Equipment codes for PMDG planes in 2012 ICAO flight plans

[Ramón Cutanda 4]

Hello!

 

I've very recently started to fly online. But I simply can't figure out which are the right equipment codes for the planes I'm using. I've been reading old documents about flight plans before the 2012 changes. That was confusing, but I think I more or less got the gist of it. But now that I'm reading about the new plans and I'm simply overwhelmed. I've tried. I promise I've tried... But just cannot figure it out on my own which equipment codes I should use for my planes. Probably, one of the best resources I've found is this one:

 

http://contentzone.eurocontrol.int/FPL/

 

But even after spending a reasonable amount of time reading and experimenting I still don't know which codes I sould use.

 

I've also spent a couple of hours googling and, to my surprise, I have not been able to find any "common" o default equipment codes for the most popular airplanes. So here I am... begging for help...

 

Supposing I'm using DEFAULT PMDG planes... which equipment codes should I use for my ICAO Flight planes? In particular, I'm interested in both 737NGX and 747, but I guess this thread could also be used to specify the codes of other PMDG airplanes. Again, I insist: DEFAULT PMDG planes so that we all can have a commons starting point.

 

Thanks so much in advance.

 

Kind regards,

[Mijitman 147]

Ok, are you referencing equipment codes as in /F, /A, /G? Or what others would refer to as equipment codes as in B73H, MD11, and so forth?

[Ramón Cutanda 4]

WOW!!! That was a quick reply!!!

 

I've been flying Concorde-X for several months in a row. But now I'd like to spend some time in my PDMG 737NGX and 747. Based on REAL Concorde flight plans I knew that field 10 in ICAO flight plans was filled like this:

 

CONC/H-SRWXY/C

 

So I did not have to understand much the precise meaning of each letter. Concorde was a unique plane in every sense. So I was sure that there woudn't be any variation in the equipment code and I did not take the time to fully understand its meaning. Flying Concorde required a lot of learning already!!!

 

What I need to know is the equivalent to the previous equipment code (SRWXY/C) with respect PMDG airplanes (737 and 747 in particular) I know that you can setup those planes with different instruments, so that's what I asking for the DEFAULT equipments of a clean install of those planes.

 

Thanks so much for your prompt reply.

 

Bests,

[Hillblom86 3]

Hi, Don't know if it's any help but the equipment code for a SAS B736

 

B736/M-DGIJLOPRVWXYZ/SD

 

In field 18:

COM/E3J1LB1 NAV/B1D1S2 DAT/V RMK/PDC ACARS RNAV5 RNAV1 RNP APRCH BARO VNAV.

 

I've omitted things not relevant for equipment.

 

I can totally understand your confusion regarding the ICAO2012 FPL-format. It's crazy much included. Most of it jibberish if you don't know what it all means, myself included.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Ramon,

 

First - before I get too far into an explanation, I don't know of an online network that uses ICAO 2012 format, so it's not hugely important that you know it yet.  Beyond that, we're still trying to figure out a decent way to convey this to controllers in the real world (in the United States, anyway).

 

 

 

Either way, I think you're putting too much effort into working backward, instead of working forward.

 

If you're just getting into figuring out equipment codes, I'd pick one and concentrate on it.  Trying to figure both out at the same time would be like drinking from a fire hose.  Go look at one without looking at the other, at all.  Don't look at what people are filing, rather look at the flight plan form and understand what is being asked.

 

Both systems are set up in a similar way, but ICAO 2012 allows a more granular approach.  With the old form, you would file your most capable capability (the farthest down the list you can go, essentially).

 

With ICAO 2012, you find all of your capabilities and essentially add them to the string.

Try this here: http://www.rocketroute.com/ICAO2012-PBN-RNAV.php#

Each time you check off a capability, it shows you what to file.

 

In our 737s we have:

ADF (F), VOR (O), DME (D), ILS (L), IRS (I), GNSS (G), RNP (R - to whatever level you'd like, since there is no regulatory body in FS), LPV (B), VHF comms (V),  RVSM (W), Mode S transponders (/S), and PBN equipment (that I'll omit for now, because the PBN string is complex).  This means that we would file BDFGILORVW/S

[Ramón Cutanda 4]

BDFGILORVW/S

 

That's what I was looking for... thanks! That would be for the 737 but... what about 747 and other PMDG planes? I was thinking of using the 747 in the first place. And that leaves me to another question... where in the documentation of PMDG or Boeing can I check if a certain plane is LPV equiped or not, for example? I mean, how could I check if the equipment BDFGILORVW/S is also suitable for a 747 or any other aircraft?

 

WIth respect the equipments I use ADF, VOR, DME, ILS, IRS, VHF all the time, for example, so I DO KNOW they are there. But with respect the other codes I have no clue where to look in the documentaion either of PMDG or Boeing to check what are my aircrarft real equipment and capabilities.

 

Maybe I'm so confused because I consider myself a newbie and I just want to learn too many things too fast. I do apologize if that's the case.

 

Thanks so much for your patience and replies!

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

That would be for the 737 but... what about 747 and other PMDG planes?

 

Apply the same concept.  Look around the cockpit to see what you have.  Does the ND display ADF or VOR?  Is GPS being fed into the FMS position (check the POS INIT pages)?  Can you shoot an ILS approach with a 744?  For each yes you find, check the boxes on the site I showed you, or just look at an ICAO 2012 flight plan template and add in the letter for each capability (the letter is in parenthesis next to the capability on the ICAO forms - page 3).

