Is Aerofly FS4 worth buying?

[Kalnon 160]

Hello, I am a huge flight simulation enthusiast and I've used many flight simulators (and still do) including FS9, FSX, P3Dv5, MSFS, X-Plane 11 & X-Plane 12 as well as combat flight simulators.  The only "major" flight simulator that I have yet to try is Aerofly FS4 and I was hoping to get some opinions on it as well as answers to some questions about it.  I've had a difficult time finding all the information I want to know about it so I don't know a lot.

I would greatly appreciate any opinions anyone wants to share about the simulator and what they think about it.

Questions I have:

1. How much of the world has good scenery to fly over?  I ask because I've read that the only places there are to fly with scenery is the east and west coast of the U.S. and part of Europe and that's it.  I read the rest of the world just has no scenery at all.

2. How good are the aircraft that come with the sim, including the extra aircraft DLC package sold separately on Steam?  Are they modeled well, do they look ok, do they fly well?

3. How are the physics and aircraft performance?  Do they fly realistically and by the numbers, or close to it?

4. Is engine management for the aircraft modeled?

5. Are the cockpits clickable?  I read somewhere that they are not and if that's true, that's a big dealbreaker for me.

6. What kind of navigation systems do the aircraft use?  For example, good old radio navigation, Garmin units (for smaller aircraft) or full fledged FMC's/MCDU's (for airliners) or something in between?

7. How is flight planning done in the sim?

8. Is there any 3rd party add-on freeware and payware for Aerofly FS4?  And if so, where do I find it all?

I would also very much appreciate it if anyone has anything else they would like to mention about the sim, like other features, things I might not know or have thought of or any thoughts people may have on it.  I just need to know what I'm getting with this sim and if it's worth my time and money to try it.

Thanks

 

[Kalnon 160]

 I guess it's not... [crickets chirping]

[HiFlyer 9,363]

On 11/1/2023 at 6:08 AM, Kalnon said:

 I guess it's not... [crickets chirping]

Well.....

It's a kind of fraught question to answer.

In a forum where even something as awesome as Microsoft Flight Simulator gets regularly trashed, saying anything good about Aerofly is like chumming the water and asking for trouble.

The best place to ask would be on the Aerofly forum. Maybe reddit, etc.

That being said, I myself use and enjoy Aerofly, primarily because of its still unsurpassed VR clarity and fluidity (and working vr hands!), as well as the well-kept-secret that its planes/avionics are in fact surprisingly complete and detailed for such an underrated sim.

I'm more of a glass-half-full than a glass-half empty guy.

Not long ago, I posted a link to what I thought was a pretty even handed and honest video.

Also:

Here is a link to the Aerofly forum

 

[SSF 11]

On 10/30/2023 at 5:29 PM, Kalnon said:

Hello, I am a huge flight simulation enthusiast and I've used many flight simulators (and still do) including FS9, FSX, P3Dv5, MSFS, X-Plane 11 & X-Plane 12 as well as combat flight simulators.  The only "major" flight simulator that I have yet to try is Aerofly FS4 and I was hoping to get some opinions on it as well as answers to some questions about it.  I've had a difficult time finding all the information I want to know about it so I don't know a lot.

I would greatly appreciate any opinions anyone wants to share about the simulator and what they think about it.

Questions I have:

1. How much of the world has good scenery to fly over?  I ask because I've read that the only places there are to fly with scenery is the east and west coast of the U.S. and part of Europe and that's it.  I read the rest of the world just has no scenery at all.

2. How good are the aircraft that come with the sim, including the extra aircraft DLC package sold separately on Steam?  Are they modeled well, do they look ok, do they fly well?

3. How are the physics and aircraft performance?  Do they fly realistically and by the numbers, or close to it?

4. Is engine management for the aircraft modeled?

5. Are the cockpits clickable?  I read somewhere that they are not and if that's true, that's a big dealbreaker for me.

6. What kind of navigation systems do the aircraft use?  For example, good old radio navigation, Garmin units (for smaller aircraft) or full fledged FMC's/MCDU's (for airliners) or something in between?

7. How is flight planning done in the sim?

8. Is there any 3rd party add-on freeware and payware for Aerofly FS4?  And if so, where do I find it all?

I would also very much appreciate it if anyone has anything else they would like to mention about the sim, like other features, things I might not know or have thought of or any thoughts people may have on it.  I just need to know what I'm getting with this sim and if it's worth my time and money to try it.

Thanks

 

Don't waste your time and money on it
But you can test it (by buying on steam) and give up the purchase. Steam does the refund (just follow Steam's rules).

[Kalnon 160]

Thank you both for the replies, I really appreciate it.  @HiFlyer thanks for the advice, I will check out the official forum.   I read that the VR is awesome in Aerofly FS4 too.  I also read that the physics are really good which is very high on my priority list when it comes to flight simulators.

