Hi all.I've finally had success with cracking CFS2-style line decals.. and they work with FS2002. This gives us shorelines, roads, and streams... actually any line-type we desire.A LOT of testing needs to be done to determine if these lines will change with the seasons properly, and if surf effects will work.What CFS2 lines actually are is a series of spline-like sections ( or cross-sectional slices ). These are the ribs that the bitmap sections will be draped upon. Here's the macros:

; -----------------------------------------;CFS2TMFmacros.inc; -----------------------------------------CFS2LINE_RIB		MACRO	x, y, bitmapx, bitmapy	db	x	db	y	db	bitmapx	db	bitmapy	ENDM; -----------------------------------------CFS2TEXTURE_DATA	MACRO	name, spacer	LOCAL	name_start, name_endname_start	LABEL	BYTE	DB	namename_end 	LABEL	BYTE	DB	spacer	ENDM; -----------------------------------------CFS2WATER_POLYGON	MACRO	count	DB	count	ENDM; -----------------------------------------

Not really very complicated. CFS2LINE_RIB is the x,y coordinates of the rib. The coordinates are 0,0 to 255,255... just like flattens or water... and describe a position in the LOD13 quad. bitmapx and bitmapy are one end of a polygonal slice of the texture used... some pictures attached will help explain.CFS2TEXTURE_DATA is CFS2's way of referencing the texture bitmap. Note: FS2002 will display the bitmap with either CFS2TEXTURE_DATA or the usual fs2002 decal's TEXTURE_DATA, included in Christian Stock's TMFmacros.inc( CFS2WATER_POLYGON replaces the FLATTEN_POLYGON for mesh clinging water. I include it here to complete CFS2 TMF Macros ).This macro collection works with Christian's TMFmacro.inc Here's some crude code:

; ====================================================include TMFmacros.incinclude CFS2TMFmacros.inc; Line Test; ===================================================================; DATA_BASEdata_base	label	word	dw	1			; world set number	dd	2667133 		; North Bound	dd	2444872 		; South Bound	dd	310192082 		; East Bound	dd	262470223 		; West Bound	dd	0			; VOR data	dw	0			; lowest VOR freq	dw	0			; highest VOR freq	dd	0			; seeds level 8 data	dd	0			; seeds level 9 data	dd	0			; seeds level 10 data	dd	0			; seeds level 11 data	dd	0			; seeds level 12 data	dd	0			; traffic data	dd	0			; minimum safe altitude data	dd	terrain_data - data_base; terrain mesh data	dd	0			; object data	dd	0			; library data	dd	0			; facilities data	dd	0			; anchor point data	dd	0			; ATIS data	dd	0			; NDB data	dd	0			; dynamic object paths data	dd	0h,0h			; minimum library id	dd	0h,0h			; maximum library id	dd	0			; miscellaneous data	dd	0			; title and description data	dd	0			; magnetic variation data	dd	0			; exception and exclusion data	dd	87654321h		; magic number	dd	0			; compression switch	dw	0			; spare	dd	0h,0h,0h,0h		; GUID	dd	0			; product id	dd	0			; product build number	dd	0			; new facility data pointers	dd	0			; new facility name list data	dd	0			; new facility band list data	dd	0			; new facility data; ===================================================================; TERRAIN_DATAterrain_data	label	word	dd	terrain_header_end - terrain_data	; end of terrain header	dd	514				; version	dd	0				; unknown entry	dd	0				; unknown entry	dd	0				; elevation header	dd	0				; land class header	dd	0				; unknown header	dd	0				; class lookup header	dd	0				; season header	dd	0				; class lookup list	dd	0				; water class header	dd	0				; elevation index	dd	0				; land cover index	dd	0				; unknown index	dd	0				; flatten polygon header	dd	decal_header - terrain_data		; decal header	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; main terrain data	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; regions header	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reservedterrain_header_end	label	word; ===================================================================; DECAL_HEADERdecal_header	label	word	DECAL_HEADER 256, decal_list, decal_textures, decal_end; DECAL_DATAdecal_data	label	word; - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 	data_start_0	label	word		DECAL_DATA 1, 7, 2, 28, 0, 0, 0		DECAL_GEOMETRY 2, DECAL_HYDRO_LINE, 1, 0	; 1st set of points ---------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 4 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 0, 0, 127, 25		CFS2LINE_RIB 10, 0, 64, 25		CFS2LINE_RIB 0, 20, 127, 00		CFS2LINE_RIB 10, 20, 64, 00	; 2nd set of points ---------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 4 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 20, 0, 64, 00		CFS2LINE_RIB 30, 0, 127, 00		CFS2LINE_RIB 20, 20, 64, 25		CFS2LINE_RIB 30, 20, 127, 25	data_end_0	label	word; - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ; ===================================================================; DECAL_ LIST	decal_list		label	word		DECAL_LIST 1, decal_groups, decal_data	decal_groups	label	word		DECAL_GROUP 189, 437, decal_data, data_start_0, data_end_0; ===================================================================; TERRAIN DECALS TEXTURESdecal_textures	label	word	TEXTURE_HEADER 1, texture_groups, texture_data, texture_endtexture_groups	label	word	TEXTURE_GROUP texture_data, texture_start_0, texture_end_0texture_data	label	wordtexture_start_0	label	word	TEXTURE_DATA "1080", 0, 2, 4	   ; "ShoreSU.bmp" defined by 'terraintextures.cfg'texture_end_0	label	wordtexture_end	label	word; ===================================================================; DECAL_ENDdecal_end	label	word; ===================================================================

