Greetings all. My name is Boyd and I fly for WestWind VA. In real life, I'm a security manager for Continental. As a hobby, I exclusively fly the DreamFleet 737...several hundred hours in fact. In my quest for realism, I began the enormous task of researching how the early 737s operate. My research included studying manuals, communicating with real pilots on the web, and some 737NG sim time. The result of all this was my DF737 Checklist. 14 pages in all. I am quite proud of it's thoroughness. The pmDG 737NG has really caught my interest and I think I might just give it a try when it's released. Several of the specifics mentioned in the FAQs and the website are quite promising. It looks like the team working this project are doing a fine job. I just wanted to introduce myself as I suspect I will quickly become an active contributor here. Cheers!Boyd BarkerSenior Command CaptainKBOS Hub ManagerWestWind Airlineshttp://home.houston.rr.com/checklist/DFexperience.jpghttp://home.houston.rr.com/checklist/checklist.htmlMy DF737 Around the World Adventure: http://home.houston.rr.com/checklist/aroundtheworld.html

Looks like someone really wants to become a beta tester? ;-)Welcome to the forum, Boyd!

Not supposed to be that obvious...Boyd BarkerSenior Command CaptainKBOS Hub ManagerWestWind Airlineshttp://home.houston.rr.com/checklist/DFexperience.jpghttp://home.houston.rr.com/checklist/checklist.htmlMy DF737 Around the World Adventure: http://home.houston.rr.com/checklist/aroundtheworld.html

Glad to have you here Boyd. You will see me around these parts often :). I would tell you some of the things I have done for my hobbie but then I would have to kill you :)Best Wishes, Randy J. Smith [h3]" A little learning is a dangerous thing"[/h3]AMD XP 2100 |MUNCHKIN 512 DDR RAM |ECS[/b ][i] K7S5A MB[/i] |GF3 64 MEG |WIN XP PRO |MITSUBISHI DIAMOND PLUS 91 19"

Hello Boyd,Welcome to the PMDG community. In the wake of your grand appearance in the PMDG forum I must say that your DF737 checklist is outstanding. Perhaps, PMDG will go over your submitted resume. I am very detailed myself, as my professional flight crew position requires. I must say that for a sim check list, yours is the most detailed I have seen yet. Your work ethic toward checklist simulation is unparalleled. Perhaps you may be able to make a checklist for the upcomming PMDG 737NG. I however, have one request that I hope you keep in mind. I am not an inspiring airline pilot. I am a 767FO for UPS and I had do deal with increadibly detailed checklists for many years. As you know checklists are increadibly important, especially in emergency situations. Knowing the checklist flows inside and out seperates a major airline caliber pilot from that of a part 135 or regional crew. Regional crews in my opinion are very good as well. My point is that an extremely realistic checklist is too demanding for most people. Most simmers will not memorize the location and position of EVERY switch, knob, etc. On the greedy side, I don't want to remind my self of work going through 60 pages of checklist for a flight on MS FS2002. I would like to see a much shorter version of your checklist that simlifies each system startup. I suspect most MS FS simmers will agree that they do not want to go through 5 pages of a detailed startup checklist to get into the air. What do you think Boyd?Sincerly,ChuckyWanna Play?

TO SAY 135 PILOTS AND CREWS AREN'T AS CHECKLIST SAVVY AS A BIG IRON FREIGHT DOG LIKE YOURSELF IS CRAZY. I WORK FOR A 135 COMPANY THAT IS VERY SAFETY CONSCIOUS (BIZ JET CHARTER TYPE)OUR PILOTS ARE THE SAME CALIBER AS YOU ARE. ACTUALLY, WHEN YOU TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE FACT THAT WE FLY HEADS OF STATE, CEO'S, CELEBS ETC...WELL THEY AREN'T JUST BOXES! BTW- TELL STEVE CIRIANO AND TOM BERKLEY IN UPS DISPATCH THE MOOSE SAID HI....

Hey Chucky, I really DO want to go through the correct checklists for this aircraft. While it's very true that this is not for everyone, most I think want very detailed checklists. If I wanted to just jump in something for the heck of it without knowing what every knob & switch does I would load up the default 737! Although I do agree that there should be an option or easyer way for those who just want to fly without going into to deep into systems etc. While I don't fly a real 767 I do fly my PIC 767 as real as possible and I have real manuals from Boeing along with some SOPs etc. I think there are many like myself who demand this type of simulation in FS. Would love to talk to you about your bird sometime Chuck. Best Wishes, Randy J. Smith [h3]" A little learning is a dangerous thing"[/h3]AMD XP 2100 |MUNCHKIN 512 DDR RAM |ECS[/b ][i] K7S5A MB[/i] |GF3 64 MEG |WIN XP PRO |MITSUBISHI DIAMOND PLUS 91 19"

GV-Like you, I found a significant amount of offense at the comments vice 135 and Regional pilots.... I know a number of excellent pilots in all avenues of aviation- and I know alot of folks who have no business being in aviation. They are spread all around.Anyone who indicates that he is a better pilot because his airplane is larger has a very narrow view of his own position in the sphere. Unfortunately I see it frequently.In light of all this- I would like to ask that you do what all good pilots do.... Read the requirements.In this forum you are required to sign your name to all posts. Adhere with this requirement, please.Robert S. RandazzoPrecision Manuals Development Group http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/coolcap.gifwww.precisionmanuals.com

