Hi,I just tried a complete hyd failure scenario and I find manual reversion not that realistic. Again, I'm just rated on the classics but I believe the NG should be very similar in this regard. Although the control forces are much higher, the '37 can actually be flown pretty stable in manual reversion. Not so with the NGX (the deflection is very limited)I think a more realistic simulation of manual reversion would be to slowly increment the control wheel to the user's input.So let's say I fully deflect my yoke to the left, the yoke in the simulation will just slowly (say after 10 seconds) move to the fully left deflection. Same if I return to the center - the yoke in the NGX slowly creeps back into neutral. This way you'd have full deflection available but with a lag (to simulate the excessive force and the planning required from the PF)ThanksMark

It is what I asked sometime in the forum, sameas you, I found manual reversion pretty useless and some ngx users think that the 737 is a fly by wire plane as without hyd power the controls doesn't move.People are often sure that NGX simulation = real NG simulation.But we are using very different controllers. I use a force feedback controller and I think that a lot can be done to simulate centering, trim, feel, and manual reversion on them.For the non force feedback users I also did the same your suggest, add a slow flight control movement when uncentering the surface (with faster return to center due to aerodinamic forces), maybe limiting to 50% of full deflection, but still manageable in flight.After some try I succesfully landed the plane with a total hyd failure (a belly landing as the landing gear manual extension is not simulated) but it was hard to control the aircraft.I really hope that pmdg will add a multicrew support, maybe the second pilot could add more deflection helping the fpilot flying, and he will help trimming in case of electric failure.With all power down, no hyd power, it is impossible to fly, check out from the window, check the IFSD (or analog instruments) and continously trimming as the elevator will not help you mantaining the pitch.I don't know,as pmdg never answered, if it is a wanted feature (to add pilot loads) or something they missed, but I think it is something that is better to change or improve.

I agree. From c-141s to gulfstreams, manual reversion requires more force. The plane is very flyable, but requires that you put some thought and planning in landing. I think this should be easy to simuilate.

I'd like to see this addressed too, but the solution can't just be increasing forces for those with force feedback controllers. No commercial force feedback controller can provide sufficient force, or hysteresis for that matter, to make that workable. I'd prefer a decrease in control sensitivity (as defined by microsoft that is), so the control will respond to the input but at a slower rate. That would work for any controller.

For me the best way is to let the flight controls move of about 20% for momentaneus manouvers, then, if the joy will stay for seconds to the full left, right, up or down, the flight surface moves slowly until the 100%, this will let to mantain control and also will not need continous stab trim usage to correct pitch.

I agree that more force is required but I fail to see what you want PMDG to do about it? They do not (and can not) affect the resistence your controller offers to you. All they can (and do) do is react correctly to the movements you apply to your controller. If you want to simulate the effects of hydraulic failure on your controls as opposed to on the aircraft, get a mate try to hold the control in its centered position while you try to deflect it. Or, if you have a saitek x52, or any other joystick with an exposed spring, you can insert wedges to limit the springs movements - in fact, you could take this further. To simulate elevator failures, you could put wedges just in the front and back of the spring. Aileron failure could be simulated with wedges on one side or both, depending on the nature of the failure...

Paul, the actual limit (expecially for elevator) make it almost impossible to control the aircraft, if the aircraft is trimmed correctly before the failure is ok, if you have electric trim avaiable it is still usable, but, in case of a total loss of power and hydraulics, it is hard to trim manually and fly the plane at the same time. But you need to fly the plane with trim as the elevator is useless.As we are sayng, the best thing is to add a delay in moving the surfaces from center to the desired deflection, delay that could increase depending on speed and wanted deflection, delay removed if you re-center the control.It will help in flying the plane but giving you the sensation to be more hard to fly.

Haven't tried a manual reversion on the NGX, I will try it later. I did it a bunch of times on the actual sim and it is HARD!