I think what I will do is wait for it to go on sale during the end of year sales on Steam so I can get a healthy discount.  I tried every other "real" flight simulator made since 2002 except for this one so I am still curious...

[Grisu 23]

From my experience with Aerofly over almost ten years I can say: No, it's not worth to buy, and it's not worth the hassle to wait years and years and years till IPACS has improved something substantially.

Unless you are totally in flying tubeliners 30.000 feet above weather conditions, unless you are a huge fan of VR or if you want to achieve 60 fps under any cricumstances, than maybe it's something for you.

E.g. I've payed some great payware sceneries for Aerofly FS 2, like Himalaya Extreme by Aerosoft or LOWI by ORBX (lowi came out in 2017 under the direction of Jarrad Marshal).  These great sceneries are still not updated for Aeerofly FS 4, which is a big loss and grieve for me.

I think even JustFlight still hasn't updated one of their great addons from AFS2 to AFS4.  The developers refuse to go on with IPACS and AFS4, which I can fully understand.

I would deny further cooperation with IPACS too if I would have developed payware for AFS2; a crucial point which I don't want do spread out more than necessary on avsim. Let's say, my own experiences with IPACS on their main site were not the best in the past.

But the good thing is, that we as customers can make our own decissions to buy something or not to buy, depending on our own lessons we've learned.

Hope this helps.

All the best 😉

[Kalnon 160]

9 hours ago, Grisu said:

From my experience with Aerofly over almost ten years I can say: No, it's not worth to buy, and it's not worth the hassle to wait years and years and years till IPACS has improved something substantially.

Unless you are totally in flying tubeliners 30.000 feet above weather conditions, unless you are a huge fan of VR or if you want to achieve 60 fps under any cricumstances, than maybe it's something for you.

E.g. I've payed some great payware sceneries for Aerofly FS 2, like Himalaya Extreme by Aerosoft or LOWI by ORBX (lowi came out in 2017 under the direction of Jarrad Marshal).  These great sceneries are still not updated for Aeerofly FS 4, which is a big loss and grieve for me.

I think even JustFlight still hasn't updated one of their great addons from AFS2 to AFS4.  The developers refuse to go on with IPACS and AFS4, which I can fully understand.

I would deny further cooperation with IPACS too if I would have developed payware for AFS2; a crucial point which I don't want do spread out more than necessary on avsim. Let's say, my own experiences with IPACS on their main site were not the best in the past.

But the good thing is, that we as customers can make our own decissions to buy something or not to buy, depending on our own lessons we've learned.

Hope this helps.

All the best 😉

Thank you, I appreciate you input.  It is on sale right now, the one time of year it does go on sale, and I was really considering it.  One of the reasons I haven't bought it yet is because, like you mentioned, there's no 3rd party development scene which is really disappointing.  One reason I do want to try it though is because I've read it has very accurate flight modelling which is a very important aspect to me.  I guess I still can't decide but after your comments, I'm leaning towards no.

[Grisu 23]

16 hours ago, Kalnon said:

Thank you, I appreciate you input.  It is on sale right now, the one time of year it does go on sale, and I was really considering it.  One of the reasons I haven't bought it yet is because, like you mentioned, there's no 3rd party development scene which is really disappointing.  One reason I do want to try it though is because I've read it has very accurate flight modelling which is a very important aspect to me.  I guess I still can't decide but after your comments, I'm leaning towards no.

Thank you for your kind worlds.  Another point I want do highlight, which I haven't mentioned before and which become more important in Aerofly the more often you fly this sim (an experience which I've made for myself):

Because of the total lack of dynamic weather (which is still not implemented in AFS4), always the same looking clouds, the same date, only on summer day-season (still no seasons in AFS4, even not mentioned by the developers), no dynamic 3D water, blurrry textures close above the ground (which gives me the most headache as a former helicopter pilot) -  the overall look and seceneries of the sim become very boring and stale very soon.

Yes, the flight dynamics are good, but not every aricraft is great.

• Extra300 - outstanding good flight physics.
• Gliders - superb.
• Pitts Special - not so great, pretty basic.
• Fighter Jets - e.g.  the F/A-18 vs. F-15 behave almost the same; boring, not challenging, pretty basic. FBW seem to rule forever 😂.
• Tubeliner - can't tell because I'm not interested in these.
• Helicopters ! - debatable; e.g. the R22 even in professional flight mode flys way too easy. Their first rendition of the R22's flight model was really top notch, world class. Months later they have tamed and "fixed" it too much; probably because too many virtual pilots and users of their mobile app were flying the R22 without proper controls.

 

Good luck !

