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lostmoon

RTO Procedures

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Hi everyone,[aside] My girlfriend has been so great. She accepts the fact that I am a bit obsessive with flight simming. She's even participating sometimes, acting as "god", or "fate", or whatever. Before flying, I ask her to roll dice and depending on what odds i give her, and from the dice roll, she will trigger a random failure(s)when I leave the room. Since accidents rarely happen, I usually tell her 8% chance of a failure. But, recently, I've been bumping that up to 35%. Anyway, this sets up my question.As i was on my take off roll from RJAA to KJFK, I experienced and unforseen engine 2 failure before V-1. sorry to say, i was unable to RTO. What are the procedures you gents/ladies (are there any in here?) use for an RTO. What are the procedures/actions done for an RTO?Thanks,Maximus


Tom James

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Guest poschrob

a/t off, thrust idle, spoilers up. I don't know the real procedures, didn't even read the appropriate chapter in the manual, but these 3 steps should stop the plane provided the autobrake is in the "RTO" position.cheersRob

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thank you rob. doesn't RTO operations deploy spoilers automatically? anyone else have their 2 cents to put in?thakns maxim


Tom James

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Here is the procedure I use, this is extracted from my work-in-progress advanced systems and procedures tutorial. You need the 'thottle overrides A/T' option checked. Again, please note the 'work-in-progress' comment, there may be some technical inaccuracies in this text as it has not yet been QA'd. Comments welcome!------------------------------Departure BriefingIf you can do so without drawing attention to yourself, it is worth VERBALLY reaffirming the following as part of your before start routine."I will stop for any EICAS cautions or warnings prior to 80 knots, between 80 knots and <> I will stop only for a blocked runway, engine failure, fire, or otherwise unflyable aircraft. Beyond V1 I will take the aircraft into the air, raise gear, stabilise the aircraft, engage the autopilot in FLCH V2+15knots and runway heading and then handle the emergency.<Abandoned takeoff.1. Close Thrust levers 2. Manually raise the speedbrakes3. Apply as much reverse thrust as you can manage without sending the aircraft off the runway (full reverse may well do this if you lose an outboard engine)4. The RTO will handle the braking.5. At 80 knots close the reversers.6. At 60 knots take over braking, verify the autobrakes have disengaged7. Come to a stop on the runway, go through your QRH for the failure that has ocurred.------------------------------


Mark Adeane - NZWN
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Guest The_Glideslope

From the 767-200 Abnormal procedures:Aborted Take-OffThrust Levers...............................IDLEA/T.........................................DISCONNECTSpoilers....................................FULLY DEPLOYAutobrakes RTO is armed above 85KTS. Autobrakes will only apply when throttle is IDLE.Don't have the real checklists for the 744... YET!!!

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mark,thanks a lot man! i appreciate that. looking forward to reading yuor tutorial.max


Tom James

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Guest 744nut

speedbrake are deployed automaticallyTon

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Guest The_Glideslope

Speedbrakes are activated in flight, on the ground the same surfaces operate as SPOILERS, and they do not deploy automatically in a RTO. Only when landing do the Spoilers activate automatically since they are armed before touchdown.

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"speedbrake are deployed automatically"Only if you pull on the reversers before you manually pull the speedbrake, Ton. Unfortunately, procedures dictate that you pull the lever first.It seems to be a strange way of doing things (as you can kill two birds with one stone). Even if all your reversers are mechanically locked out (at the engine), you're still going to operate the speedbrakes.Go figure! :(Cheers.Q>P.S. (Edit) Just remembered... If a hydraulic failure was to occur in the #1 or #4 system (or a certain elec bus failure), the autospeedbrake actuator will not work. Because of this, it may be better to pull the handle manually.

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>P.S. (Edit) Just remembered... If a hydraulic failure was to>occur in the #1 or #4 system (or a certain elec bus failure),>the autospeedbrake actuator will not work. Because of this, it>may be better to pull the handle manually. Q,I still don't understand that logic. You use the reversers, which operates the speedbrakes. If the lever goes back, great, if it doesn't, THEN you can pull it manually. Or is there else in there I'm missing?


Mike Roth

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Guest 744nut

Love this discussions Ian :-halo I mixed up speedbrake and autobrake. In the NNM procedure I have read now that speedbrake lever is raised manually. For the ones who are interested: this is a RW RTO procedureCaptain Without delay: Simultaneuously close Thrust levers, disconnect autothrottles, and apply maximum manual wheel brakes or verify operation of RTO autobrakes If RTO autobrakes selected, monitor system performance and apply manual wheel brakes if AUTOBRAKES message displayed or deceleration not adequate Raise Speedbrake lever Apply maximum reverse thrust on symmetric engines consistent with conditions. Continue maximum braking until certain the airplane will stop on the runway. Field length permitting: lnitiate movement of Reverse Thrust levers to reach reverse idle detent by taxi speed. First Officer Verify actions as follows:Thrust levers closed. Autothrottles dlsconnected.Maximum brakes applied. Verify Speedbrake lever UP and call "SPEEDBRAKES UP." If Speedbrake lever not UP, call "SPEEDBRAKES NOT UP"Reverse thrust applied symmetrically. Call out any omitted action items.Field length permitting: Call out 70 knots. Communicate reject decision to control tower and cabin as soon as practical. Review Brake Cooling Schedule for brake cooling time and precautions (refer to Performance lnflight chapter). Consider the following: the possibility of wheel fuse plugs melting the need to clear the runway the requirement fOr remote parking wind direction in case of fire alerting fire equipment not setting parking brake unless passenger evacuation is necessary . advising the ground crew of the hot brake hazard advising the passengers of the need to remain seated or evacuate completion of the Non-Normal checklist (if appropriate) for conditions which caused the RTO Ton

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"I still don't understand that logic. You use the reversers, which operates the speedbrakes. If the lever goes back, great, if it doesn't, THEN you can pull it manually. Or is there else in there I'm missing?"I understand your confusion, Mike. Perhaps Boeing factor in pilot reaction time (it may take the pilots a while to realize that the speedbrake handle didn't move automatically). As with landing, the spoilers allow more downforce on the landing gear... and therefore better braking.... so the sooner they deploy, the better.If I remember correctly, the reversers are not even factored into the stopping distances for RTO. They are just a nicety.Please note... The speedbrake automatics (if working properly) will still assist the pilots if they manually move the speedbrake handle (the pilots basically only have to move the handle out of the DOWN slot to make it shoot backwards). This only takes a second, then the pilots can move onto the reversers (if the F/O hasn't already got a handful of them).From what I've heard, RTO is quite painful (the g-forces really throw you against your seatbelts). It surprises me that the pilots can actually grab onto a speedbrake handle or the reversers with their weight being thrown forward so hard.Hope this helps.Cheers.Q>

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