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Lbt564

ariane merge

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Hi!is there any merge that make the pmdg panel to work with ariane 737-800 verion 3?

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I suspect you would get in big trouble for doing that, read the Ariane 737's documentation: Ariane make no secret of the fact that they do not tolerate people messing with their stuff. Ariane are notorious for protecting their models and do not even allow people to post repaints online, so you can be certain they would come after you if you made it known you were doing some reverse-engineering like your suggestion. Of course, someone may have done it on the quiet, but Ariane will definitely prosecute you for breaking their EULA if they get wind of you having done so, so I wouldn't chance it if I were you.Their stance is not popular with many simmers, but you agreed to their terms when you bought their 737, so Ariane are entitled to take that position, and despite it not being a popular one with simmers in general, Avsim doesn't advocate what would be classed by Ariane as piracy in breaking their EULA, even if it isn't popular with simmers at large.Al

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That name....brings....lets call them, memories. Ugh.

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Hi!is there any merge that make the pmdg panel to work with ariane 737-800 verion 3?
Regardless of what Ariane does or doesn't like, the PMDG panels don't merge well with other models - PMDG planes are designed as systems rather than bits and pieces.DJ

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I suspect you would get in big trouble for doing that, read the Ariane 737's documentation: Ariane make no secret of the fact that they do not tolerate people messing with their stuff. Ariane are notorious for protecting their models and do not even allow people to post repaints online, so you can be certain they would come after you if you made it known you were doing some reverse-engineering like your suggestion. Of course, someone may have done it on the quiet, but Ariane will definitely prosecute you for breaking their EULA if they get wind of you having done so, so I wouldn't chance it if I were you.Their stance is not popular with many simmers, but you agreed to their terms when you bought their 737, so Ariane are entitled to take that position, and despite it not being a popular one with simmers in general, Avsim doesn't advocate what would be classed by Ariane as piracy in breaking their EULA, even if it isn't popular with simmers at large.Al
This makes no sense to me at all So if I were buy their 737 , according to your statement I cannot repaint it for my own use , a type of reverse engineering because I have altered the model in a way not supplied by the creator of the modelI cannot add any type of gauge that i may legally own for my own use , I may get the urge to put a weather radar in there (altering the original model)and god forbid if I decide to merge my bought and paid for Ariane 737 with a freeware model and use it on my computer in my sim Airiane would prosecute !!!!They may refuse to support the mods i have made but that is it Also you may need to rethink what you call PiracyThe Op is talking about a merge , there are several payware merges in the library , are they piracy?????Mark

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Hello,From the aircraft.cfg (Ariane) LOL

[fltsim.0]title=Ariane Boeing 737-800 Ryanairsim=Ariane Boeing 737-800 Ryanairmodel=panel=sound=texture=panel_alias = b777_300\panel Fumeur13.gif sound_alias = ariane_ng sound\cfm567b 28kb_checklists=boeing737-800_checkkb_reference=boeing737-800_refatc_id=-atc_airline=Ryanairatc_flight_number=1322ui_manufacturer=ARIANE B737-800NGui_type="737-800"ui_variation="Ryanair"description="Founded by GPA leasing executive Tony Ryan, Ryanair has gone from strength to strength in establishing its position in the European airline network. TOday, Ryanair is the leading airline in the budget sector. Starting with only 20 Boeing 737 200's in 1998, Ryanair has as many Boeing aircraft planned as it originally had on its books when it began."atc_heavy=0prop_anim_ratio=-0.77//Specification changes are copyright: Ariane Studios. Please ask before using.[General]
Well ...... AvocatQuiFume.gifHein36.gifRegards.bye.gif

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Well done belga1 :( Ariane :( Guess that makes a panel merge a moot point as far as the EULA goes :( Mark