Two small shore lines showing how to flip the texture display.

Here's a test lake with shoreline:

include TMFmacros.incinclude CFS2TMFmacros.inc; Line Test; ===================================================================; DATA_BASEdata_base	label	word	dw	1			; world set number	dd	2667133 	; North Bound	dd	2444872 	; South Bound	dd	310192082 	; East Bound	dd	262470223 	; West Bound	dd	0			; VOR data	dw	0			; lowest VOR freq	dw	0			; highest VOR freq	dd	0			; seeds level 8 data	dd	0			; seeds level 9 data	dd	0			; seeds level 10 data	dd	0			; seeds level 11 data	dd	0			; seeds level 12 data	dd	0			; traffic data	dd	0			; minimum safe altitude data	dd	terrain_data - data_base; terrain mesh data	dd	0			; object data	dd	0			; library data	dd	0			; facilities data	dd	0			; anchor point data	dd	0			; ATIS data	dd	0			; NDB data	dd	0			; dynamic object paths data	dd	0h,0h			; minimum library id	dd	0h,0h			; maximum library id	dd	0			; miscellaneous data	dd	0			; title and description data	dd	0			; magnetic variation data	dd	0			; exception and exclusion data	dd	87654321h		; magic number	dd	0			; compression switch	dw	0			; spare	dd	0h,0h,0h,0h		; GUID	dd	0			; product id	dd	0			; product build number	dd	0			; new facility data pointers	dd	0			; new facility name list data	dd	0			; new facility band list data	dd	0			; new facility data; ===================================================================; TERRAIN_DATAterrain_data	label	word	dd	terrain_header_end - terrain_data	; end of terrain header	dd	514				; version	dd	0				; unknown entry	dd	0				; unknown entry	dd	0				; elevation header	dd	0				; land class header	dd	0				; unknown header	dd	0				; class lookup header	dd	0				; season header	dd	0				; class lookup list	dd	0				; water class header	dd	0				; elevation index	dd	0				; land cover index	dd	0				; unknown index	dd	0				; flatten polygon header	dd	decal_header - terrain_data		; decal header	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; main terrain data	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; regions header	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reservedterrain_header_end	label	word; ===================================================================; DECAL_HEADERdecal_header	label	word	DECAL_HEADER 256, decal_list, decal_textures, decal_end; DECAL_DATAdecal_data	label	word; - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 	data_start_0	label	word		DECAL_DATA 1, 7, 2, 28, 0, 0, 0		DECAL_GEOMETRY 5, DECAL_HYDRO_LINE, 1, 0	; 1st set of points ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 16 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 128, 10, 0, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 137, 24, 63, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 146, 12, 0, 38		CFS2LINE_RIB 148, 26, 63, 38		CFS2LINE_RIB 159, 15, 0, 75		CFS2LINE_RIB 156, 27, 63, 75		CFS2LINE_RIB 179, 26, 0, 111		CFS2LINE_RIB 168, 35, 63, 111		CFS2LINE_RIB 191, 44, 0, 147		CFS2LINE_RIB 177, 48, 63, 147		CFS2LINE_RIB 194, 59, 0, 183		CFS2LINE_RIB 182, 58, 63, 183		CFS2LINE_RIB 199, 78, 0, 219		CFS2LINE_RIB 184, 79, 63, 219		CFS2LINE_RIB 200, 98, 0, 255		CFS2LINE_RIB 187, 95, 63, 255	; 2nd set of points ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 14 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 200, 98, 0, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 187, 95, 63, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 194, 109, 0, 43		CFS2LINE_RIB 183, 103, 63, 43		CFS2LINE_RIB 190, 120, 0, 87		CFS2LINE_RIB 174, 113, 63, 87		CFS2LINE_RIB 185, 138, 0, 129		CFS2LINE_RIB 173, 128, 63, 129		CFS2LINE_RIB 170, 144, 0, 171		CFS2LINE_RIB 161, 134, 63, 171		CFS2LINE_RIB 161, 153, 0, 213		CFS2LINE_RIB 149, 138, 63, 213		CFS2LINE_RIB 137, 158, 0, 255		CFS2LINE_RIB 132, 145, 63, 255	; 3rd set of points ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 16 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 137, 158, 0, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 132, 145, 63, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 113, 160, 0, 38		CFS2LINE_RIB 112, 144, 63, 38		CFS2LINE_RIB 95, 157, 0, 75		CFS2LINE_RIB 99, 143, 63, 75		CFS2LINE_RIB 83, 156, 0, 111		CFS2LINE_RIB 90, 141, 63, 111		CFS2LINE_RIB 69, 135, 0, 147		CFS2LINE_RIB 80, 129, 63, 147		CFS2LINE_RIB 58, 122, 0, 183		CFS2LINE_RIB 74, 110, 63, 183		CFS2LINE_RIB 50, 105, 0, 219		CFS2LINE_RIB 69, 101, 63, 219		CFS2LINE_RIB 49, 90, 0, 255		CFS2LINE_RIB 61, 94, 63, 255	; 4th set of points ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 12 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 49, 90, 0, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 61, 94, 63, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 56, 74, 0, 51		CFS2LINE_RIB 70, 79, 63, 51		CFS2LINE_RIB 68, 56, 0, 102		CFS2LINE_RIB 79, 66, 63, 102		CFS2LINE_RIB 78, 46, 0, 153		CFS2LINE_RIB 87, 55, 63, 153		CFS2LINE_RIB 97, 38, 0, 204		CFS2LINE_RIB 99, 53, 63, 204		CFS2LINE_RIB 106, 38, 0, 255		CFS2LINE_RIB 119, 51, 63, 255	; 5th set of points ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------		DECAL_POINTS 6 +0c0h		CFS2LINE_RIB 106, 38, 0, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 119, 51, 63, 0		CFS2LINE_RIB 120, 25, 0, 127		CFS2LINE_RIB 132, 34, 63, 127		CFS2LINE_RIB 128, 10, 0, 255		CFS2LINE_RIB 137, 24, 63, 255	data_end_0	label	word; - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ; ===================================================================; DECAL_ LIST	decal_list		label	word		DECAL_LIST 1, decal_groups, decal_data	decal_groups	label	word		DECAL_GROUP 189, 437, decal_data, data_start_0, data_end_0; ===================================================================; TERRAIN DECALS TEXTURESdecal_textures	label	word	TEXTURE_HEADER 1, texture_groups, texture_data, texture_endtexture_groups	label	word	TEXTURE_GROUP texture_data, texture_start_0, texture_end_0texture_data	label	wordtexture_start_0	label	word	TEXTURE_DATA "1080", 0, 2, 4texture_end_0	label	wordtexture_end	label	word; ===================================================================; DECAL_ENDdecal_end	label	word; ===================================================================