 

 

 

But with respect the other codes I have no clue where to look in the documentaion either of PMDG or Boeing to check what is my aircrarft real equipment and capabilities.

 

Here's the part many people forget about filing flight plans:

Filing is both an assurance that both the aircraft and the crew are capable.  So, if you don't know if you have it or not, then one could argue that the crew is not capable, and should not file.

 

I will say, however, that RVSM and RNP will be pretty invisible to a newbie in the sim.  As far as RVSM, assume you always have it in current airliners (at least for simming purposes).  RNP is a little tougher to figure out, but again, many of today's airliners have it as an option, regardless of if the airline is approved for its use or not.

 

 

 

Maybe I'm so confused because I consider myself a newbie and I just want to learn too many things too fast. I do apologize if that's the case.

 

No need to apologize.  It's better to be overeager to learn than one who refuses to learn.  My earlier comment was just to let you know that trying to learn too much might overwhelm you, which in many cases, makes people give up.

[davidz 26]

Much of the more complicated stuff (like RNP, ADS, etc.) is subject to regulatory approval, and so will vary between operators.

 

Note that if you file "S", you don't need to also file "O", "L" and "V".

[Ramón Cutanda 4]

OK... I hope not being a pest... I do appreciate your extremely useful replies, but I still have some more questions... (just trying to test your patience, hehe... )

1) I guess it would be OK to use the S for the standard equipment instead specifying OLV individually (I wrote this before davidz reply. Thanks!). I'm aware that previous to 2012 the S would also include ADF, but 2012 flight plans only include VOR, ILS and VHF. What I'm not sure is where to place the "S" if in an alphabetical order, like this:

BDFGLRSW/S

or placing it in the first place, like this:

SBDFGLRW/S

2)  I haven't been able to find an equivalent to "B". That's it, LPV (APV+SBAS) in the flight plan format previous to 2012. If online networks are not using yet 2012 format, what should I file instead of that file?

Once again...

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

Note that if you file "S", you don't need to also file "O", "L" and "V".

 

Right.

 

Just to clarify for Ramon (and others):

David is referring to an 'S' at the beginning of the string.  The 'S' after the '/' is a completely different identifier.(for the transponder).

 

 

If online networks are not using yet 2012 format, what should I file instead of that file?

 

haha - ready to add to the confusion?

 

I use this for VATSIM:

http://www.gofir.com/general/rvsm/aircraft_equipment_suffix.htm

 

Scroll down to the bottom.  You want to select whatever best fits your equipment closest to the bottom of the list.

[Budbud 227]

Hi Ramon,

 

I fly also on IVAO and while I started to get familiar with the former equipment codes they threw me into darkness with the new ICAO flightplan format. ^^

 

(To Kyle: They did implement the new ICAO 2012 format)

I don't know of an online network that uses ICAO 2012 format

 

Ok back to you Ramon:

After long hours of research on the web, I found out also that it is almost impossible to find lists of real nav and coms equipment of real aircrafts but based on real flightplans and companies operating manuals, here is what I usely fill for the B744:

SDE1E2E3GHIJ2J5RWXY/LB2 in items 10a/10b and in the item18: PBN/A1B1C1D1L1O1S2

I can't guarantee that it is 100% right but it is not far from the reality.

 

Here is a good document I have found which explain quite well the requirements for rnav/rnp:

http://www2.icao.int/en/FITS/FITSLibrary/Guidance_Item%2010_18.pdf

 

I have found also a excellent doc but unfortunately it is in french (from the French AIS website):

https://www.sia.aviation-civile.gouv.fr/dossier/aicfrancea/AIC_A_2012_17_FR.pdf

 

Hope it can help.

[Ramón Cutanda 4]

OMG! Look like I still have a loooooooong way to go!!! I'll give my head a rest for today and take it back tomorrow

 

Thanks!

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

They did implement the new ICAO 2012 format

 

Gotcha - VATSIM hasn't, but this is me being surprised:  :mellow:

[Budbud 227]

It was a bit of a surprise for me as well when they did it in November last year. I have been flying on IVAO for years now but by the time they changed, I was familiar with the former codes and then I had to learn again.

Understanding the new codes unfortunately doesn't allow to guess all of the equipment on board an aircraft.

For some, it is obvious as you said: you just have to look around in the cockpit (SDGI...)

But for others... Is my aircraft equipped with LPV... GBAS (code B, A)? Not pretty sure...

And it is getting worse with the com equipment we don't use in sim like the ACARS, CPDLC, ATN .... (Codes Ex, Jx and Mx). If you are not a RW pilot and/or you don't have the equipment list of the aircraft you are gonna fly, it is difficult to fill them in a flight plan.

Off course this is not really important on a network and addons where they are not implemented/interfaced, but I like trying to fill my flightplans as real as possible.

 

Now I'm really interested in a reply from somebody from PMDG regarding the equipment on their airliners.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

Now I'm really interested in a reply from somebody from PMDG regarding the equipment on their airliners.

 

Why?

 

It's not like they've hidden anything in there, and part of it is up to your own discretion (specifically that of PBN capabilities).

 

Capabilities:

Standard Nav/Com, ADF, VOR, DME, ILS, RNAV/RNP (RNP rating discretionary), GPS/GNSS, IRS, LPV (selectable via the FMC options, I believe), RVSM (discretionary), Mode S transponder.

 

What we know it doesn't have:

RF (radius to fix) capability, ACARS, DataComm, ADS-B, and other communicative implements, because there isn't an avenue for this communication by default in FSX.