[Kalnon 160]

13 hours ago, Grisu said:

Thank you for your kind worlds.  Another point I want do highlight, which I haven't mentioned before and which become more important in Aerofly the more often you fly this sim (an experience which I've made for myself):

Because of the total lack of dynamic weather (which is still not implemented in AFS4), always the same looking clouds, the same date, only on summer day-season (still no seasons in AFS4, even not mentioned by the developers), no dynamic 3D water, blurrry textures close above the ground (which gives me the most headache as a former helicopter pilot) -  the overall look and seceneries of the sim become very boring and stale very soon.

Yes, the flight dynamics are good, but not every aricraft is great.

• Extra300 - outstanding good flight physics.
• Gliders - superb.
• Pitts Special - not so great, pretty basic.
• Fighter Jets - e.g.  the F/A-18 vs. F-15 behave almost the same; boring, not challenging, pretty basic. FBW seem to rule forever 😂.
• Tubeliner - can't tell because I'm not interested in these.
• Helicopters ! - debatable; e.g. the R22 even in professional flight mode flys way too easy. Their first rendition of the R22's flight model was really top notch, world class. Months later they have tamed and "fixed" it too much; probably because too many virtual pilots and users of their mobile app were flying the R22 without proper controls.

 

Good luck !

After reading this post I am definitely going to pass then.  No dynamic weather, no seasons and blurry textures, no thanks.  Also the flight modeling doesn't seem quite as good as I thought then.  I do like flying realistic helicopters.  For X-Plane I have a few that are awesome plus I have the Huey for DCS World and it's fantastic to fly.

I'll keep spending my money on X-Plane and P3D instead, those are my go to sims right now, I really enjoy them both for different reasons.  I also use MSFS once in a while when I don't care about flight models and I just want to see pretty scenery 😁

[Grisu 23]

[Grisu 23]

Well Kalnon, if you are into helicopters you'll be surprised that there exists a dedicated helicopter-simulator from IPACS/Aerofly.  Internally IPACS called it Aerofly FS 3 (yes, there is a version 3 between version 2 and todays version 4); it's software engine is based on Aerofly FS 2 solely developed by IPACS.

The pictures as shown in my post before and in this one are exclusively from Aerofly FS 3.

But it is sold for professional purpose only.  It's training helicopter simulator is even certified by EASA (European Union Aviation Safety Agency).

The company was called VRM Switzerland first, later on they've renamed themselves to Loft Dynamics .

See the article from Helisimmer here:

EASA certifies VRM Switzerland’s VR training system for pilot training, using Aerofly FS2

My biggest grieves with Aerofly will be and forever:

• Although all the other helicopters we already know from AFS2, like the R22 and H145, are equally represented in AFS3 too, there is still no AS350 (nowadays called H125) in our desktop version, not in AFS2 and still not in AFS4.
• And you can find the sling loading functionality ONLY in their professional version (AFS3); which is a big shame and no go for me personally.

To me after so many years of waiting for new features and observing the selling policy of IPACS, it has become clear:

1. For the "ordinary" consumer market they have strictly focused on Airliners and features, more Airliners, and more Airliners; with tons of autogen objects on the ground (which look everywhere the same in the world.  No distinguished autogen differences within different world regions; the houses in e.g. Palm Springs, Europe, Africa look everywhere the same 🤥 .  Not only in AFS2 but in AFS4 too.)
2. Their main selling product on consumer market seems to be their mobile app; development was optimized to maintain the app first, desktop version second.
3. Their helicopter simulator and new, dedicated helicopter features are sold for professional purpose ONLY and will never advent us, the ordinary consumers of e.g steam.

In the video links below you can find some video footage of AFS3's sling loading capabilities:

Opportunity for Helicopter Operators to improve their quality in Sling Load Operations

Flying sling load in Zermatt

 

Hope this helps too 😉

The more information someone has, the better it becomes to make right decissions.

All the best.

[Ray Proudfoot 8,980]

@Grisu, all new members require their first few posts to be approved by an AvSim staff member before they become visible.

I’ve hidden your second post as it was a duplicate of the first. Depending on when you post it may take a little time before a moderator sees it.

[Kalnon 160]

13 hours ago, Grisu said:

Well Kalnon, if you are into helicopters you'll be surprised that there exists a dedicated helicopter-simulator from IPACS/Aerofly.  Internally IPACS called it Aerofly FS 3 (yes, there is a version 3 between version 2 and todays version 4); it's software engine is based on Aerofly FS 2 solely developed by IPACS.

The pictures as shown in my post before and in this one are exclusively from Aerofly FS 3.

But it is sold for professional purpose only.  It's training helicopter simulator is even certified by EASA (European Union Aviation Safety Agency).