Great work!!I am going to test it ASAP, but this will really help us. Now we can at last create lines.Thanks,Arno

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Member Netherlands 2000 Scenery Team[a href=http://home.wanadoo.nl/arno.gerretsen]http://home.wanadoo.nl/arno.gerretsen/banner.jpg[/a]

Hi Arno.Yes. We can draw all sorts of lines. The change of type of line is dependant on the texture bitmap, of course, and also the decal type: DECAL_GEOMETRY 5, DECAL_HYDRO_LINE, 1, 0specifies the overlay order of the lines.DECAL_POLYGON EQU 4...lowest overlay level ( under a water polygon ).DECAL_HYDRO_LINE EQU 8... our beaches and shorelines ( just over water ? )DECAL_STREAM_LINE EQU 16... overlays decals, beaches, and waterDECAL_ROAD_LINE EQU 32... overlays everything ( so far ).I noticed in the Osgosh scenery, Microsoft gave the rail-line a higher number... so it could overlay roads? Probably. Think of the lines as actually being like a snake. You need to define the ribs, and then stretch a section of bitmap skin over it. Flip the skin ( bitmap ) coords around for a pair of ribs, and you'll flip the bitmap. That's how you can draw a shore around an island, rather than a lake. I even made some coord mistakes, and had chunks of shoreline sideways. :-eek Using the CFS2TEXTURE_DATA macro, instead of Christian's standard TEXTURE_DATA, allows you to use any bitmap you choose, as long as it's in the proper texture folder. You might want to try this with a local 'texture' folder, and check the effects on autogen, etc... This is very new, and there will be many 'rules' we'll discover, and of course, work-arounds for those rules.I'm hoping Christian Stock will like this, and rejoin the designer community. Nothing, regarding TMF discoveries, was possible without his primary discoveries. He spent hundreds of hours staring at a monitor, and burning out his design creativity, so we can draw simple decals, water, and lines. He did it completely alone, with very little support or help. When I expressed interest, he helped me unselfishly. I'm just passing it along.And of course, many thanks to George Ioannu, for adding Christin's Calculator to his fsregen program. I'm hoping he'll add lines as well, so those comfortable with Gmax will now be able to draw all type of lines. ( My exotic tools are: MSPaint, Notepad, and BGLC ).

Dear rhumbaflappyGreat discoveries. Thank for sharing with us.Kind Regards, Luis

Rhumba, this is terrific news! Many thanks for this outstanding work (and, of course, to all the others you mentioned). Hopefully we'll see new sceneries with proper FS2002-style coastlines soon. My Karakam scenery has been on virtual hold due to the coastline problem. I simply can't imagine why Microsoft has starved the community of such essential information for so long.>And of course, many thanks to George Ioannu, for adding >Christin's Calculator to his fsregen program. I'm hoping >he'll add lines as well, so those comfortable with Gmax will >now be able to draw all type of lines. ( My exotic tools >are: MSPaint, Notepad, and BGLC ). George's lakes feature was a great advance - but now I've got my fingers crossed that he'll soon incorporate this major advance into Fsregen! Best regards, Chris Wright

Rhumba, I've tried your lake example and it works - but only partially. The shoreline appears correctly, but the body of the lake is filled with Saharan sand i.e. there is no water! I'm using the SDK bglc version and TMFmacro.inc dated 5th May, 2002. Any ideas? Is there something else I need to do? Many thanks. Best regards, Chris

Hi Chris.You've got to make the lake!

