PNL system file question

[Fall_guy 1]

Hi Guys,Could someone please explain a couple of things to me regarding the system data. The first questions relate to the PNL file.1) What does the figures relate to which directly follow the bmp reference file. (This is NOT the pbg file size reference as specified in )Eg.efis.SWT.pbg552) Could someone please explain how exactly the figures relate. I've tried to figure them out, but can't seem to make sence of them. Do these relate to X,Y,Z, positioning in anyway?. What is the start point of the rectangle??Eg. ---- begin ---- ---- rect ---- 5 33 24 52Sorry to be a pain Guys.......... but these are beginning to hold me up.Thanks for your TimeregardsJohn

[Roger Mazengarb 0]

G'day John,Not sure about 1. Could be the number of frames(ie. switch positions 5 clockwise and 5 anticlockwise) on the switch but that's just a guess.2. this gives the screen x,y co-ordinates of the upper left and lower right corners of the rectangle.ie. (5,33) and (24,52)x is horizontaly is vertical(0,0) is the top left corner of the screen.I've done heaps of these when doing the glass cockpit for the B717.Cheers,Roger @YSSY

[Fall_guy 1]

Hi Roger,Can you just take a quick peek at the attached, just to make sure I've got this right.Bye the way what is the purpose of these Rectangles (When and how would you use them??.) Thanks Mate I really do appreciate it.John

[Guest CaptainJ]

Hmmm I would say 5 stands for the lenghte of the image (switch etc.)33 the height of the image24 the x coordinate52 the y coordinateBut I am not sure! Maybe Alex or someone else can verify this? I think the best way is to experiment.Take care,

[Guest Fly II Pilot]

John,Some gauges use a static image or no image at all and two clickable areas defined by these squares. If you take a look at the Dauphin, I think that's what we used to create the clickable area for the GPU and for the simultaneous control of both battery switches. Usually there are two areas, one above each other, or next to each other, such that when the mouse pointer is over one area, one thing happens and when it's on the other area, something else happens.Hope I haven't confused you.Take care,http://www.avsim.com/hangar/fly/dfdg/banneraa.jpg

[Fall_guy 1]

Hi Alejandro, how are you!!I've just been looking at the EFIS section in the Pereguine PNL file and theres several listed in the BEARING section. I think your probably right that these sections are indeed blank spaces within a larger frame that react when the cursor enters them.The funny thing is though, I'm more confused now than ever, because for the life of me I can't figure out how the KNOB pbg's for the EFIS (Bearing, Course, Display) are sized and placed.What I mean to say is that normally files are position as follows:10 (X position)30 (Y position)20 (X size of pbg)20 (Y size of pbg)efis.bearing.pbgbut in the EFIS section of the PNL, there is NO individual size or position for the Bearing, Course, Display pbg's even though there named.Emmmmmmm!!!!.................the plot thickensSpeak to you laterRegardsJohn

[Guest Jan]

//////////////////////////////////////////////////// Pilot ND display controls////////////////////////////////////////////////// ==== GAUGE ENTRY ====cesp ==== BEGIN GAUGE ENTRY ==== ---- unique id ---- ppsp ---- x,y,xsize,ysize ---- 575 143 152 68 ---- Bearing ---- ---- begin ---- ---- rect ---- 16 41 28 52 ---- cursor ---- mpfinger.csr ---- help ---- Bearing ---- end ----Try this one.Figures 575 and 143 is the placement of the gauge.152 and 68 the size.Under "rect" the figures for the clickable area,horizontal starting point left,16 pixels,ending 28 pixels.Starting point vertical,41 pixels,ending at 52 pixels.Now you have a square box to click within.Hope it helps,or did you get more confused? :)Janhttp://www.avsim.com/hangar/fly/dfdg/bannerjh.jpg

[Roger Mazengarb 0]