The company was called VRM Switzerland first, later on they've renamed themselves to Loft Dynamics .

See the article from Helisimmer here:

EASA certifies VRM Switzerland’s VR training system for pilot training, using Aerofly FS2

My biggest grieves with Aerofly will be and forever:

• Although all the other helicopters we already know from AFS2, like the R22 and H145, are equally represented in AFS3 too, there is still no AS350 (nowadays called H125) in our desktop version, not in AFS2 and still not in AFS4.
• And you can find the sling loading functionality ONLY in their professional version (AFS3); which is a big shame and no go for me personally.

To me after so many years of waiting for new features and observing the selling policy of IPACS, it has become clear:

1. For the "ordinary" consumer market they have strictly focused on Airliners and features, more Airliners, and more Airliners; with tons of autogen objects on the ground (which look everywhere the same in the world.  No distinguished autogen differences within different world regions; the houses in e.g. Palm Springs, Europe, Africa look everywhere the same 🤥 .  Not only in AFS2 but in AFS4 too.)
2. Their main selling product on consumer market seems to be their mobile app; development was optimized to maintain the app first, desktop version second.
3. Their helicopter simulator and new, dedicated helicopter features are sold for professional purpose ONLY and will never advent us, the ordinary consumers of e.g steam.

In the video links below you can find some video footage of AFS3's sling loading capabilities:

Opportunity for Helicopter Operators to improve their quality in Sling Load Operations

Flying sling load in Zermatt

Hope this helps too 😉

The more information someone has, the better it becomes to make right decissions.

All the best.

That is very interesting, I always wondered why I never heard of AFS3, now I know why.  I'm guessing the helicopter flight dynamics are significantly improved for ASF3 then if it's for professional training.  It's sad they never made it available for consumer use because I would be very interested in that.

For helicopters, X-Plane 12 is a fantastic alternative, it has a new updated physics engine (compared to XP11) that allows helicopters to fly very realistic, better than any other simulator for helicopters, with the exception of DCS World but XP12 has finally caught up with DCS as far as helicopter physics/flight dynamics in my opinion.  XP11 was close but XP12 is even better and for the X-Plane platform, there's some really interesting and well made 3rd party helicopters to choose from, including an AS350/H145 and more models to come as 3rd party developers continue to make new ones.

As for your other gripes about Aerofly, they are totally legitimate, I enjoy flying airliners too sometimes but more often I prefer VFR flying in GA aircraft.  I like lot's of autogen in my flight simulator since I enjoy VFR flying but I don't want it all to look the same, that would destroy any sense of immersion for me.

For X-Plane there's a freeware developer called SimHeaven that has completely overhauled the X-Plane autogen (for both XP11 & 12), you can download their autogen packages for free (just be aware they are huge packages and take time to download and install) and they cover the entire planet.  The best thing about SimHeaven autogen is there is a lot more details and variation in how the buildings look and it also mimics real world placement and designs of all buildings in the world.

For example, I grew up in a small town in northern Wisconsin and when I fly there in X-Plane with default autogen, it's virtually devoid of any buildings, but when I fly there using SimHeaven autogen, every building is there and in their correct locations.  Even the high school building I went to as a kid is there and it looks just like the real school, I have no idea how they did that but it's amazing.

Also for P3D, there's texture packages you can get that greatly improve the look and variations of the autogen buildings and there's plenty of 3rd party cityscape scenery's as well as high quality scenery and photoscenery packages that all come with great looking custom autogen.

Thanks for all your input regarding Aerofly FS, I've learned a lot about it from your posts and I appreciate it.

[Grisu 23]

@ Kalnon:  Thank's a lot for your useful inputs and your kind worlds ❤️. I'm glad that I could help you !!!  Best wishes across the pond 😄 .

@ Ray Proudfoot:  Thank you for your clarification; now I know it better.  You guys from AVSIM are awesome; thank you for helping to maintain this wonderful site.  It helped me over many years to get useful informations about our beloved hobby, although the language barrier is not always easy to me 😉.

[HiFlyer 9,363]

On 11/27/2023 at 11:42 PM, Kalnon said:

I'll keep spending my money on X-Plane and P3D instead, those are my go to sims right now, I really enjoy them both for different reasons.  I also use MSFS once in a while when I don't care about flight models and I just want to see pretty scenery 😁

I like Aerofly for when I want to fly in super-clear and super-fast VR that just works, in planes that are not bad, though not perfect.

I find it relaxing to just fly in a headset, in an actually fairly pretty environment (with the mentioned caveats) without frowning after a while and wondering what could be causing the stuttering (or whatever) his time.

I also like that you can start and be flying in literally seconds rather than waiting for however long in all my other sims (I have pretty much all of them and each has its individual charms)

The decision is yours, of course: