the wind).... the landing strip is at an angle, so you have to fly sideways to keep up with the ship.4 There is a "meat ball" on the left side that pilots use like an ILS system, sort of like the PAPI systems that FS puts at all airports, but this is not present in the carriers I have seen. It tells the pilot his glide slope from about 1/4 mile to 1/2 mile out (from fiction books eg. Flght of the Intruder) It also, more importantly tells the pilot if and by how much the deck is pitching, as the meatball will move.5. There is a visual controller that watches with Binos and guides pilots onto (or into) the deck, from the super structure.No one ever said landing on a carrier was easy. I think the old saying that "Any landing you walk away from is a good one" was coined by carrier pilots in the first place.About the WWII bombers. I think a lot of them ditched, rather than land on the deck. In the pacific war I am fairly sure I head of many a mission of launching bombers from the mid pacific off carriers, knowing they would never be able to land back again and would need to ditch.Paul

Not a Naval Aviator here, but a RL PPL ASEL and an avid WWII Flight Simmer. The Navy fighter pilots in WWII did an approach from the port side of the carrier and maintained a slight left turn right down to the deck so they could maintain a visual approach over the large cowling of the fighters. In the landing configuration pilots could not see over the nose onto the deck in some of the fighters so they started the left turn to deck approach. I believe it was the British flying the F4U that did this first. IIRC:)

If Im not mistaken the Dassault Rafale & F18 Hornet have an autoland function, they can plonk themselves onto the carrier completely hands-off.

RTH,Real world Naval Carrier guy here. I'm not a pilot, but an aircrewman on the Navy's E-2C Hawkeye. I'll try to give you the answers you are looking for, in the simplest terms possible (for easy digestion...)"What are the dynamics of a real world approach to landing ona Carrier? By this I mean for the normal complemnt of Jets(i.e. F14's, 15's, 16's and 18's) at what altitude, speed anddistance is the final approach set up? Is the primary approachILS or visual? At what point are flaps (or wings in the caseof the F14), gear and tailhook actuated?"All of this depends on a few things first. During the recovery phase, Marshal Control issues the following:1) Case Recovery (essentially weather and visibility at the ship): Case I: Ceiling 3500 ft. / 5 mi. vis. Case II: Ceiling 1000 ft. / 5 mi. vis. Case III: When Case II can not be met / night ops.2) Expected "Base Recovery Course" (BRC; magnectic heading of the ship)3) Altimeter4) Expected "Charlie" time (a predetermined recovery time +/- any "Delta" (delay). If Marshal calls "Charlie plus 10" expect an added 10 minutes to the planned recovery time.Case I recoveries: -Mashal will "stack" the aircraft overhead the ship in a Port-Holding (left) pattern at 1000 ft. vertical separation, no greater than 5 miles from the ship. Minimum descent during the marshal is 2000 MSL. -The order of recovery (which aircraft get to land first) is predtermined as prescibed by Airwing doctrine. Emergent situations (Bingo fuel, mechanical problems, etc) get priority.-When given the "Push", Marshal clears the aircraft in the lowest lead permission to commence the landing, and hands to the tower. The descent is planned to arrive 3 miles astern, 800 ft. wings level, paralleling the BRC, in the landing configuration. Landing is conducted VMC.Case II recoveries are the same with the following restrictions:-Controlled within 10 miles of the ship, vice 5. -Limited to six aircraft per "stack". -When the aircraft penetrate 10 miles, they are handed to Tower. If the pilot does not have the ship in sight, he may descend no lower that 800 MSL.-When the aircraft penetrates 5 miles and the pilot does not have the ship in sight, the aircraft are vectored into the "Bolter/Wavoff" pattern (essentially a Missed Approach), and are prepared for a Case III recovery.Case III recovery:-Pilots now use instruments; primary marshal fix is the 180 radial relative to the BRC at a distance of 1 mile for every 1000 ft., plus 15 miles (commonly refered to as "Angles+15").-Min. descent during the hold is 6000 ft.-Left-hand, six minute racetrack with the inbound leg passing over the holding fix.-Inbound leg is coupled with either the ICLS (Navy version of an ILS and is piloted by hand), or via ACLS (a digitally coupled precision ILS).-In all cases, the final 3/4 mile approach is visual via the "Ball" (essentially a VASI/PAPI). If the pilot calls "Clara" ("Ball" is not visible), then we start to see about alternate places to land.As for the F-14, the wing sweep is automatic, based on airspeed. Aircraft configuration (flaps/slats/gear/tailhook) are on schedule with the approach phase, just like landing at a regular airfield. The LSO (Landing Signal Officer) is the guy you always see (i.e. "Top Gun" movie) with the wave-off trigger in his hand. He is the guy talking to the aircraft for the last 3/4 mile. If at anytime something isn't right (i.e. out of limits), the LSO squeezes the trigger, the waveoff lights on the Ball flash and the pilot commences a wave-off (missed approach). He has a TV monitor that has a set of cross-hairs on it that aid him visualizing the proper approach path. Additionally, there are a set of three lights on the nose of the aircraft (Red/Amber/Green) that signify the AoA. Red=high and slow (really bad!), Green=low and fast(equally as bad, but most likely won't get you killed), Amber="On and On". If the pilot has forgot to lower his gear or hook, the Amber light flashes, and the LSO notifies the pilot to "Dirty Up".I tried to keep it as short and sweet as possible. Let me know if you have any other questions!/R,Ted Barkley

