At what point does simulation become 'full' or 'serious'? The video you linked showed takeoffs, flights, manouvers, stalls, crashs and landings. It could just as easily have been made with Xplane9, FS2004 or FSX (does FS9 have aircraft casts shadows on self?). I saw nothing that said to me 'this is a game' or 'that is incomplete', but if you did, please point it out.So the word 'torque' is not mentioned? My copy of "The Air Pilot's Manual (vol 1)" doesn't mention torque until lesson twelve (page 195).MS has not published an SDK at this time, on the other hand, they have not published Flight at this time either.Instead of knocking a product that does not yet exist, why not try ignoring the opinions and wild guesses that uninformed people insist on making, and wait to make up your own mind. It won't cost you a penny to try it when it is released, and allowing that it won't have Orbx, PMDG, ASE2012 or any of the other add-ons that take FSX out of the mundane, you can decide for yourself if it has potential or not. My personal opinion is that even though it is aimed at attracting new people to Flight Simming, it will not be able to retain them without the underpinnings that you and I call hardcore.

I may try it yeah. Anyway, I wouldn't call RSR, John Venema or the guy from Aerosoft (sorry, can't remember his name) uninformed people.I could be wrong and Flight might be an awesome simulator waiting to be unleashed, but I doubt MS would invest resources in making a sim-like engine just to collect rings, and without (current FSX top) 3rd party developers that's all you'll ever be able to do in Flight, I think you will agree with me there.I used to read all the doomsayers in disbelief here in Avsim Paul, there's no reason left to be optimistic right now, and trying it won't change that. After all if you try a stripped down FSX you would never imagine an NGX is even possible... oh wait, there's an SDK in FSX so...

I've also been selected for the beta and in my opinion, all that flight needs, is the scenery of the whole world! Cuz believe, the rest is really not bad at all! Good graphics, scenery, frame rate, flight dynamics, realistic ground effect, sound. We just need scenery of the whole world and we will be fine! If not, this game will be unplayable for pretty much everyone of us, it will only be fun for kids. And MS is perfectly right that this game brings you hours of fun. Exactly, HOURS, whilst FSX gives you YEARS of fun. Although FSX has still got a few more years in it, it's just getting too old. Perhaps it won't even work anymore on Windows 8, it's just a too unstable game for the current OS's and hardware.

I've also been selected for the beta and in my opinion, all that flight needs, is the scenery of the whole world! Cuz believe, the rest is really not bad at all! Good graphics, scenery, frame rate, flight dynamics, realistic ground effect, sound. We just need scenery of the whole world and we will be fine! If not, this game will be unplayable for pretty much everyone of us, it will only be fun for kids. And MS is perfectly right that this game brings you hours of fun. Exactly, HOURS, whilst FSX gives you YEARS of fun. Although FSX has still got a few more years in it, it's just getting too old. Perhaps it won't even work anymore on Windows 8, it's just a too unstable game for the current OS's and hardware.

Adding whole world coverage is a huge task on it's own, but it's not the only thing it needs. It needs aircrafts, AI traffic, VATSIM / IVAO, airports, ATC,...how's the weather simulation Arjen?Are there any basic navaids for IFR flights? VOR, NDB...

Adding whole world coverage is a huge task on it's own, but it's not the only thing it needs. It needs aircrafts, AI traffic, VATSIM / IVAO, airports, ATC,...how's the weather simulation Arjen?Are there any basic navaids for IFR flights? VOR, NDB...

I think the final version of MS Flight will have plenty of aircraft. Probably no Boeings, but I don't care, as they'll probably be crap anyway. We've got PMDG for that. And yes, VOR and NDB and ILS is tunable and works. There is also ATC, although I haven't really found out how to use it yet. And in my opinion we don't need VATSIM or IVAO. Because MS has focused a lot on multiplayer, in this way, we can have IVAO and VATSIM merged. Weather simulation, well, the clouds are great, they are volumetric, and really cover up the wings when you fly through them. Unfortunately I haven't discovered a Real World Weather option yet. But we have Active Sky for that, just like we have Flight One's UT2 for AI traffic. But unfortunately, I heard that MS Flight won't allow for 3rd party add-ons (PMDG, Active Sky, UT2, etc.) to be installed. So basicly in this way, FLIGHT has got no future for the hardcore simmers here. I really don't understand how this game is gonna be a success. Most people will get bored after several hours or so... Let's just keep fingers crossed that everything will be different upon release, if not, we'll have to wait, for XPlane 10 (with a good update), P3D (a cheaper version), or another simulator. This afternoon I saw another sim platform called Aerofly, seems to be better than FLIGHT and XPlane 10 together. Unfortunately, the future of flight simming does not look good. Cuz there will be a time (probably within the next 5 years), that FSX just won't work anymore, (unless you still have Windows 7 in 2017...). And also, FSX will just get too old, and too unstable for current OS's and hardware. We just need a new GOOD simulator... There just must be a company, somewhere in the world, who realises that the community needs a good flight simulator, and makes one. Fingers crossed for that...

....We're making a 777 for FSX, that's the next project. (along with the secret one, which also does not involve Flight, both are FSX)...

- No Dash ?

It seems that way unfortunately :(

I think the final version of MS Flight will have plenty of aircraft. Probably no Boeings, but I don't care, as they'll probably be crap anyway. We've got PMDG for that.

You assume that PMDG will be developing for Flight, but from what I've read, the opposite looks more likely. There's a good chance you'll be stuck with whatever MS decides to offer you, as it's not looking promising for a healthy addon community around Flight.