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Guest Kingair315

Using Justin Tyme's 38m USA mesh and USA Roads

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Guest melevine

Hello to all:I have a few questions and hope that I can hear from one of you smart folks with answers. I have downloaded many of Justin Tyme's 38m mesh zips for the US, but have not installed any of them yet to my default FS9 scenery.I plan to install USA ROADS soon.Question 1: Does USA Roads need to be installed over the default FS9 scenery for it to render correctly? .....OR.....Question 2: Can I install Justin's mesh scenery and then install USA Roads with correct results?Hope to hear from you soon....thanks in advanceR/Mike

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Guest JimC1702

Mike,You'll be very happy with Justin's mesh and USA Roads, it's a great combination. You might also want to consider Justin's US Landclass.I also added Markus Brunner's American Data Streams, Rails, and Utilities. Makes for a very realistic environment, especially for VFR flying.Jim

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Guest melevine

Jim,What exactly would US Landclass provide above and beyond the mesh scenery? Also, did you get Markus Brunner's files via AVSIM, or are they a commercial product?R/Mike

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Guest JimC1702

Mike,You can think of landclass as a canvas which is draped over the mesh. It determines the textures which are displayed whether urban, suburban, rural, farm, forest, etc."Streams, Rails, and Utiliites" is payware but only $9.95.Jim

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Guest melevine

Is the landclass available via AVSIM, and like the mesh scenery, HUGE files???Since Streams, Rails and Utilities is payware, who sells it?Mike

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Guest JimC1702

The US Landclass is available at the same link Jim just posted above. It's only a 2.55 Mb download. Justin continually updates it and the updates are free.Jim

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Do you know if the USA Roads program REMOVES existing roads first so that you don't have odd overlaps and conflicts between USA Roads and default roads etc, and also streams, rails etc for the other $9.95 upgrade program?Noel

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Guest bonjourmoi44

What would the frame rate hit be by using the products listed above? I want to get them, but do you think it would require loosing FPS?

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Guest wathomas777

Landclass has no frame rate hit, as it simply rearranges the textures that are displayed. A good landclass makes a world of difference because it provides even remote areas that sense of uniqueness by mixing up the textures a bit. And Justin's is a good landclass.I don't notice a hit on mesh either. I have run default mesh and Justin's mesh, and prefer the default. This is not any fault of Justin or anyone else, but rather a problem with the FS world itself. When you increase the fidelity of one part of the scenery picture, the other inconsistencies are more pronounced. Mesh, has a tendency to produce runways, rivers, and lakes on "mesas" or in "box canyons". This is not the Meshes fault, as it is the altitude data of said runways lakes and rivers that is often innacurate. Also, since an Airports "altitude" is flat, and runways don't follow the terrain (a limit of Microsoft's coding), you often have one side of the runway flush with the rest of the ground, and the other end is either elevated on a mesa, or in a slight canyon. US roads will provide a "bit" of a hit due to all the extra road textures being loaded. This will be most noticable when first starting up (longer load time before starting the flight) and in urban areas where road density is at it's highest. USA roads has a neat feature that allows the user to use "Major Roads Only" and this does help, while still providing an adequate road network. The choice is yours, do you want to fly to the street you may live on? or do you want all the major arterials showing up. And USA Roads definition of a major road is pretty liberal, because you will still see quite a bit of roads with major roads only. It's just the neighborhood and small rural roads that won't show up.They are all fine products and should not affect your system too adversly. Their frame rate hit combined is much less than a fairly major airport or some original aircraft available.

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Guest bonjourmoi44

Thanks for the info Will. I have downloaded them all and we'll shall see...

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Guest bonjourmoi44

I downloaded 3 of the programs: Streams, Rails, and Utilities, Landclass, and US roads and have not noticed any frame rate drop with settings on max for all options. The programs do not seem too be system hungry.

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Guest bonjourmoi44

After installing the three programs some of my clouds and autogen flicker, a lot. Wonder what the deal is?

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Guest

USA roads replaces the defaults roads with correctly placed and scaled versions and adds more roads (how small it will go can be set in the config tool).I don't have the competing/complementing products so I can't comment on them.

