Whenever I see a reference to traffic patterns and how/when to fly them, it always seems to talk about them in regard to small aircraft at small airports. Typically a traffic pattern is described for a Cessna 172 or similar.So - just when, where and how are traffic patterns flown for ALL types of a/c. I can hardly see the 747s at my local International flying a pattern -- but then again , maybe they do. For example, would a Dash8 fly a pattern into a regional airport (non-ILS) So could anybody describe this for me -- I can fly a standard pattern in the Sim with the smaller slower a/c -- but once I step up into the turbos and jets, it gets a lot harder.Thanks Barry

Barry,Big jets may also fly regular traffic patterns. This of course depends on ATC, weather, etc. But if they do their pattern is obviously stretched appropriately to account for their higher speed.I have a real-life radar feed from the KDFW airport and can see approaches how they unfold in real time. In VFR conditions there is a lot of pattern flying depending on the direction the aircraft is coming from. Very neat to watch.Michael J.http://www.reality-xp.com/community/nr/rsc/rxp-higher.jpg

Heavy aircraft do occasionally have to fly a pattern. I was flying a real C172RG into Little Rock, AR on an IFR flight plan. I was cleared for a visual approach to RWY22R, told to enter a left base for 22R and watch for the 737 on downwind. That was quite a sight to see.

>Heavy aircraft do occasionally have to fly a pattern. I was>flying a real C172RG into Little Rock, AR on an IFR flight>plan. I was cleared for a visual approach to RWY22R, told to>enter a left base for 22R and watch for the 737 on downwind. >That was quite a sight to see.Depending on wind & arrival direction, commercial jets will fly a downwind & then base turn directly over my house to land at KSLC, 10 miles away. And then all these GA airplanes make a base turn over my house to land at U42 which is less than two blocks away. Good thing I like airplanes! :)L.Adamson

>I have a real-life radar feed from the KDFW airport and can>see approaches how they unfold in real time. In VFR conditions>there is a lot of pattern flying depending on the direction>the aircraft is coming from. Very neat to watch.>>Michael J.>http://www.reality-xp.com/community/nr/rsc/rxp-higher.jpgA real life radar feed....sounds great. How did you arrange that and would it be legal in UK?

The "traffic pattern" is usually a VFR maneuver, which is why you don't typically see transport category aircraft flying the "standard" cross/downwind/base/final pattern. Because of a number of reasons (all-weather schedules, flight above 18,000 ft, ops requirements) airlines almost always operate IFR (even in CAVU (VFR) conditions) and therefore are typically vectored (via radar) for their approaches. These vectored approaches may be either instrument approaches (i.e. ILS, VOR, etc) or visual approaches (i.e. "River Visual") and may be conducted in either visual or IMC (instrument approaches only) conditions. Regardless of the weather, the IFR environment is structured around aircraft spacing and the smooth flow of traffic and replaces the need for a VFR traffic pattern per se.At smaller fields, it is not uncommon to see a commuter or airliner making a circle-to-land approach (basically a "racetrack" - or oval - pattern. Keep in mind, the larger the aircraft, the wider and longer the pattern will be. Most part 121 and 135 operators have specific requirements in their op's manuals that dictate what conditions (wx, radar, speeds, rwy length, terrain, etc) are required for a VFR-type approach. Hope this helps to clarify.

>A real life radar feed....sounds great. How did you arrange>that and would it be legal in UK?Unfortunately it is not something available to the public. I have access to it because I do some work for ATC (FAA) here at NASA Ames in Moffett Field, Calif.Michael J.

Dennis,Well written.... You covered most of it.In addition, when large jet aircraft fly a visual or "VFR" pattern, it is normally accomplished at 1500 ft AGL. It is a pretty rare occassion though. I can count on one hand the number of true downwind visual patterns I have flown in large jet aircraft, including the DC-8, B-727, and the B-747.Most all air-carriers operate strictly under IFR in line operations, and as such, the approach controller is obligated to provide vectoring to final, and IFR seperation from other aircraft. Only when the pilot agrees to accept a visual approach after confirming visual contact with the airport is this varied from.What may appear from the ground to be large pattern "VFR DOWNWIND PATTERNS" are usually vectors to final that follow a downwind pattern, followed by either clearance to join a published approach, or a visual clearance once the aircraft is adequately aligned with the landing runway....I no longer fly for an airline, but do fly/teach in the corporate environment. Even here, unless I cancel IFR airborne when the destination is in sight (uncontrolled airport) I still find the same to be true....Tim SandersATP, Instructor Pilot Falcon 10 & 20

http://www.aip.net.nz/NavWalk.aspx?section...ee=ChristchurchThat's the full set of charts for NZCH, as an example. Take a look at the 'Visual Arrivals' charts. At the bottom of each chart is a description in words of the arrival, including in which part of the traffic pattern the aircraft should join; most of these say 'join final'. The VFR procedures are quite different, they all say "If circuit joining instructions have not been issued, hold as specified', which means ATC must give clearance into the pattern, and will give instructions as to how to join.