How does a non-0 layer override a definition in layer 0?

Is it based on which device and input is assigned?

For example, if I have a standard mixture axes in layer 0, but then create a layer 1 which splits the axis into several defined ranges that trigger different actions (e.g. like a detent condition lever), will that disable the standard mixture axis in layer 0?

I did some testing, and if I have two axes, one on layer 0 and one on layer 1, bound to the same device input, both are triggering when layer 1 is selected? Is there a way to make layer 0 not trigger if layer 1 is overriding the behavior?

The behavior for buttons seems to be different. If I have a layer 0 button and layer 1 button bound to the same device input, when layer 1 is selected, layer 0 does not trigger.

Edited February 28, 20251 yr by pilotjohn

Ok, I think this is a minor bug. This only happens when I first duplicate a layer 0 axis. If I save the template, and re-load, it shows a 0 next to the layer 0 axis, and then it works as expected. Before reloading the template, the left area of the axis is "blank", which seems to mean apply all the time no matter which layer is selected.

6 minutes ago, pilotjohn said:

the left area of the axis is "blank",

That means that it is on the default layer, which has the number "0". You can click into this space to change the layer for this control, that is what I always do.

Edited February 28, 20251 yr by Lorby_SI

Just now, Lorby_SI said:

That means that it is on the default layer, which has the number "0". You can click into this space to change the layer.

To reproduce:

1. Duplicate an axis. Move it to layer 1. Note that the original still shows blank.

2. Switch to layer 1. Note that both axis move. (incorrect behavior)

3. Save template.

4. Reload template. Note that original axis now shows 0 on the left.

5. Switch to layer 1. Note that only layer 1 axis moves. (correct behavior)

13 hours ago, pilotjohn said:

How does a non-0 layer override a definition in layer 0?

By 100%.

That's the point of the layers, a control is only active when its designated layer is also active.This of the layers as a Shift-key or a rotary selector (with unlimited positions, you can create more layers if reqired - and if you can remember them)

Just now, pilotjohn said:

3. Save template.
4. Reload template. 

Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by that. Why would I want to save the config as a template??

1 minute ago, Lorby_SI said:

By 100%.

That's the point of the layers, a control is only active when its designated layer is also active.This of the layers as a Shift-key or a rotary selector (with unlimited positions, you can create more layers if reqired - and if you can remember them)

I'm trying to figure out what's the best way to:

1. Have a base definition/setup that works for most aircraft.

2. That I can modify as needed and will apply to all aircraft. (optional)

3. Then override some functions for special aircraft.

 

Is layering better (e.g. layer 0 default, auto-switch to a layer 1 on aircraft load)? Or should I just duplicate configs/templates, and when I update the "default", just merge it into any that were slightly customized, and exclude the custom axis/buttons during the merge?

2 minutes ago, pilotjohn said:

To reproduce:

1. Duplicate an axis. Move it to layer 1. Note that the original still shows blank.

2. Switch to layer 1. Note that both axis move. (incorrect behavior)

3. Save template.

4. Reload template. Note that original axis now shows 0 on the left.

5. Switch to layer 1. Note that only layer 1 axis moves. (correct behavior)

True, it is the same for the buttons. I was hoping to avoid reloading the entire configuration when you duplicate something -  because the app doesn't know that it is supposed to do that. Tricky. I will look into that.

 

3 minutes ago, Lorby_SI said:

Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by that. Why would I want to save the config as a template??

I'm just saving is a template so I have somewhere to load it from. Basically it looks like, both layers move when I first duplicate the axis and switch the layer on 1, but after I apply the template again, or restart AAO, it's fixed.

Just now, pilotjohn said:

I'm trying to figure out what's the best way to:

1. Have a base definition/setup that works for most aircraft.

2. That I can modify as needed and will apply to all aircraft. (optional)

3. Then override some functions for special aircraft.

 

Is layering better (e.g. layer 0 default, auto-switch to a layer 1 on aircraft load)? Or should I just duplicate configs/templates, and when I update the "default", just merge it into any that were slightly customized, and exclude the custom axis/buttons during the merge?

I suspect that this will not really work across the board. The aircraft in MSFS are too different for this approach.

What you can do is create several templates that only contain parts of the controls (you don't have to cram everything into a single template) and then link these templates when loading a new aircraft. Then you have the choice to only link what is actually working, and then create local assignments that are specific for the aircraft.

3 minutes ago, pilotjohn said:

but after I apply the template again, or restart AAO, it's fixed.

Or when you doubleclick the (or any other) axis or button and just close it again. 

This procedure apparently needs a full reload of the configuration, like it does when you close the Add/Change dialog.
I'm just not sure how and when to tell the app that it needs to do it when you duplicate something.

Edited February 28, 20251 yr by Lorby_SI

1 minute ago, Lorby_SI said:

I suspect that this will not really work across the board. The aircraft in MSFS are too different for this approach.

What you can do is create several templates that only contain parts of the controls (you don't have to cram everything into a single template) and then link these templates when loading a new aircraft. Then you have the choice to only link what is actually working, and then create local assignments that are specific for the aircraft.

Hmm, ok. So, I'd prefer to have a "full" default template that I can apply when I get a new aircraft (I don't have THAT many buttons/axis). This may or may not fully work. If it does great, done. If it doesn't ... then what? I can always just change it, but if I make changes the default template (to expand more buttons etc.), it will not apply to any existing aircraft.

Could I create a template with the just the custom inputs, and then apply that, merging into the existing (default) config? If there are any changes to the default template, or the custom template, I would have to re-apply both.

I'm probably thinking about this wrong (like OO design), and it's not quite matching up.

6 minutes ago, pilotjohn said:

Hmm, ok. So, I'd prefer to have a "full" default template that I can apply when I get a new aircraft (I don't have THAT many buttons/axis). This may or may not fully work. If it does great, done. If it doesn't ... then what? I can always just change it, but if I make changes the default template (to expand more buttons etc.), it will not apply to any existing aircraft.

Could I create a template with the just the custom inputs, and then apply that, merging into the existing (default) config? If there are any changes to the default template, or the custom template, I would have to re-apply both.

I'm probably thinking about this wrong (like OO design), and it's not quite matching up.

1. You don't have to apply templates, you can just link them. That way when you change the template, that change will be immediately available in all aircraft that linked this template

Personally, I don't do it this way, I rarely use templates at all. When I get a new aircraft, I use "Templates->Apply other config to this aircraft" and select an existing config that is broadly similar. This action creates a copy of that config in my new aircraft, and I can change whatever I want without "disturbing" the original. But I'm no role model, I don't fly a lot of different aircraft/liveries. Truth is, I rareley fly at all, no time left for that.

Edited February 28, 20251 yr by Lorby_SI

2 minutes ago, Lorby_SI said:

1. You don't have to apply templates, you can just link them. That way when you change the template, that change will be immediately available in all aircraft that linked this template

Personally, I don't do it this way, I rarely use templates at all. When I get a new aircraft, I use "Templates->Apply other config to this aircraft" and select an existing config that is broadly similar. This action creates a copy of that config in my new aircraft, and I can change whatever I want without "disturbing" the original. But I'm no role model, I don't fly a lot of different aircraft/liveries. Truth is, I rareley fly at all, no time left for that.

Thanks. If I use this method, changing the template won't apply to existing aircraft, correct? If I link a template, what would be the best way to "override" things when needed by quirky aircraft? This is where I thought the layers would make sense?