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Actually using an improved mesh with one of the addon roads packages will actually provide a significant improvement. Since roads, streams etc. are now accurately placed, they also perfectly follow the contours, such as cutouts, valleys etc. of the mesh. This is especially noticable when using American Data and flying in e.g. the Cascades area. With default roads and streams you get impossible roads that follow steep rdiges and streams that run uphill. Not so with American Data installed.I prefer AD over USA Roads simply becuase it's cheaper and provides no only roads but streams, utility lines and more.An improved landclass such as the FSGenesis one is also essential when using these addnos since the default one has lots of missing cities (the addon ones also have this problem but to a lesser degree).

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Though currently the USA roads product does not make use of the FS9 feature that allows flattens under roads. The roads appear to be "painted" on the mesh. Not that big an issue (IMO) except in places where roads contour around steep terrain.scott s..

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Scott, can you elaborate more on this? How does the appearance, in terms of the "painted on the mesh" issue, differ between USA Roads and default roads? If this is an undesirable effect, does AD give the same undesirable effect as USA Roads?Noel

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Guest

Well, if a road goes around a steep mountainside it may slope weirdly.Nothing to worry about, you just don't get the effect of a flat area carved out of the mountainside for the road to sit on which you may get in real life.

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My question is, does USA Roads differ from default road handling? Or how AD handles this issue?Noel

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Guest Kingair315

>I don't notice a hit on mesh either. I have run default mesh>and Justin's mesh, and prefer the default. This is not any>fault of Justin or anyone else, but rather a problem with the>FS world itself. When you increase the fidelity of one part>of the scenery picture, the other inconsistencies are more>pronounced. Mesh, has a tendency to produce runways, rivers,>and lakes on "mesas" or in "box canyons". This is not the>Meshes fault, as it is the altitude data of said runways lakes>and rivers that is often innacurate. Also, since an Airports>"altitude" is flat, and runways don't follow the terrain (a>limit of Microsoft's coding), you often have one side of the>runway flush with the rest of the ground, and the other end is>either elevated on a mesa, or in a slight canyon. > You must not have been using Justin's latest mesh. This used to always happen, but recently flew up the Columbia River which had a LOT of problems, and the river went between all the Mountains, on the lowest levels, etc... Last week flew the entire Colorado River from the source, to Lake Mead NV, and it did not run uphills, etc anywhere. Its my favorite flight, through the Canyon. Try it in a Kingair and it gets a little tricky. In many places you have to lower gear and flaps to slow enough to make the sharp turns. Last year, flew into the Grand Canyon from Los Vegas in a Heliocopter. We landed in the Canyon on a cliff edge for lunch. A bit expensive for the flight, but worth every $ ... Now at least once a month, I watch the Video (copied to DVD) and then make the flight in FS9... Each time that I make it, its like reliving it, and effectively _lowers_ the cost of the real flight . . . :-D Without Justin's Mesh for the Grand Canyon (accurate to 10 meters) and landclass, it would not be near as realistic. Bob

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Yes, USA Roads differs since roads can slope sideways. Defaults roads don't have this problem, neither does American Data - it allows you to enable the cutouts and flattens so they behave just like default roads and streams.Also, American Data actually features *autogen* bridges. They don't work well with default scenery but with addon water sceneries like Freeflow, you ge 3D bridges exactly where they are supposed to be.Basically American Data has more features and options and is cheaper, while USA Roads offers slightly more accurate roads and arguably better road textures.

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Guest Kingair315

With AD, using the Flatten Switch, the roads appear more normal. Where they follor rivers, the roads are also on the correct sides, or cross back and forth as they really do. The roads in AD ollow the correct routing, unlike MS, so they do not match up exactly with the Bridges. Justin is working on this, modifying the landclass, etc. In American Data You can check a box which allows the roads to go over rivers, etc.. this makes them look better in my opinion, than just ending at the river, and beginning on the other side. Roads in AD are _very_ accurate, for the first time in FS9, took a Road Atlas of the us by AAA, and flew a Waco from Fullerton, CA to Yosemite following roads. Led me right into Yosemite Valley! Ive driven that trip 4-6 times a year. Have been to 48 National Parks, now am going to fly into all of them following this map. Any good State map now will help you find your way around. IFR means "I Follow Roads." ;-) Bob

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Thanks all, I bought AD today and it's pretty good. I think what is now apparent is how landclass may not be so accurate as I had thought it was. I'm also struck by the seeminly few "minor roads". I was thinking I would be able to find my street and there is just no way. Is this because so many of our roads up here in the Nor Cal hills are under trees, etc?

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