All,I'm loving RC4, but I have a "real world" question. I have RTFM but I'm not sure if I find my case covered so please forgive me if I've missed it.I understand when you have your first waypoint is w/i 30nm of your dep airport, RC will assume you're flying your DP and leaves you pretty much alone. Well, the DP I'm using (and I've seen others similar) just has a bunch of VORs and a few intersections but no real course to follow. Kinda like the STARs that get you close to the airport with a final VOR, but don't put you on it.So, my question is, how do I properly fly this type of DP. Since there is no actual course to fly, do I just fly direct to my first waypoint, or would ATC vector me around somehow.Again, this isn't really an RC problem but I'm not sure how to properly fly this DP.

could you send this question to [email protected] an rc point, if the first checkpoint is inside 30 miles, you have to fly the dp with very stringent requirements (< 2 miles) of each checkpoint.what i think you are describing is what in version 3, was a flexible departure procedure, sort of depends on what runway you take off, you just have to make it to the first checkpoint.but all rc is looking at, are you coming within 2 miles of your checkpoints.you may want to specify one checkpoint outside the 30 mile radius that is common to all the departure procedures. then check the departure procedure box. then you can fly wherever you want, just so you make it to the first checkpoint, and then declare yourself on coursei think some of this is covered in the flight planning section, and there may even be a tutorial covering this.jd

ChrisI've seen the type DP you're talking about and must confess, I really don't know how to answer your question. I'm enroute; we need a rw approach controller to step in here.FWIW, I'll tell you what *I* do in my simming / testing. I'll try to "plan" that 1st checkpoint as a common denominator, one that would work regardless of what rwy I'm assigned for takeoff. Generally speaking, I'll "plan" any/all checkpoints that ensure a smooth transition to enroute.Keep in mind, if you file a checkpoint, you MUST progress that checkpoint within 2m while in Apch airspace!Now, if that 1st checkpoint happens to be outside 30m, I'll select either the No Altitude Restr or Alt Restrictions buttons on the Controller Info Tab to avoide Dept vectors.Hope this helps!

Haved a look at KMSP DPs available at www.naco.faa.com going through on-line products to TPPs. Download MINNEAPOLIS 2. Download SCHEPP1 DPYou will note that MPL2 has in its title "(VECTOR)" and except for a few crossing restructions all have distant VORs. I would assume this means that if you file for the first VOR and ATC accepts it, you will get vectored to a proper heading to track to it. As an example for KMSP to KDEN (Denver) the first suggested waypoint of the FAA Preferred Routes (another link) is FSD (Souix Falls, SD) VOR as noted on that departure.If ATC doesn't want to handle comms with you for more efficiency during dense times I would assume they would issue a more dense DP with waypoints closer. For this airport I believe most are outside the 30 nm limit but if you look at the instructions (the CONT 2nd page for SCHEPP1) you will see you will get vectors to MSP VOR which is on the airport, then instructed to on your own fly certain radial from it and so on to the various waypoints. In RC you will be required to nav to MSP on your own but my experience has been you will be at takeoff given an immediate clearance heading to get you started in the correct direction. Note the instructions regarding specific runway initial heading implying you will be given a heading to start you turning for MSP in this example. RC on take-off will state fly heading xxx or if the runway is aligned closely you will get fly runway heading. In both cases RC will state where the first waypoint is within 30 nm an "as filed" in addition to the intial heading. As filed means no vectors.This is how it was in 3.1 but in V4 you may get deviations for traffic as was nicely added (be sure interact with AI is checked in tghe general options).My practice is to always depart with the NOTAMS option so if I follow the published crossing restrictions RC won't complain. I also have a TCAS so I can spot AI positions (RC will advise you but seeing the targets is nice) to anticipate conflicts. I also use AISmooth 112 to space AI out a bit so I can squeeze in.These techniques will vary whether you are flying high or low such as you'd have to be quite high to fly direct to FSD in the MINNEAPOLIS 2 vectored departure to pick up the VOR about 125 nm away.Lastly, for examples of actual flight plans, go to www.flightaware.com, select a departure airport, select a departed flight, and in the left side data window that opens, you will see a dialog box that has the complete filed plan including a STAR and DP as applicable. If you pick a flight that has arrived and the range isn't too great (try Denver to KMSP arrivals of SCX Sun Country) the visual flight map will show how take-off and arrivals worked. You can get the current METAR at www.wunderground.com selecting the show metar option and it will show you local/regional radar if available. Just enter the ICAO (such as KMSP) into the search box at the top. It helps to use a pop-up blocker or if using firefox add the no-script extension and disable javascript for this site. Maybe all of this will help. Hope I did not meander too much but the topic is complex.