hey im dan and i was wondering does anyone know any good places where i can beta test FS products? i need a place that would be willing to teach me how. plz help.regards DAN

Get yourself noticed in a positive manner by a company or group and when a new product is in development hint that you're interested in helping out as a tester.Be prepared for disappointment as there's a lot of people who only sign up for testing in order to get a freebie which puts many companies off of honouring such requests.If you show yourself to be knowledgable you may in time be asked to help out in a semi-official capacity by someone or other.Testing is hard work usually, depending on which phase of the development process you become involved.It's NOT just getting a free product and looking at it, it's rigorously trying to break it in a reproducable way in order to provide accurate data with which the development team can correct the error. If that means replaying the same scenario a hundred times with minute changes to determine some boundary conditions than that too is your job.Then when the error is fixed, you have to do it again to check if the error is really gone and no new errors were introduced.Books can, and have, been written on how to test software. It's a profession which some thrive in but many leave in frustration because it takes a very special mindset which not very many people posess (which is one reason there's so much poorly tested software out there, most testers don't take the trouble to dig deep enough just like many developers don't see all boundary conditions which might appear).

Also watch this forum (and others). You will occasionally see beta tester requests from developers here. One appeared yesterday or the day before. It is for testers for a GA AI Traffic generator. R-

Also, don't be afraid to make constructive suggestions to developers in their specific forums with ideas regarding the development of their products. If you have good ideas, you'll quickly move to the short list. A lot of it is luck though - being in the right forum at the right time - I was lucky enough to visit the Ultimate traffic tech support forum within hours of their posting a request for beta testers for the UT FS2k4 upgrade...Should you manage to get into a test however, keep in mind you'll be getting Beta software - expect crashes, expect to have to duplicate those crashes. Over and over again, potentially. Hours of flying FS because you're trying to break it isn't everyone's idea of fun...

Forgot to mention you can't tell people about it either or (usually) show them what you're testing.So no posting screenshots of the secret project and no talking about it (sometimes even mentioning its existence and your involvement are not allowed).

Another point no one has mentioned is that beta software puts your computer at risk. You may load drivers, DLLs, or other files onto your system that conflict with your hardware or other system services. This can lead to a very frustrating experience if you are not competent in computers and how to resolve conflicts.If you only have one computer to conduct testing, I would strongly advise you not to beta test if you are a novice computer user or you value your current configuration.It is best to test on a system in which you can easily reinstall the OS, drivers, or unique configurations that are specific to the scenario you are exploring.Bruce

thanx soo much for all this info!! :D :-jumpy

Dan, I've been beta testing Radar Contact since 1999! he he Jeroen i right about a certain mindset to test software. With RC, I get to use buggy (sorry, JD ) software all the time. Right now the version 3 owners are using a flawless product that does everything advertised. On the other hand, I'm using Ver 4. It has great new features like interacting with the AI and more but we're always breaking things and having to test the same scenario over and over. Something new is added or changed and we have to make sure that first, it works, and second that it didn't b4eak anything that worked ok before! ;-) It's challanging and fun if you have an eye for detail and are methodical by nature. Tonight I'll be downloading around 300 MB of scenry to test the installer for a new scenery package. It's not always fun and games but I see it more as a way to give to the flt sim community by helping a developer deliver a great product for all to enjoy, whether pay or free. If you like to learn and don't mind hours of work for no pay, go do it!!d :-) :-)Best, Rob

could someone please tell me where a good place to start and learn is?? like a website??

I would say the best place to watch is right here, in the AVSIM forums. There are both payware and freeware organizations that have set up shop here. It's really a unique job with a unique set of skills and I'm not really sure if it is a learnable job.Hope this helps,JimActiveSky Support

which forum would be the best to look at?

Hi, this one...I don

thanx for all this info and i have a fari few hours flying around and i am quite knowledgeable in flying and FS2k4 so i think thats enough don't u?

Hi Dan,I can only second what's been said and tell you my experience. I've been flying sims for a long time and just recently (when FS2002 came out) discovered the community out here on the internet. After that I have mostly been flying online and trying to find information on how this is done in real life. As a beta test member for PMDG it is crucial for me that I have knowledge of how the real thing works as this is the aim of the company. It takes a lot of looking up information, devoting a lot of spare time to study and in between that test the upcoming beta builds that are supplied to you. I also do testing for Active Sky 2004 and that requires another piece of knowledge. You got to know something about meteorology and weather. You have to learn about METAR and TAF abbreviations. All in all what I'm trying to get through here is that you need a lot of background information as well as just testing. But to me it is a lot of fun. I enjoy learning new things and don't mind sitting and RTFM. :-)There is no real website, at least that I'm aware of, that can tell you how to become a beta tester. You have to do a lot of search on your own. I guess it takes a certain type of personality as has been said before. To apply I would suggest you write an email to the company you are interested in helping with some kind of CV of your flying experience be it real or sim related. Cheers,

Hi Dan,Like my buddy Rob, I too have been a beta tester for Radar Contact for some time. As Rob mentioned we are working on the new version of RC and many times the test builds don't work the way they are suppose to. I also have done beta testing for the PIC development team, PSS and FSMeteo. What you find out is that it is not always a lot of fun. You must first understand the project in detail and what it is trying to accomplish and then test against that design point. Many people think that testing is about new ideas. In my professional life we use to call that scope creep. What is very important in testing is to do as many flights as possible and do everything you can to measure the program against its design objective. That does NOT mean does it do what YOU want it to.Now how did I get the chance to test the products that I have done? Stay on these forums, use the products, get to know the development team and offer constructive ideas and questions. DO NOT become a winner, be very supportive and make good solid suggestions. Folks will get to know who you are and then ask you to help them out.One other side benefit of working with the development teams, you get to know some of the greatest people in the community. John Dekker, one of the developers of Radar Contact, for example is just an outstanding guy. I am amazed almost everyday when he gets a new idea and then ask the team did he code it right. When I was doing the PIC 767, Eric Ernst, Wade Chafe became very good friends. In fact Wade and I spent a lot time together this past fall at the AVSIM conference, as the saying goes "just priceless".Stay close to the forums, you will get noticedBob JohnsonKDEN