include TMFmacros.incinclude CFS2TMFmacros.inc; Line Test; ===================================================================; DATA_BASEdata_base	label	word	dw	1			; world set number	dd	2667133 	; North Bound	dd	2444872 	; South Bound	dd	310192082 	; East Bound	dd	262470223 	; West Bound	dd	0			; VOR data	dw	0			; lowest VOR freq	dw	0			; highest VOR freq	dd	0			; seeds level 8 data	dd	0			; seeds level 9 data	dd	0			; seeds level 10 data	dd	0			; seeds level 11 data	dd	0			; seeds level 12 data	dd	0			; traffic data	dd	0			; minimum safe altitude data	dd	terrain_data - data_base; terrain mesh data	dd	0			; object data	dd	0			; library data	dd	0			; facilities data	dd	0			; anchor point data	dd	0			; ATIS data	dd	0			; NDB data	dd	0			; dynamic object paths data	dd	0h,0h			; minimum library id	dd	0h,0h			; maximum library id	dd	0			; miscellaneous data	dd	0			; title and description data	dd	0			; magnetic variation data	dd	0			; exception and exclusion data	dd	87654321h		; magic number	dd	0			; compression switch	dw	0			; spare	dd	0h,0h,0h,0h		; GUID	dd	0			; product id	dd	0			; product build number	dd	0			; new facility data pointers	dd	0			; new facility name list data	dd	0			; new facility band list data	dd	0			; new facility data; ===================================================================; TERRAIN_DATAterrain_data	label	word	dd	terrain_header_end - terrain_data; end of terrain header	dd	514				; version	dd	0				; unknown entry	dd	0				; unknown entry	dd	0				; elevation header	dd	0				; land class header	dd	0				; unknown header	dd	0				; class lookup header	dd	0				; season header	dd	0				; class lookup list	dd	0				; water class header	dd	0				; elevation index	dd	0				; land cover index	dd	0				; unknown index	dd	flatten_header - terrain_data	; flatten polygon header	dd	0				; decal header	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; main terrain data	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; regions header	dd	0				; reserved	dd	0				; reservedterrain_header_end	label	word; ===================================================================; TERRAIN FLATTEN POLYGON HEADERflatten_header	label	word	FLATTEN_HEADER 513, flatten_list, flatten_data, flatten_end; TERRAIN FLATTEN POLYGON DATAflatten_data	label	word; - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 	data_start_0	label	word		FLATTEN_DATA 1, 7, 2, 28, 1, 1, 1	; 1st set of points ---------------------------------		FLATTEN_POLYGON 10, 622, 0			FLATTEN_POINT 131, 16			FLATTEN_POINT 173, 29			FLATTEN_POINT 189, 62			FLATTEN_POINT 193, 96			FLATTEN_POINT 178, 133			FLATTEN_POINT 134, 152			FLATTEN_POINT 84, 151			FLATTEN_POINT 53, 95			FLATTEN_POINT 79, 49			FLATTEN_POINT 114, 43	data_end_0	label	word; - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ; ===================================================================; TERRAIN FLATTEN POLYGON LIST	flatten_list	label	word		FLATTEN_LIST 1, flatten_groups	flatten_groups	label	word	FLATTEN_GROUP 189, 437, flatten_data, data_start_0, data_end_0; ===================================================================; FLATTEN_ENDflatten_end	label	word; ===================================================================

Here's a picture of my current oasis. Note also: I added a decal to surround the lake ( because all that water in the desert will grow plants ). To my surprise, the decal grew autogen shrubs!So, TMF decals will supply their own autogen, just as if they were a landclass tile, and specific to the decal's area!

Rhumba, thank you very much, that worked a treat! There's a lot of stuff I still don't understand, but could I ask a couple of questions (for now!) I assume the four numbers (; North bound etc) define the world position i.e. they define the actual LOD13 square. How do I change those numbers to place the lake in a different LOD13 square? (as far as I can see those numbers don't have a direct relationship with the position of the square). As I understand it this method only works for one LOD13 square. Can it be extended? (e.g. to generate a long coastline). You can certainly see the need for a graphical tool to automate this process, as doing this by hand to generate complex coastlines would be *incredibly* tedious! Many thanks and keep up the good work! Best regards, Chris