The normal method is a visual approach. From a high orbit position, once it is your flight's turn to land, you are given the Charlie signal, descend to line up behind the boat just to her starboard side at 800' altitude and @350kts airspeed. As you pass the bow, enter a lefthand level break of 4-5g's to bleed off speed and position on the downwind leg on the portside of the boat. As you complete this turn, you should be slow enough to begin extending flaps, gear, speedbrakes, and hook. Your goal at this point should be to get spooled up and stabilized at approach speed, typically @135kts. You can descend along the downwind to about 400' altitude. Abeam the stern of the ship, begin a left hand 30'-40' banked turn for your base leg. Join final at 250-300' and 3/4 mile away. Look for the ball. Remember that the flightdeck is canted about 10 degrees from the ship's course, so your last turn is going to be greater than 180 degrees. Throughout all this, the aircraft is maintained at approach speed and alpha. Maintain, lineup, glideslope and speed as you descend towards the deck. Use pitch to maintain the speed and power to maintain the meatball. Just prior to touching down, push the power to full in case of a bolter.If the weather is bad, Case II or Case III instrument approach procedures are used. In short, an instrument approach to the carrier begins with each aircraft lined up behind the carrier along a TACAN radial and waiting in successively stepped out holding patterns for a specified time at which they will push out of the pattern and begin a straight-in approach. ILS type guidance is available. The endgame requires the pilot to either sight the ball or the LSO can verbally guide the pilot if the pilot does not see the ball.

Well described Ted, always keen to learn something new.Very concise explanation. Thanks.CheersTim http://www.fssupport.com/maam_sim/maamsim_logo.gif

Wow great info in this thread. Thanks! I'd like to say that anyone who lands on a carrier in real life is just crazy

Agree, very interesting info."...anyone who lands on a carrier in real life is just crazy" Well, they prefer the term Naval Aviator (as opposed to landbased "pilots") ;)

"Man, almost as short as our Carrier, but at least wide enough!"(NAVY Pilot after T/D on an Airforce Runway, kind of badly lined up...)Whoever has the old iF/A-18 Sim: There's IMO a really nice simulation of the Carrier Landing, including the "ball" and some other neat stuff.Fox

Well the carrier event that takes the cake happened back in 1963Hercules C-130 carrier landing! Whoop whoop :)

I saw last night; current statistics are 3 crashes per 100,000 hours flying. Doesn't sound too bad, unless you're one of the three.

Alex,Every Navy pilot will tell you that landing on a carrier during the day (assuming CAVU) is easy. It's at night that the real fun begins, especially with no moon since there is ZERO horizontal reference. Pilots have to continually talk to each other, checking that they aren't in vertigo (spatial disorientation). You'd be surprised how easy it is on a Case III recovery to be lined up after a slow left-base turn, and have it feel like you are still in the turn. Or vice-versa, have it feel like you are straight and level, but actually corking left of the center-line....