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Mark: It's not what 'I call piracy', I'm merely pointing out Ariane's policy with its add-ons and offering a note of caution because of that.Most other developers are smart enough to realise that allowing people to do repaints, and post those repaints online, actually makes their product a more attractive proposition by widening its appeal. But Ariane choose to sell official repaint packages instead, and do not approve of users editing their files, preferring to retain full intellectual and creative rights over their stuff. That's their choice, and your choice too if you buy their product and agree to be bound by their rules.The fact is, if that is what they say in their EULA, then when you install their product and click the little 'agree' tick box, then you agree to their stipulations. I didn't say I thought it was a good policy, or that I would advocate it as a good idea, I'm merely pointing it out. However, that being the case, since Avsim does not support piracy, and that is how Ariane chooses to define it in the rule they make buyers of their products agree to when they install them, then circumventing those rules is breaking the EULA, and Avsim would not advocate doing that for Ariane, or any other developer.Old time users of Avsim and the free stuff in Avsim's library will of course recall that this very matter, and the availability of freeware stuff at large, was the cause of a great deal of trouble for Avsim some years ago, so if you care about Avsim, don't post those sort of changes in the forums, as it will be no laughing matter when Ariane threaten you with legal action, and believe me, they will.Al

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Chock. . . . you're the messenger and as such you'll get shot. I am a lecturer in PR techniques and I use Ariane's approach to business in the flighsim arena, as a model for 'how not to do it' to my students. A lot can be learnt by negative example. Actually I'm not really a lecturer in PR but for a moment I had a fantasy about it. :( If I remember rightly, Ariane recently hired someone whose name escapes me at the moment, but appeared to be trying to change the tone of the relationship between Ariane and the customer . . . . haven't seen anything since though.

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ok! thanks for the answers! i decided to not buy this aircraft if dosent work with pmdg 2d panel, so i must use my beloved pmdg 737 ng!

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Mark: It's not what 'I call piracy', I'm merely pointing out Ariane's policy with its add-ons and offering a note of caution because of that.Most other developers are smart enough to realise that allowing people to do repaints, and post those repaints online, actually makes their product a more attractive proposition by widening its appeal. But Ariane choose to sell official repaint packages instead, and do not approve of users editing their files, preferring to retain full intellectual and creative rights over their stuff. That's their choice, and your choice too if you buy their product and agree to be bound by their rules.The fact is, if that is what they say in their EULA, then when you install their product and click the little 'agree' tick box, then you agree to their stipulations. I didn't say I thought it was a good policy, or that I would advocate it as a good idea, I'm merely pointing it out. However, that being the case, since Avsim does not support piracy, and that is how Ariane chooses to define it in the rule they make buyers of their products agree to when they install them, then circumventing those rules is breaking the EULA, and Avsim would not advocate doing that for Ariane, or any other developer.Old time users of Avsim and the free stuff in Avsim's library will of course recall that this very matter, and the availability of freeware stuff at large, was the cause of a great deal of trouble for Avsim some years ago, so if you care about Avsim, don't post those sort of changes in the forums, as it will be no laughing matter when Ariane threaten you with legal action, and believe me, they will.Al
Hi Alan I dont use panel merges and I dont post them either but cast your "old time user" eyes at this http://library.avsim.net/search.php?CatID=...;Go=Change+ViewHelp yourself there are plenty in the libraryNow either Avsim have got it wrong or you have Mark

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Funny you mentioned being a lecturer in PR, because on occasion I am (when I run my copywriting course, which has a module showing people how to improve their PR and marketing). :( I had a look at that link Mark, and I couldn't spot any Ariane ones there (must admit I didn't spend hours scrutinising it though). There certainly are one or two merges of Ariane things in the Avsim library though, and one or two repaints too, most of them for older Ariane products. Nevertheless, it is my understanding that Ariane grant no permission to do that sort of thing, unlike most other developers, who extend it as a courtesy despite the fact that you do not 'own' the textures in an add-on you purchase, merely a license to use them.For more information of the hassles this sort of thing has caused in the past for Avsim, do a Google search on 'Peter Tishma' (of Papa Tango and Ariane fame), and you'll find plenty of evidence for Ariane's litigious past; there are social diseases that are more welcome than him as far as many flight simmers are concerned, although people can of course change, and like a previous poster noted, I too have heard that Ariane are attempting to improve their PR somewhat these days, and there is some evidence of that too from what I can gather.Al