G'day John,Spot on!! That's correct. You will find that you can move swithes and gages all over the panel ( even off the panel :-eek )using these.edit: Just read Jans reply and that rang a bell in my head. I think he may be right about the second pair of numbers being the size of the area. --- (not the lower right corner) Another feature that I've found is that SOME of the instruments are SCALABLE. Just enlarge the rectangle defining the instrument and the instrument will enlarge to fit. I did this to both the PDF and HSI.Very handy for the VDU in a glass cockpit or if you simply want a larger instrument.Most if not all of the simple pbg's however don't scale.I have found there are several rectangles that may be defined.One defines the area of the instrument.another defines the postion on the screen (upper left,lower right co-ordinates)another defines the clickable area, within the defined area for the mouse, and displaying the automated grey identification of the instrument. If you want to move a knob (kollsman) off the altimeter and place it on the glare shield panel then you must enlarge the rectangle defining the altimeter (size) to encompass the position on the glare shield where you want to place the kollsman knob. This means that although the kollsman knob is removed from the physical( visible ) altimeter it is still well and truly atached to the defined altimeter as far as Fly! is concerned.I have attached a pic to give an idea of what I'm saying.I redefined and repositioned the altimeter.then deleted the face and pointer. (didn't need them.)The subsections ( in yellow) I retained were repositioned within the new defined area. I'm not certain but I think they used the top left corner of the new defined altimeter as (0,0) but in any case they were also defined by upper left and lower right corners. Have a fiddle! This is all just from memory, there's nothing like hands on experience to get the gist of what does what.Cheers,Roger @YSSY

[Guest tonyc]

This is good information, Roger.tony

[Fall_guy 1]

Hi Roger,Thanks a bundle.........very clear explanation.I was wondering whether the NEW enlarged rectangle sizes will interfere with any of the existing displays, pbg's, etc..........because they now overlay??..........and just to clarify are we now saying that the first 2 digits (x, y,) refer to the starting point and the second 2 digits are the size of the rectangle?? (Just as in a gauge placement).I'm not to sure about this.........I'm going to have a closer look at them, If the second 2 figures are indeed the size of the rectangle it appears that some of them will be larger than the Image file they cover!!Speak to you later, MateCheers John

[Roger Mazengarb 0]

G'day Tony,Good info even if slightly inaccurate in places. It was nearly a year ago that I had this sudden urge to have a go at panel mods. If memory serves me correctly it was a post that you made that got me started. :-)Several months back when you were showing a panel that you were modifying, I sent you a zipped file by email of the pnl file and all the modified pbg's for this B717 panel. If you still have it then have a sqiz at it and you will see just what I did to get this panel.Cheers,Roger @YSSY

[Roger Mazengarb 0]

G'day John,,>I was wondering whether the NEW enlarged rectangle sizes will>interfere with any of the existing displays, pbg's,>etc..........because they now overlay??You can't have pbg's overlapping as that will obviously cause visual problems but instrument definitions can overlap no worries. when the cursor is inside the instrument definition then the grey box with the name of the instrument appears. In an overlapping situation one of the defined areas has priority. (don't ask how this is determined as I don't know but it really is of little consequence)>..........and just to clarify are we now saying that the first>2 digits (x, y,) refer to the starting point and the second 2>digits are the size of the rectangle?? >(Just as in a gauge placement).That I believe is correct BUT don't go off wildly programing a panel without first confirming. >I'm not to sure about this.........I'm going to have a closer>look at them, If the second 2 figures are indeed the size of>the rectangle it appears that some of them will be larger than>the Image file they cover!!That's what I was trying to show you in the attachment with my previous post. The one defined instrument may cover several pbg's.switch, display (pointer and scale), bug, message, lights etc which can be spread out over a fair area.>Speak to you later, MateI'll email you a zip file that you can look at and follow.Cheers Roger @YSSY

[Guest tonyc]

Roger, the B717 is a panel that I would like to get back to. Unfortunately, my curiosity about 3d modeling has taken me in hell.There are several crafts for Fly that I would like to convert to fly2, but the learning curve is steep, very steep, as you know.tony

[KenWood 5]

Hi John, Jan's explanation is on - and do you have PanelMaker Beta? That would go a long way in helping you to "visualize" what has been talked about. The program has quite a few bugs in it (i.e. try to do a digital clock, and it loses a lot of the info once re-written into a .pnl file). But it is a good tool to get the coordinates from, and easier to go back and hand correct the pnl file once you place everything where you want it. Cheers!Ken Wood :-sun1http://www.avsim.com/hangar/fly/dfdg/bannernewkw.jpgGateway 700X; Intel P4 2.4GHz; 512MB RAM; NVIDIA Ti4200 4X AGP 128MB; SB Audigy; Thrustmaster TopGun Fox 2 Pro Shock

[Fall_guy 1]

Hi Ken,Alas.....I'm a MAC guy, so I can't use the panelmaker. However I'm now getting to grips with the system files and things are starting to fall in place.The graphics side isn't a problem because I create everthing from scratch and I've implemented some new techniques to help, but as you can appreciate its a huge job creating a panel from scratch by yourself.Thanks for your input KenCheersJohn