I've noticed that some flight plans into UK major airports include a STAR while others don't.Am I wrong in my understanding that these inbound flights should have a STAR even though ATC may direct aircraft off it the depending on traffic conditions?For example, the Gatwick AIP Section 22 states that:IFR aircraft inbound to Gatwick London direct from the London FiR will be required to use the procedure via the Mayfield holding pattern detailed at...andAircraft inbound to London Gatwick via the airways system will be routed via the Standard Terminal Arrival Routes (STARs) detiled at...

Do you have any examples of where there are no stars?

Your post http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho..._id=10485&page=gives into HeathrowRoute of Flight HUEN..TORNO.UG656D.ATUGA.G656D.JUB.UB527D.MLK.UB612F.ALVOR.UB612F.ORNAT.B21.INDOT.UM622.GZO.UM732.CAR.UM733.KOPOR.UT426.DIMAL.UT420.ALESO..EGLL/0809According to the Heathrow chart (AD-2-EGLL-7-1) the STAR from UT420 is BIG 3B which is ALESO - TIGER - BIG VOR, where BIG VOR defines a hold.Another recent posthttp://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho..._id=10486&page=gives into GatwickN0457F340 ROGAT M869 LIE UM864 ROE UL983 CDA/N0403F360 UM611 ALS UN872 EEL UR1 PAM UL980 GORLO UL980 REFSO UY76 KOPUL TIMBA2E-EGKK0310 EGLLThis does include the TIMBA 2E STAR from UY76 which according to the AD-2 EGKK-7-1 is KOPUL - THANET - DET VOR - LARCK - TIMBA, where again TIMBA defines a hold.It was the difference between these two that led me to ask the question to seek clarification.

When filing Ats Plans you don't really need to add a Sid, or Star to the routing as they will just be assigned by ATC whether it be on the ground prior departure or just enroute prior to arrival. Adding the procedures to the beginning or end of the plan is up to user preference. ATC will know what STAR or SID the aircraft will be flying because of the small amount of SIDs or STARs that are at the first point of the STAR (last point of the ats plan) or the last point of the SID (usually first intersection on ats plan). For example when flying in Hong Kong (the plan is from an earlier post):N0496F330 BPK6F BPK UM185 CLN UL620 ARNEM UG9 ETEBO UL980 PENEK UM994 DRE UN858 LAVAR UR245 ASKIL/K0905S1010 B102 UK R11 FV G3 QL B365 BK B923 GUTAN/K0902S1010 A368 URL G3 AKB A360 DITKI/K0900S1110 A360 REVKI/K0912S1140 A460 KCA L888 SADAN Y1 OMBON B330 GYA A599 POU R473 SIERAAt the end of the plan there is no STAR because there is only one set of STARs for SIERA, maybe if there were 2 sets of STARs for SIERA then the carrier would just state their preference:N0455F157 BEKOL/K0945S0840 A461 YIN G586 QP B330JTG/K0939S0960 B330 SILUS/K0890S0960 B330 NIGOR/K0882S0960B330 UNWW A575 KD B200 XV/K0886S1060 B200 ZJ R22ADISA/K0889S1160 R22 KTL R30 SU B210 KR B964 KOLPI R30 SPBB141 RANVA/N0487F380 UP863 KOTAM UL990 LUPUR UM611 ALS UN872EEL UR1 PAM UL980 LOGAN LAM3AAs you can see in this VHHH-EGLL plan, the person that filed the plan stated the LAM3A as a preference to the BIG1E which may sometimes be used. That's my end of the stick anyway. Hope that's not too confusing!

Hi Patrick,are you sure out of LOGAN some planes fly the BIG1E arrival? Never heard that - only the LAM arrival.But if you know more than I do, please correct me ;)

I don't think we've resolved this yet.As far as SIDs are concerned, the UK MATS Part 1 states at Section 2 Chapter 1 Page 7:"At aerodromes where standard instrument departure routes (SIDs)are designated any filed flight plan which specifies a non standard route should be referred back to the originator for correction" - presumably to include a SID?Also, in your example, BIG 1E is not available to the operator in preference to LAM 3A. AD 2-EGLL-7-1 Note 6 states:"In order to provide airspace management flexibility during periods of congestion in the London TMA, STARS BIG 1E and BIG 3D are to facilitate the transfer of traffic to the BIG VOR which would normally route via LAM VOR. These STARs are for use only as directed by ATC and must not be used for flight planning services." There are also SIDs that are not available to operators. For example at Gatwick WIZAD has a note:"WIZAD SID is a tactical routing allocated by ATC to alleviate airspace congestion and may be offered at a late stage of taxying to aircraft normally allocated a DVR SID. Pilots unable to accept WIZAD SID when offered must inform ATC and will be re-allocated DVR SID. WIZAD SID must not be used for flight planning purposes." These implies that SIDs and STARs are used for flight planning purposes.The question still remains why some flight plans published here include STARs and others don't

No further answers?

Sorry for replying this early post, I just want to ask where did you get this flightplan from (I mean airlines), the date of flight and the flight time, thanks!

hi,i have an account on fboweb.com...in this site you can find all flights operating in UK area(departing,arriving and crossing UK)Matteo