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Funny you mentioned being a lecturer in PR, because on occasion I am (when I run my copywriting course, which has a module showing people how to improve their PR and marketing). :( I had a look at that link Mark, and I couldn't spot any Ariane ones there (must admit I didn't spend hours scrutinising it though). There certainly are one or two merges of Ariane things in the Avsim library though, and one or two repaints too, most of them for older Ariane products. Nevertheless, it is my understanding that Ariane grant no permission to do that sort of thing, unlike most other developers, who extend it as a courtesy despite the fact that you do not 'own' the textures in an add-on you purchase, merely a license to use them.For more information of the hassles this sort of thing has caused in the past for Avsim, do a Google search on 'Peter Tishma' (of Papa Tango and Ariane fame), and you'll find plenty of evidence for Ariane's litigious past; there are social diseases that are more welcome than him as far as most flight simmers are concerned, although like a previous poster noted, I too have heard that Ariane are attempting to improve their PR somewhat these days, and there is some evidence of that too.Al
You will also find that Tishma was told in no uncertain terms to buzz off and/or bring it on, and nothing ever came of it. Ariane claims to have no affiliation with PT these days. It seems to me wildly unlikely that any paints or merges done on a user's own hard drive and not distributed will result in any claim on their part regardless. Such actions might result, at most, in an inability to get support. I think you are creating a tempest in a teapot.DJ

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Funny you mentioned being a lecturer in PR, because on occasion I am (when I run my copywriting course, which has a module showing people how to improve their PR and marketing). :( I had a look at that link Mark, and I couldn't spot any Ariane ones there (must admit I didn't spend hours scrutinising it though).Al
Hi Alan Did you not see Belga1's post about the Aircraft cfg for the Ariane 737panel_alias = b777_300\panel So according to that config there is no Ariane panel , They themselves have used a type of merge :( As I said , if that is the case then the debate of a panel merge with another aircraft is a moot point .Now I dont own any of their "stuff" so they may have rethought the idea and created their own All that aside , to create and sell an aircraft that uses a default panel and then to say that the end user cannot modify it in any way is , well lets not test the swear filter!You probably didnt find an Ariane merge in that list i posted , i didnt look for one , the point was that you said that merges are piracy and Avsim does not condone it , but there are many PSS, Overland , CLS and other merges there .Am I to presume that these payware makers need to re write their EULA and take a leaf out of arianes book?Go to the PMDG forum and inquire about merging their products , if they bother to answer at all they will tell you that you are on your own , no support will be given , they do not accuse you of piracy I should add that I am replying to your notes on Airianes EULA , and allthough I use the word "you" it is not meant as a personal attack of any sort , please except any apologies if that seems to be the case .It is not my intention to shoot the messenger Mark

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I didn't say 'merges are piracy' (in fact I said the complete opposite). I merely related that doing one with Ariane's stuff when they don't grant the user leave to mess with their stuff is breaking their EULA and that they regard it as such, I didn't say anything about it being a problem with anyone elses stuff, read my post!Al

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I didn't say 'merges are piracy' (in fact I said the complete opposite). I merely related that doing one with Ariane's stuff when they don't grant the user leave to mess with their stuff is breaking their EULA and that they regard it as such, I didn't say anything about it being a problem with anyone elses stuff, read my post!Al
Alan I read your post , I quoted it , all of it , at least all that was there when I opened it All that was there was those two lines ??? I dont know why but there you goAs i said in my previous post and i will say it againI should add that I am replying to your notes on Arianes EULA , and allthough I use the word "you" it is not meant as a personal attack of any sort , please except any apologies if that seems to be the case .It is not my intention to shoot the messenger So thats me finished with this discussion I dont own or care for Ariane products , so I will leave you with the last word Mark

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Sometimes I read these posts around AVSIM, though replying with some sense is mostly very hard. It is just sometimes so funny to see how much dust Ariane's discussions can lift...On a personal note, I just think Ariane is a disgrace to the computing/internet/FS world.

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The real world is full of pitfalls ....and so is our virtual FS world unfortunately and we have to watch out for them!Tuning into AVSIM is one of the best ways of avoiding them IMHO.Certain developers should be given a wide birth.....I don't say they should disappear because then life would be too easy.FWIW Due to XML animation for models..... certain models TMK cannot be merged...eg Maddog 2008, latest Ariane models.....

