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FS2004 Whinning Qualifications Please !!!!!!

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Fellow simmers .....I post occasionally, read the forums constantly, not only here but also at allnodesbusy.com and about a half dozen newsgroups. It seems most of the comments about the upcoming release ( o'man this wait is taking forever ) are reasonably positive but even at pre-release the whinners' are starting to creep out of their holes !! So when you ( and YOU know who you are ) are about to make a statement such as ........"It should be easy to just .... " re: fix de jour or "I would think several lines of code would be all that's needed to ..." or "If MS really cared it would not have been a problem to include blah, blah" and the ever popular " This sim is a piece of crap !!!" please consider my request, a simple one really.Much like many of us go to great lengths to describe their systems at the close of a post ( I do get really green with envy , so stop it !!! ) would it be to much to ask that the future "critical" poster please list their programming and or systems design experience at the close of the post. Everyone is certainly entitled to their opinion but if we knew what level and type of computer programming/design experience you had attained we could better relate to your post/concern.And lastly, if you don't understand what it takes to do really serious object oriented programming in a graphics/gaming environment you should really consider what you complain about before you click on post. Hope I have not offended anyone and I'm going to take my medication now .....Can't wait for FS2004 ( Ya, I'm a ringer and and ol' programmer !!! )JimBob

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LOL, good point JimBob! I personally like the unsugar coated version (shut the heck up unless you can do better) better, LOL ;-)From what I have read, most of my concerns have been addressed and still a few haven't, but complaining isn't going to help (might make me feel better, but I know you guys don't want to hear it! ;-)), I will just wait and see for myself, I still have FS2002 to keep me busy and enjoy!Regards, Michaelhttp://mysite.verizon.net/res052cd/mybannercva1.jpgCalVirAir International VAwww.calvirair.comCougar Mountain Helicopters & Aviationwww.cgrmtnhelos.com

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It's incredible what Microsoft can improve on in two or so year period. Most of the people that complain about the product are people whose first flight simulator was FS2000 or even FS2002. They don't see how lucky they are to be where we are today. Not that many years ago we had a simulator called Flight Simulator 95, and the Flight Simulator 98. Oh, they were the best thing ever to grace us. We were happy campers, but then with all the new advances in technology all the new guys hop onboard at the FS2000 station and want want want more more more. I'm only 15, and the largest reason I use Flight Simulator is for the sheer enjoyment of it while im not flying in real life. Obviously, there are many things missing from real life, and theres a good chance a portion of people in here have never seen their community from the air, or piloted an aircraft. So we get complaints. The dynamics are wrong, the building should be a mile up the road. My house isn't there... The wing is a bit too long, the lights are in the wrong place, the engine is overpowered/underpowered, the struts are one inch too thick, the sky it too dark at night. The list goes on and on. Microsoft covers the whole world. Two Years. 24,000+ (Twenty Four Thousand+) airports, roads, rivers, lakes, oceans, cities, etc etc etc. Two years. We should be grateful. $55 bucks... thats all, for a sim that covers so much. I think we owe the makers much more respect and gratitude than some of us currently do. Well. I hope I didn't put any of you to sleep. If any of you havent piloted an aircraft- I suggest you visitwww.beapilot.comand make an appointment as soon as possible. As soon as you see what its really likew to fly, new horizons will open and you will see how truely lucky we are to be where we are right now.Blue Skies Everyone,Jason :-wave

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You forgot MS Flightsim 5.0 and even older Unix flight simulators!!

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actully you are a whiner too, because you whine about whiners...I am sickened about all these whiny posts... just freaking whining....OK NOW I WHINE TOO... what is the damn point of this post anyway?...errr I actually agree with you that these forums are full ofjunk posts...

future "critical" poster please list their programming and or systems design experience at the close of the post
actually that would be fine....blah

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At first I had my reserves about COF, but the more I see it the more I am interested. I might just purchase it and keep FS2002 loaded just in case. Plus it might make transfering files easier, but I have yet to see how that is going to work. Anyway, I agree! don't complain until you get your hands on it and know all the facts. Having worked on games before, I know all the hard work that goes into it. I have great respect for those who are willing to have sleepless nights writing code, modeling objects, and testing the games.3D artist and graphic designerplus all my computer specifications.....

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Well said. Most of these people (and I use the term loosely...) have never written a "hello world" program let alone a complex application yet they know that something will take only a few lines of code to fix or something else should be patched immediately (without ever understanding what patches are there for...).This attitude is in effect a terrible insult towards all computer programmers, even if the whiners think they're doing the world a service.How many of them have spent hours or days looking over screens of hexadecimal output from a debugger to find out why some burried functioncall doesn't produce the result you expect?How many have even tried to write their own computer programs (instead of looking on the web for something to turn in as their own for their assignments)?How many have ever created anything that a customer was satisfied with?How many have been involved in actual commercial release cycles, including patches and feature updates?Not a lot, if any. Those who have done all that KNOW that Microsoft is doing a lot of good work. They may not be perfect, but neither are we. They may make mistakes (even critical ones), but so do we.They may not always be able to fix your pet problem, usually simply because the fix would either take too long for the seriousness of the problem, because it's no problem at all (but you misunderstanding the software and how it workd), or because the only possible fix would break something else that would be worse.I've been there, I've done that.I've worked for years in software development, I know how it all works. I know why there was no patch for FS2002, I know why some features were left incomplete. I know how the development team will have hated not being able to complete those features and fix those problems but at the same time be happy to work on something else (FS2004 that is).I know all that because I've done it, I've been in their shoes and sat on their workstations. It may have been other projects, other companies, but the people are the same and they think and feel the same.They are us, software developers of the real world rather than academics and hobyists (however good they may be, they can't know the way the real world works because they're isolated from deadlines, budget restrictions and marketing departments making unrealistic promises to customers).

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2nd that.I am a programmer, have been for some time. I think the amount of ground covered in flight simulator over the last 6 years is quite good considering the scope. Also, I don't ever remember loading a patch for FS2002, and I've been running it for 2 years with no problems. In the commercial world, that's a pretty good achievement.Also, what is a "whinner" ? is that the opposite of a "looser" ?

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