Is that a bad thing? It doesn't matter what I fly, b747, 737, hercules, fighter jet, I still double-hop when coming in to land (back wheels touch down and then float up and touch down again).Am I doing something wrong in my technique or is there nothing wrong about that type of landing? Just wondering. Thanks!

Usually means you are coming down too fast, i.e. your vertical airspeed is too high. This is through having too high an airspeed (I think) or flaring too much, too early and with too low speed.We've all done it though!

Yeah, you're coming in too fast. What speed are you usually landing at? Basically you want to be pretty near the full-flaps stall speed for whatever aircraft you are flying.

you should also keep the flare minimal in a big jet. A hard landing is better than a bounce, especially in windy conditions.- Oyvind

I find that worrying about bouncing the landing is often the cause! Sometimes I will flare too much and too early, thus stalling and bringing in the aircraft in too hard. The timing of the flare is critical. The best thing is to practice, especially doing patterns. Start with a small aircraft like the Cessna 172, and work your way up.

One thing I find helpful is proper flaps deployment. Without deploying flaps, you find that you lose sight of the runway very early in the approach. As a result, you are tempted to pitch down to keep sight of the runway, and as a result come in too hot. Flaps allow you to lower your attitude during approach without the increase in speed due to the increased drag.The online lessons provide a good tutorial that although applies primarily to the props, works fairly well on the jets.It's the idea that "pitch" controls speed, while the "thottle" controls altitude. Although that sounds counter-intuitive to those of us who drive automobiles, the theory is pretty sound. As you approach, set up a descent rate of approx 700 FPM. (I believe this is usually the standard for glide path. Then set your pitch. Your pitch should be such that you get a clear view of the runway during the majority of the approach. You will lose sight of the runway eventually, but if all goes well, that will be well after you are sure you have passed over the threshold. If you begin sinking too much, don't intuively pull back the stick, but rather provide more throttle. If you then begin to descend too shallow, don't nose down, which will drive up airspeed, keep the same pitch, and lower your throttle.As you deploy flaps, the aircraft will want to climb, since flap deployement will cause the airplane to start to climb, lower the throttles to bring the descent rate back to within the glide path.Remember, always keep your pitch constant, and use the throttles to control your descent rate. As you perform your flare, what you are esentially doing is stalling out the plane. So if you have maintained proper pitch, and throttle settings on the way down, once you have passed over the runway threshold, pull back on the stick, slightly, and cut the throttles. This will bleed speed,and cause the aircraft to stall just a couple of feet before the wheels touch.When you are practicing, don't be concerned with "Where" on the runway you make contact. Use a LONG runway. The first couple of times I was practicing, I ended up eating up half the runway before my wheels touched down. Just try and get the feel. As you get used to it, you will remember to perform the steps sooner, so that you will be able to eventually have everything set for a smooth touchdown in the "zone".Rod Machado in the lessons basically calls this 'flying' the airplane into the ground. He comments that when we land, we forget to "fly the plane" and as a result, either stall it out, or bang our wheels into the pavement.Ideally, your stick shaker, and stall horn should sound about the same time you hit the tarmac. Once the rear wheels are firm on the ground, let your nose drop and once the front wheels hit, reverse thrust and deploy spoilers (assuming you have armed them first).Hope this helps. It takes practice, but once you get the hang of it, it becomes second nature.Once you have mastered, that, then move into crosswind landings. Those still give me shivers.....

That's good advice, and certainly one school of doing things. I have always used pitch for altitude and power for airspeed. The opposite of what the previous poster told you. Confusing, eh? :> I find my method works much better in GA as no one wants you on a really long final trying to establish your approach path. This type of approach hogs a lot of the available airspace and could lead to others having to extend their downwind or go around while you are lining things up. Will is completely right. Pitching for airspeed and throttling for altitude is the only method in flying large aircraft as you need long established finals to properly set things up. As a GA pilot, you want to get on the ground under control in a timely manner in order to be courteous to others. Establish your plan on the downwind, keep your speed down, extend gear and first flaps abeam the numbers on the downwind. As you turn base(the runway is behind your left/right shoulder), begin a controlled descent and extend the next notch of flaps. Reduce throttle to 1500 RPM in the 172 and use the throttle to maintain speed as you keep your descent rate between -500/-700 fpm. As you roll out on final, maintain the optimal descent rate using your visual cues, and maintain the desired airspeed using the throttle. If your speed is where it should be, you should cut throttle as you cross the threshold, hold your pitch, and begin to transition to flare about 20 feet. Hold the flare 2 feet from the ground as long as you can and the plane will stall out and not bounce if you are positioned correctly.For jets and heavies, the best approach is the method described by Will. For GA, mine is your best bet. IMHOBest! Scott N7115G

