Hi everyoneI'm a commercial pilot and I would like to build myself a cheap autopilot control panel for use with fs2002 (and may be 2004 then) with standard b737. I need it only for ifr selftrainign so I don't need anything more than the standard switches/rotary encoders that are on the standard b737 ap panel on fs 2002. I spent last 3 days searching the internet for documents and finally I came with this conclusion: I need 5 rotary encoders, 9 pushbuttons switches, 3 toggle switches. I think I need a Keyboard Encoder Module to connect theese switches to the pc. I found hagstrom MODEL KE18 that shold be enough for me(9+5+3=17 so 18 is enough. rigth?). now I have some questions for you:-how can I connect one rotary encoder to one hagstrom input? I can do it directly or do I need some kind of interface between them? and for switches?-would you recommend any other encoder module rather than agstrom?-what is, in very simple words, fsuipc? do I really need it?any other advice appreciated.thank you very much foru your help

I'm not really up-to-date with the Hagstrom keyboards, but I gather that they operate keyswitches by joining two wires (as far as the circuit board is concerned!). The problem here lies with the rotary encoders, which normally use at least 3 pins. I would assume the only way you can connect this to the key encoder is to use one of the output pins as one switch, and the other output pin as another switch. Continue this if there are more pins. In which case for each rotary you would need 2 keys, not 1. If anyone else can correct me on this, I'd be grateful as I don't know how accurate my guesses are!As for the FSUIPC, it's a small .dll file that allows all sorts of programs to read data from the simulator, and also to send data back to the simulator. It's a very useful piece of software, and essential for any sim addons that don't directly interface with the sim itself. Fortunately for most applications the usage is free, but in certain circumstances you will have to register it if a key is not provided with the software you wish to use with it. All in all, very much needed :)Hope this helps!

thank you very much for you help. I downloaded the last freeware version of fsuipc (2.975) and I found that it is absolutely needed becouse it allows assignment for many more functions than the standard fs2002 settings, altough I still can't find how to switch frequencies in nav radios.needing two input for each rotary encoder seems logical, I still have to find a clear explaination on how arotary encoder works, that I think could clarify the matter. Indeed if a rotary encoder simply works as two switches it will probably connect directly to the hagstrom input.in this case I think I will need thee ke-72 model (not very cheep! :( )I found other keyboard encoder modules:http://www.vetra.com/Encoder2.htmthey are cheaper but I don't know if some of them may fit for this project as it is not clear if they are user programmable.Another thing that I still can't understand is the difference between "matrix scan" and "individual inputs" in keyboard encoders.Can someone help clarify these things?thank you again.

You should take a look at www.mikesflightdeck.com as it has a wealth of info regarding many aspects of sim building. It certainly gave me a lot of useful tips and info!P.S. Mike, if you read this, don't forget to say thanks for the advertising info ;) ;) ;)

Here's a little info about rotary encoders:http://www.mikesflightdeck.com/switches+indicators_1.htmA matrix scan keyboard encoder groups switches into a rectangular array. The switches are read by a micro controller a row at a time. Because of the scanning mechanism, each switch must be be wired with a diode to isolate it from other switches in the same column.Individual input keyboard encoders do not group the switches into a matrix, so there is no need for isolation diodes. However, this style takes more hardware. The matrix style basically multiplexes a limited number of inputs to increase the number of switches that can be used. Mikewww.mikesflightdeck.com

Thanks. :-scatter Mikewww.mikesflightdeck.com

We used the Hagstorm USB emulator for our gps & we had to buy their rotary encoder interface chip as we used 2 Switch Channel RE11 rotary encoders. It wasn't very expensive, just sort of cumbersome. Required added real estate on the pcb. Doesn't GoFlight offer a mini MCP? Good Luck,Jim

Hi there. Rather than a hagstrom, may I suggest that you look at :-http://www.betainnovations.com/Leo's "Gamma Ray 64" unit takes up to 64 inputs, probably more than you require, but once you get bitten you'll be adding more hardware down the road, never fear Standard rotaries do, indeed, need a special decoder. To put it simply, when you turn a rotary, it sends out two signals, slightly out of phase with each other. A decoder converts this in to a series of on-off's on one pair of pins if you turn it one way, and on another pair of pins if you turn it the other. The other option is a device called a "Knitter switch", which does that directly, but they're a pain to get hold of (you have to buy 100) and they don't read all that well if they're turned quickly. I've found mine OK for the relatively small changes to radio frequencies, but not much good for the things like OBS and HDG changes which can be much larger.Richard

I would expect that when you're done you'll've spent close to what the GoFlight MCP autopilot module costs - I paid $269 plus shipping for mine from Randy's Pilot Shop (linked to at the GoFlightInc.com site). It emulates most of the "big iron" autopilot features and has digital displays for CRS, HDG, IAS/Mach, VS, and ALT. It's USB and is very simple to get set up, but you may need to rig up an enclosure of some kind if you don't want to buy one of the GoFlight ones. I don't fly the big planes - I draw the line at about the Lear 45 - but it works well with smaller aircraft as well.Avsim's review is here: http://www.avsim.com/pages/0603/goflight_mcp2/gfmcp2.htmlEditorial: if you're not on a really tight budget you need to ask yourself what your own time is worth. I figure mine is worth $50 or more an hour and it'd take me a lot more than 5 or 6 hours to build something like this. And, the displays mean that you don't have to rely on the on-screen autopilot section on (for instance) the 737's panel to set values.Now, if you enjoy hacking around with hardware and sofware, then this approach is probably too easy, but I sure do like my MCP.Dave Blevins

thank you very much for so much info!yes I've already found mike's website, and there I found the link to this forum! Now I'm reading mike's pages again and again and I think I'm understanding the differences between conventional rotary encoders and knitter and alps switches. (@ richard)I found alps rotary swithches at 3 euros each at www.rs-components.com and you can buy only 1. I think the first thing I will try is hacking a keyboard. As I got it, alps rotary encoders can be connected directly to an hacked keyboard, emulating pushing of two different buttons. It may be that a keyboard will not have the necessary "resolution" to get all the 24 input for each 360

Instead of using a keyboard, have you tried using a keyswitch emulator? It's a build-your-own device using series of diodes (that literally cost pennies) connected in a matrix that connects to your LPT port. One of our simmers has designed this feature and has written software for it. You can find it here http://www.fokker50.be.tf/Just enter the site, click Other then LPT-switch. You'll find the software and diagrams to help et you started.

yes!!while you were posting this I was just discovering the great lpt-switch on another post. I've just asked the author if alps rotary switche can fit on lpt switch (or if at least they can work better than on a keyboard) if yes I will definitely go for the lpt switch!thanks!

I am getting into this thread late, was out of town on business. However, since I recently went through a lot of what you are considering, I will share with you a little of what I learned.My first caveat is this: if you aren

Sorry the link did not work for you. You can get there from the main page by clicking on "Center Pedestal", then on "Switches & Indicators". The material about rotary encoders is after the Korry switch info.Mikewww.mikesflightdeck.com

thanks johnI really enjoy electronics as a hobby so I will try the selfmade way first. As for the rotary switches I would like to use them as they are cheaper and do not require additional hardware but if too many inputs from them are lost I think it will be worth buying a true rotary encoder.I'm waiting for comments and feedback about rotary switches used with lpt-switch and then I will make a decision.I went to betainnovations and found gammaray very interesting and quite cheap, if lpt switch or hacked keyboard won't satisfy my needs I will probably go for it (But I would prefer to save those money so I will be able to by electronflux to add display to my panel in the near future!)bye!p.s.what's the difference between the "complete kit" and the "usb kit only" in gammaray?