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Hello,That's what I read lately about their (Ariane) last release (B737-800 FSX)"Overpriced and underfeatured. Wait for PMDG. Charges for every little ad-on. No paint kit. No navigraph support. Ad-on liveries are to be purchased. Claims it's highly realistic. Many features non-op. It's a home made job marketed beyond its capability. Rude support and confusing registration system. Removed from my hard drive. Went to reinstall and registration didn't work. Wants to charge to reactivate. Activating Old Orders? Due to increasingly high numbers asking for 're-activation' we request you purchase a ticket to cover costs."So.. seem's they keep their questionable behavior ......Regards.bye.gif

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Hello,That's what I read lately about their (Ariane) last release (B737-800 FSX)"Overpriced and underfeatured. Wait for PMDG. Charges for every little ad-on. No paint kit. No navigraph support. Ad-on liveries are to be purchased. Claims it's highly realistic. Many features non-op. It's a home made job marketed beyond its capability. Rude support and confusing registration system. Removed from my hard drive. Went to reinstall and registration didn't work. Wants to charge to reactivate. Activating Old Orders? Due to increasingly high numbers asking for 're-activation' we request you purchase a ticket to cover costs."So.. seem's they keep their questionable behavior ......Regards.bye.gif
It seems they are keeping their legacy alive. LOL.

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Actually, to be fair to Ariane (although God knows many would prefer not to extend them that courtesy), the above quote is from just one review on the SimMarket website, and as we've seen in a lot of recent threads on Avsim, often a review is in the eye of the beholder. You can find other reviews on SimMarket which praise the Ariane 737 too (as well as some other negative ones).Look at it this way, there are some people who slam PMDG aircraft, you'll find some threads on Avsim of that nature, but does that mean that PMDG products are bad? Most people would say no (including me), but there are nevertheless some voices of dissent. I've had problems in the past with PMDG's 747 where activation was concerned, although that was a long time ago when their support was not as good as it is these days, but if I posted a review saying the PMDG 747 was terrible because I couldn't get it activated (without knowing exactly why I was having trouble), would you take my one opinion as the gospel truth? If I pointed out a mistake in the PMDG 747's virtual cockpit (yes there is one), would you think it was bad? If you did, you'd be wrong of course, because the PMDG 747 is a great add-on.I always prefer to look at more than one person's opinion, especially where online user reviews are concerned, for very obvious reasons: Glowing tributes can be 'seeded' by the developer under the guise of an anonymous review, and of course negative reviews from rival developers are not an unknown business tactic either, so I always view a single comment with caution until I can find others which concur with it, or better yet, form my own opinion by seeing the product for myself.I do not own the Ariane 737, but I have a friend who does and I have flown it on his computer a few times, and I can tell you that from what I have seen of it, it is actually pretty good. I've toyed with the idea of buying a few times, and probably will at some point, although I'm presently waiting to see if the rumours of them cleaning up their act a bit come to anything (and to see if the next PMDG 737 matches the excellent VC of the Ariane one). The Ariane 737 certainly has the nicest virtual cockpit of any 737 you can get currently for FS and the lighting is very good in the cockpit. Compare this with the problems PMDG are having with the lighting in their MD-11, again, does that make PMDG a poor developer? No, of course not, they'll probably fix it, but if you read a negative comment about that problem in isolation, would you regard it as a comprehensive appraisal of the PMDG MD-11?That said, the Ariane 737 definitely has some minus points, and as we are mostly aware, the company doesn't exactly go out of its way to make itself loved by all, so I am not claiming it is the pantheon of great add-ons and I certainly don't rate their PR technique, but to simply disregard the Ariane 737 as poor, especially based on one review placed online by someone whom none of us know, is neither fair, nor advisable. After all, there are non-functioning items in the PMDG 737 cockpit, and the Wilco one too, but it doesn't stop me from thinking they are both very good add-ons, and ones which I use all the time.Read the quoted review carefully and you will spot something weird in it too: It says that the aircraft is no good and the reviewer has uninstalled it, then goes on to say that they tried to reinstall it. I find it a bit puzzling that someone who has just claimed it is awful is then complaining that they cannot reinstall it. That they are having problems reinstalling it is not a good sign of course and is some reason for possible caution, but why do they want it back on their system if it is that bad?As ever - Caveat Emptor.Al

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Alan, I couldn't agree more, your own assessment is very fair, unfortunately not often seen on popular forums where users are very quick to jump on the band wagon.I wasn't happy to accept the criticism of certain developers, in Arian's case it just wasn't credible, and am pleased for having made a decision based on my own interpretations, although I accept the timliness of this decision was important because if the situation was really as bad as people made out then they really have come along way.bottom line is no sim is perfect, but the Ariane series is now getting very close, it needs essentially a navdata source to complete, my experience with them has been very pleasant.john

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