Hi Chris.You need to download masm.zip and nzrc.zip fom the AVSIM file library. These are Christian Stock's original discoveries and comments about TMF coding.The 'bounds' are actually part of the BGL header that's common to all bgls. It tells the sim where and what kind of bgl it is. If the actual scenery isn't located within these bounds, the scenery won't show up. An interesting note: if you were to leave out the section described as DATA_BASE in the above example, you'd actually have a TMF file that could be given a BGL header by tmf2bgl ( included in the fs2000 scenery SDK ). But, you're better off determining your own, as that program has a bug in it that effects western hemisphere scenery.When I determine bounds, I add an extra degree each way, just to insure the sim reads it correctly. I think Bob Bernstein also follows this practice with his scenery.The actual placement of the LOD13 area is described in the FLATTEN_DATA or DECAL_DATA macros. In the above example:FLATTEN_DATA 1, 7, 2, 28, 1, 1, 1describe the LOD13 tile.FLATTEN_GROUP 189, 437, flatten_data, data_start_0, data_end_0describes the LOD8 group area.The LOD8 area is split into a 32 x 32 array... which just happens to define the position of the LOD13 tiles. Christian Stock's documentation explains this, and George Ioannu's fsregen has a very handy TMF calculator.Over the course of the next 2 weeks I promise to develop a tutorial for TMF-BGLC design. It will also show how to connect TMF structures. Basically, the structures butt each other to allow multiple LOD13 areas and also multiple LOD8 groups to exist in the same BGL. ( The BGL header, first discussed above, needs to be large enough to enclose all the LOD13 areas.) Also, with CFS2-style decal lines, totally different line types can be in the same bgl... roads, shorelines, streams... and this should work in FS2002 as well. I think Microsoft kept them separate in FS2002 to keep them better organized for the design team. For a small area, we could lump them together into one bgl. I haven't tried the SDK's tmfmerge... I'm afraid of the results!For now, both you and I probably need to practice our skills on a singular LOD13 area. If you insist, Christian's nzrc.zip does have an example of flatten code and a decal that has multiple LOD13 areas.I'll have a sophisticated examples in about 2 weeks. It will have hills, decals, roads, streams, shores, FS2002 water, CFS2 water, and anything else I can think of, in multiple areas and groups... It'll be a real mess.*:-* P.S.I wonder if Gmax has a function to create 'ribs' perpendicular to a defined line, automatically? It wouldn't surprise me, and would work well.... just draw a line, and then 'rib' it.|-|-|-|-|-|-| ?

Rhumba, thank you *very* much for your patience,and for the great work you're doing. I'll look at those documents. Already your reply explains quite a lot. I'm sure a lot of people, including me, will be very interested in your documentation and examples etc Great stuff! About the ribs in Gmax, nothing springs to mind but I'll give it some thought. By the way, your analogy of 'ribs' is very apt! Best regards, Chris

Oh my God !I missed this !!! This is GREAT news...Rhumba congarts !!!! :-)Now I have to extend my day... I haven't yet read how this is done, I hope it's something that can be easily implemented automaticaly..Will let you know soon..George

This is great news! Thank you thank you!>A LOT of testing needs to be done to determine if these >lines will change with the seasons properly, and if surf >effects will work. >I looks like the special surf affect is tied to the texture. The "effect" name/value pair points to the special effect in the "effects" folder. Take a look at the terraintextures.cfg file in the FS directory. Try replacing your 1080 texture with a 1026 and see what you get. Hopefully waves.Lee.

Hi Lee.Sorry...I see no waves with "1080". I may need to use a larger lake to see wave effects, or perhaps there's a parameter we don't yet understand. Or, maybe this CFS2-style line cannot have waves.I'm guessing you are essentially right, and the lake needs to be larger... spanning a few LOD13 areas.

Rhumba, Lee said use 1026, not 1080!!! ;)In the terraintextures.cfg look for the entries that use 'Effect=wavecontroller'. That should give you waves.I'm still confused why m$ changed the format for Fs2002 is the CFS2 format turns out to be fine. There should be a reason... In Fs2002 I can see waves on very narrow coastline strips, so size shouldn't matter too much...Cheers, Christian