A/T During Flare

[vr-pilot 11]

Hi folks!

Very interesting thread in many aspects. Learned a lot! THX! B) 

 

 

After some practice, I can already tell my landings are getting much better. Right on the piano keys B). Thanks for all the help gentlemen! 

 

If you are landing on a RWY with ILS and VASI/VAPI you should actually aim the TDZ (TouchDown Zone) markings. The "piano keys" are usually the threshold markings which is the earliest point of your touchdown regarding the LDA (Landing Distance Available).

 

 

 

 

This is the only time the A/T will automatically turn on.

 

Not the safest, but I love aircraft with the proper mix of manual and automation. The DC10 was perfect with this mix. When ever the jet did something strange, a couple of clicks and you are in full control.

 

+1

"Automation welfare misbelief" is really a "problematic" topic.

On the "busses"  - FD off -  might leave you without A/T "surprisingly" and on the T7 - FD on - can engage A/T "unexpectedly"...

So I very much support your argumentation of "proper mix of manual and automation".

 

Always happy landings,

Claus

 

 

[tecboy99 0]

If you are landing on a RWY with ILS and VASI/VAPI you should actually aim the TDZ (TouchDown Zone) markings. The "piano keys" are usually the threshold markings which is the earliest point of your touchdown regarding the LDA (Landing Distance Available).

 

I thought the "Piano Keys" were the two blocks at the beginning of the touchdown zone.

 

Edit--

 

As showed here: http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/middle/8/3/0/1722038.jpg

[vr-pilot 11]

 

 

I thought the "Piano Keys" were the two blocks at the beginning of the touchdown zone.

 

I think the "piano keys" are the "zebra crossing" right behind the threshold line...

In Europe the TDZ markings are actually two big filled rectangles left and right of the center line.

[tecboy99 0]

I think the "piano keys" are the "zebra crossing" right behind the threshold line...

In Europe the TDZ markings are actually two big filled rectangles left and right of the center line.

 

They are too in the U.S. Right?

 

Example -- Runway 35 In MSP

 

EX: http://tinyurl.com/leasp28

[vr-pilot 11]

 

 

They are too in the U.S. Right?

 

Thanks for the links. I just also took a look at different graphics and fotos.

The "two big filled rectangles left and right of the center line" are the "aiming point markings". The additional "zebra style types" define the whole TDZ.

But which are now the "real piano keys"; I have no idea.

Anyone else?

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Guys, the piano keys are the things that look like...well...piano keys at the very ends of the runway...

 

That's why they're called piano keys...

[vr-pilot 11]

That's why they're called piano keys...

 

THX! But mostly not at the VERY end of the RWYs because there are often overrun sections!  :rolleyes:

 

Edit: and/or displaced thresholds (just kidding)

[Fabo 213]

Overran sections are not a part of the runway (as far as pilot is concerned). Pretty much same can be said for displaced threshold, if you are landing. Displaced threshold can be a part of the runway, if you are departing.

[vr-pilot 11]

If I may quote myself:

 

If you are landing on a RWY with ILS and VASI/VAPI you should actually aim the TDZ (TouchDown Zone) markings. The "piano keys" are usually the threshold markings which is the earliest point of your touchdown regarding the LDA (Landing Distance Available).

 

That was a presumption why topic starter tecboy99 (Jim) could have had problems following the FD on an ILS final while trying to touch down on what he called the "piano keys".

 

Overran sections are not a part of the runway (as far as pilot is concerned). Pretty much same can be said for displaced threshold, if you are landing. Displaced threshold can be a part of the runway, if you are departing.

 

Overrun sections, actually called "stopways", can be a part of the runway (and even can be used for takeoff computations) as long as the stopway structure complies with the definition of runway regularities. (See FAA AC 150/5300-13A.) Those stopways can be treated equal to displaced thresholds considering takeoff run availability (TORA). So called "clearways" define the takeoff distance availability (TODA) and wrap the runway object as "first or final instance".

So "the piano keys" do not define the beginning or the end of the runway, they just define the earliest touch down point in terms of landing distance available LDA.  :blink:

 

Greetings,

Claus

[Fabo 213]

Fair enough, Claus!