Disgusted with the "other" site

[Hornit 3]

Ive about had it with..ahem...you know. Download speeds as of late have plummetted. Im on a decent DSl and routinely get nice fast d-loads. The speeds have dropped to dial up like in the last few weeks and I only go there now if I absolutely cant find the file anywhere else. I humbly request ALL freware developers to post your stuff to sites other than these guys, its just frusatrating. I usually can get in after a few tries so that didnt bother me too much. I just see a lot of good stuff there that isnt getting uploaded to other "better"sites.Hornit

[Guest tcable]

My issue ver there is that I can never get in anymore- even on Cable and being close geographically.It kind of puts you in a position to pay for freeware. Whcih I refuse to do.Tim

[Guest KenG]

I don't know what to tell you. I've noticed a couple slow downs from time to time, but nothing consistent. I downloaded something the other day and got very good speeds on my cable modem.

[Guest]

I agree Ken. I'm getting speeds of 150+ KB/sec which is about the best this ADSL connection will do. Very seldom do I see any indication of a slowdown.Trip

[Guest mikehaska]

For my below rant, you can substitue Tom Allensworth for Nels Anderson, and Avsim.com for Flightsim.com. They are in the same boat, as it were!Hornit,Nels Anderson, the webmaster of "the other site" (Flightsim.com for the uninitiated) is in a tough spot right now. His site is immensly popular- in fact, it is the most popular flight sim site on the internet. The site's design, ease of use, and content make it a great starting place for new simmers, as well as a great place for older ones too.For him, running his site is not as easy as opening a Geoshitties account and uloading his files there. He needs to have his own dedicated servers and staff to keep the site going.Here's where we come in. Ad banners are everywhere. It used to be that webmasters could make a good profit off those banners, to cover their costs while keeping the site free for users. Unfortunatly, these banners no longer work. Seldom do people click them (usually the number is in the 0.01% range) and it is becoming automatic to ignore anything the shape or placement of an ad banner (it's true, they have done studies on this). Even worse, pop up ads alienate customers, and newer ones, like the full screen float-overs can crash browsers.So- what do you do? I can't even begin to imagine what Nels pays for upkeep of his site. I know that I was quoted 600 yearly for my site, one which is so tiny, it's a speck compared to Flightsim.com. It comes down to this. Either you start charging, or you go belly-up. Look around the internet. Everthing asks for subscriptions, or memberships. Free email providers like Netaddress are long gone, and you can't even use half of Encarta Online without paying. Welcome to the aftermath of the .com crash.Take a gander at this article: http://www.howstuffworks.com/penny-per-page.htm It raises some good points, and gives some good alternatives. If you don't want to read it, essentially, it's raising the point- why do we expect something for free on the internet? You pay for books. You pay for cable or satellite TV. You even pay to talk to an expert. There's no free lunch, and reducing it simplisticly by saying "I hate memberships" is ignoring the roots of the problem.Sorry for running on and on, but there's a lot behind the scenes that isn't apparent, and is quite costly. But, when it comes down to it- if you don't like how they run their sites, you start your own and do better.You should be thankful that both Tom and Nels are providing so much to the community for so little (even for free.)

[Vulcan 14]

Well said Mike.A lot of people IMO confuse paying for bandwidth and a service with paying for freeware.Sure these two sites are primarily for freeware stuff but as you so rightly point out it costs a lot to maintain sites as large as avsim and flightsim and the bottom *has* fallen out of the banner ads.The alternative?The only option I can see, for folk who will not or don't want to pay, is for each freeware author to upload to their own site and then the 'I will not pay' folk can trawl the Net looking for all the individual sites for their downloads.The other option is to thank Nils and Tom for providing such an excellent service by applying for membership and/or making a donation respectively.I now have my NOMEX suit on ready for the flames :( Come on guys, you get your planes, scenery, etc for free, will $30 or so a year really break the bank??????

[Guest frankcubillos]

Amen well said Mike!Frank CubillosFSGateway

[Guest]

I always download for AVSIM. Nowhere else do I get download speed of 550-650 kb/s with my Cable all the time. :-hahEven if I see something nice on another site, I come back here and search for it first.Take careMike

[Guest]

I will only upload to avsim ,they are good to me :)

[Guest]

I download 99 percent of my stuff from AVSIM. I can't even get access to flightsim anymore. F5 just doesn't work for me. I refuse to pay $30 bucks for something that's free here at AVSIM and just a single mouse click away.

[Guest]

Thats weird, I was able to get in the site three times without refreshing yesterday! Download times weren't too bad. The problem is that AVSIM is less popular and some freeware developers have no idea about here so they only upload to Flightsim. :(Regards,http://www.someplacesomewhere.com/uploaded...ve/candlsig.jpg

[Guest Matt Johnson]

Well... if you find one of these designers who doesn't know about AVSIM's Library, encourage them to upload here! :) Trust me, once they've done it, they'll keep doing it. :-)Cheers,--M

[Guest]

Well "mgdbottled",If everyone here would take your attitude, I wonder how much longer Tom would be able to feed the lot! Neither site requires you to pay, but they both appreciate the contributions, and make a lot of good use of them that benefit not only the contributors, but the rest of the site users as well. Nels system provides an additional benefit to contributors, by making it easier to access his very, very popular site. I am sure as the membership at Avsim grows, Tom is going to have some very hard decisions as well.The best thing the users can do now is try to help both Tom and Nels defer the trmendous cost of running their respective sites.Like someone said "THERE IS NO FREE LUNCH!!!!"http://members.cox.net/pstepanoff/images/OK_c2.gifPete S

[Guest KenG]

Pete, it's no use. mgdbottled finds every opportunity to ridicule FS.com. Doesn't matter to him what you say. I have used your argument on many occasions to no avail. In the end, let's hope that the majority (or at least enough to keep them going) support both FS.com and AVSIM financially. It goes to the benefit of our community.

[Guest drobson]

It's amazing people are still beating this poor ol' dead horse! All the whipping in the world will not get him back up on his feet. This question/statement has been asked/answered so many times that it could not possibly be counted. I know that if I'm not happy with doing certain things, I simply stop doing them. If you can't get in, and don't want to help support the site, stop trying. (Unless someone is holding a gun to your headm which I rather doubt.As has been pointed out, it takes alot of cash to operate sites such as Avsim and FS.com. Have you donated to this site, or are you simply looking for something for nothing?Darrell

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