>That's good advice, and certainly one school of doing things.> I have always used pitch for altitude and power for airspeed.> The opposite of what the previous poster told you. >Confusing, eh? :> One of the great arguments of aviation, isn't it.....?Both are true depending what's going on. And people will argue several pages worth, as happened a year or so ago on these forums. Now if I'm in the Cessna 172 with power pulled back for a descent; the drop flaps to steepen my descent rate & the nose pitches up........I'll push forward on the yoke to push it down again.As to the cockpit being in my face with certain approaches; I'll either raise my seat in VC with shift enter, or perhaps get rid of a 2D panel altogether with the W key, and use readouts from the mini-panel or shift Z. Note: Some airplanes pitch up with flaps, some down, and some none at all.L.Adamson>>I find my method works much better in GA as no one wants you>on a really long final trying to establish your approach path.> This type of approach hogs a lot of the available airspace>and could lead to others having to extend their downwind or go>around while you are lining things up. >>Will is completely right. Pitching for airspeed and>throttling for altitude is the only method in flying large>aircraft as you need long established finals to properly set>things up. >>As a GA pilot, you want to get on the ground under control in>a timely manner in order to be courteous to others. Establish>your plan on the downwind, keep your speed down, extend gear>and first flaps abeam the numbers on the downwind. As you>turn base(the runway is behind your left/right shoulder),>begin a controlled descent and extend the next notch of flaps.> Reduce throttle to 1500 RPM in the 172 and use the throttle>to maintain speed as you keep your descent rate between>-500/-700 fpm. As you roll out on final, maintain the optimal>descent rate using your visual cues, and maintain the desired>airspeed using the throttle. If your speed is where it should>be, you should cut throttle as you cross the threshold, hold>your pitch, and begin to transition to flare about 20 feet. >Hold the flare 2 feet from the ground as long as you can and>the plane will stall out and not bounce if you are positioned>correctly.>>For jets and heavies, the best approach is the method>described by Will. For GA, mine is your best bet. IMHO>>Best! >>Scott N7115G

Hi Alex,Try the Captain Sim Yak-3. :-saeJust little joke there... hehe. If you can land the CS Yak-3 without bouncing you'll be able to land anything! :-lolCheers,Jim

Will and everybody, thanks for your advice.So are my type of landings dangerous or something? Because I (knock on wood) haven't crashed any airplane I've flown in months. From the CS 727, pmdg 737, default 747 with updated flight dynamics, and airbuses and others. I always use real weather and have flown in many crosswind landings... with full realism settings. So am I just lucky because the sim doesn't model real life correctly? Can I get any add-ons that add to the realism more? I've heard of a force feedback payware that does something to the trim to make the birds act correctly when trimming. Anybody use this and can comment? Thanks!Ooops and sorry that should read ONE-hop, not double hop. Basically the airplane comes down on the main gear, floats up for a second, then touches down again and everythings normal.

Scott:"Reduce throttle to 1500 RPM in the 172 and use the throttle to maintain speed as you keep your descent rate between -500/-700 fpm."I don't think you'll find many RW CFI's teaching that. The normal practice is to use pitch to keep the speed right, and the throttle to stay on the glide path.Incidentally, as to the 'right' glide path, there's an article in this months AOPA magazine about the flying the VASI slope in GA aircraft. As it pointed out, the VASI glide slope is much shallower than a light planes power-off glide capability. Therefore, if you "fly down the lights" and lose the engine on final, you're not going to make the runway. They advise that you should come in at at least a high enough angle that if the mixer does stop, you can still glide to the threshold.Richard

My favourite tip - courtesy of Anthony Woodwood's superb book about microlight flying in the UK:The secret of landing is..."try not to land". Ie flare as low as possible by covering the runway ahead of you with the nose of the plane, cut the power and hold off as long as you can. HTH

Scott:"Reduce throttle to 1500 RPM in the 172 and use the throttle to maintain speed as you keep your descent rate between -500/-700 fpm."I don't think you'll find many RW CFI's teaching that. The normal practice is to use pitch to keep the speed right, and the throttle to stay on the glide path.--Actually I have been taught all the methods prescribed by several CFI's. If everyone uses the "traditional" approach, people would be lined up on long finals clogging the cue to final, just like I said. I prefer my method to be more courteous to other pilots in the pattern. I haven't bend a plane or prop yet and can land within 200 feet of my intended touchdown zone.Incidentally, as to the 'right' glide path, there's an article in this months AOPA magazine about the flying the VASI slope in GA aircraft. As it pointed out, the VASI glide slope is much shallower than a light planes power-off glide capability. Therefore, if you "fly down the lights" and lose the engine on final, you're not going to make the runway. They advise that you should come in at at least a high enough angle that if the mixer does stop, you can still glide to the threshold.Richard--Sure, I agree and do practice that in my own plane, however, to add that tidbit would be a bit of overkill for the original posters question. I appreciate the addition, but I didn't feel it was needed in my original post. Glad to hear we have a lot of knowledgeable pilots and posters here to help everyone along. :>

Something I may have missed in reading the above posts is the spoilers that the heavies have. The heavies land at a higher speed above stall than the GA ac do. They can do this and not hop by use of the auto-armed-spoilers. These spoilers deploy to reduce lift when sufficient pressure rests on the main gear. When the spoilers deploy the lift over the wing is reduced to the point that the ac will not float back up due to lift in ground effect.Check to be sure you are arming your spoilers before landing the heavies and business jets.If you are already doing this then the info in the above posts should help with the soft(er) landings.I fly RL C172's and Pipers and can land softly in RL but often bounce my simulator landings due to the lack of seat-of-the-pants feeling in sims.practice, practice, practice :)

>I fly RL C172's and Pipers and can land softly in RL but often>bounce my simulator landings due to the lack of>seat-of-the-pants feeling in sims.>Now....... get this sim in VC mode with seat raised to see the runway & around a .56 zoom level for added peripheral vision. And just hold it off!! At least I can get non-bounce landings 90% of the time! :)L.Adamson