Chucky-I'm surprised to hear that a pilot who works for a professional organization such as UPS would have such an uninformed view of our 135 brethren- or my own role/skills as a crewmember for a regional airline.Good pilots are not made by large airplanes or long checklists. Good pilots are made by unerring adherence to safety, situational awareness and professionalism.Professionals recognize professionals- and the don't always have to look up to see them.Robert S. RandazzoPrecision Manuals Development Group http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/coolcap.gifwww.precisionmanuals.com

I'm not defending Chucky Robert if this is really his case but maybe he was trying to state a differnce in quantity not quality of checklists etc and did not choose the right wording? My 744-200 AOM has enormous checkilsts setup items to follow whereas my 767/757 is less. I'm sure an airline pilot has worked his way up the ladder so you would think he would know that 135 brethern are very professional also.Best Wishes, Randy J. Smith [h3]" A little learning is a dangerous thing"[/h3]AMD XP 2100 |MUNCHKIN 512 DDR RAM |ECS[/b ][i] K7S5A MB[/i] |GF3 64 MEG |WIN XP PRO |MITSUBISHI DIAMOND PLUS 91 19"

Robert,I appoligize for making the comparison of PT 135 to P121 pilots. I guess I hit a sensitive area. It was inappropriate. My direct knowledge of PT135 is very limited. I flew most of my career in the airforce, 12 years C-130 (mostly). After leaving the AirForce I flew for a PT135 carrier, Regional Airline X, for 1 year. At best their initial training indoc. and recurrent training met FAA PT 135 mins. There were several accidents, though none fatal (luckly!) with the airline due to maintence problems, and pilot error of course. The entire environment for the regional I worked for felt unsafe to me. I know this is not representative of all PT 135 operations, however there are several out there that I do feel compromise saftey.After working at Regional airline X for one year. I got picked up by UPS. The difference in training quality, flows, was tremendous. By that I mean, training (indoc. recurrent, upgrades, etc.) are not remotely as good as a major airline. However, I have heard that American Eagle is very good. I see that major Airlines are contracting out shorter flights, United Express for example.Thus, the contract goes to the lowest bidder. Training is solid FAA quality training. However, I don't think it will remotely compare to the quality of training one would recieve at United Flight Training Center in Denver. This has nothing to do with the QUALITY of the pilot. If I pilot is at the proffessional level, I feel there is an enourmous commitment to saftey at all costs with respect to the pilot. However, contracts, financial investments in full-time sims, experienced training staff etc. is compromised WHEN we are talking about exceeding the FAA mins. at the Regional level when compared to the Majors. I believe it is a matter of resources that are available to train the pilot to a much higher level that FAA mins. Do you see my point?I am in no way shape or form suggesting that PT 135 pilots are not as safe as PT 121. I feel ALL proffessional level pilots have a tremendous commitment to unparalleled saftey. However, I do feel that do to financial constraints that PT135 pilots are not TRAINED to the quality of major airlines or shippers (FedEx, UPS). By trained I mean, that in the sim we can constantly practice flows for EVERY consivible emergency. Also, having an extremely experienced full time training staff, sims, etc. Thus, SOME emergencies at the Regional Level is considered anomalie at the technical glich. Due to the fact that the emergency sim training is MUCH more in depth. I'm comparing apples to oranges, and being extreme but I think you get my point. Simply look at the incident and/or accident rate of "regional airlines" vs "major airlines". I know I'm being sinical regarding training. Perhaps it's my AirForce training that you guys put $3,000,000 into me. :)But then again what do I know I fly boxes around these days. However, I don't have to worry as much about turbulence since we have no passengers in the back spilling the sodas. :)Sincerely,Chucky

Randy,I worked for a NON-saftey consious 135 for 1 year. In fact I felt very uncomfortable with them. Read post below for details. My flying career was in the airforce, PT 135 (1yr UPS), so my breadth of civilian experience is limited to a very bad PT 135 and UPS ONLY. The unparalled quality of training and resources I recieved in AirForce may have spoiled me. :(Chucky

Hey Everyone,Since this started with an introduction, I'll intro myself too.I am Dave Colavecchio and and I'm the flight operations manager for Key Air in Oxford Connecticut. I was a dispatcher at American Trans Air for several years which is how I know several people in UPS Dispatch. Our 135 company has 3 G-5's, 3 G-4's, 2 G-3's, 2 G-2's,4 Hawkers and a god awful Lear 45. We have several ex military pilots, retired 747 drivers, and other guys with 15k + hours along with 15 full time A&P's. They are just as talented as the ATA pilots. We pride ourselves on the hard to pleasecustomers we have. They are way to demanding to sit in a terminal for an hour! I agree with Chuck that many 135 charter companies have little or no maintenance program, safety program, etc...No, let me restate that. Most 135 companies are scary at best. Some Lear 25 drivers have never been in a simulator! Remember Paine Stewart! So in that respect Chuck you are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT. It's just the words pilot caliber that were offensive and I don't think you meant it the way it came across. On the other hand- Isn't it great that this small facet of aviation brings together dispatchers, pilots, security people etc...Thank you everyone in aviation who make's America and the world move. Thanks to UPS for keeping brown fashionable :-) Anyone who has seen a freight company hub during a push has seen nothing short of a well orchestrated ballet. I really can't wait to get the 737NG - please hurry!Dave Colavecchio

Dave,I was absolutley incorrect for stating that PT135 vs major pilots are not the same caliber "caliber". I was refering to the quality of training and training resources provided to the pilot. I guess that wine made me a little fuzzy brained. lolBrown tells me what to do. heheGod bless all airline workers and the United States of AmericaSincerely,Chucky.p.s. perhaps some other members of the forum would like to introduce themselves???

roger that...:-)Dave Colavecchio