I am really happy with this programme -- finally I have some GA activity in FS2004. Personally I think it is maybe the best addon we have seen for FS2004 BUT -- I have noticed that using addon a/c is severely impacting on my FPS. Now, I know that you can use the "Make AI" function and I have done that -- even to my default MS a/c. So what I am finding is that the default a/c (reduced to AI textures using the MAKE AI function) do not reduce my FPS as much as addon a/c. In fact, at this time I am only using the default a/c as AI when using GA-TRAFFIC.Now this is not a complaint -- but more of a question of "why is this so"? Anybody know? I notice that the panels are stripped out of all a/c after they have been converted into AI -- so there must be some other reason. It is a bit of a shame really because I get a really good mix of all my a/c when I have them all selected -- it's just that they seem to kill the FPS a lot. Now please don't tell me to reduce the % of AI -- what I am saying remains true for any level of AI %. Any ideas?Thanks Barry

I've noticed the same thing and I assume it is the high polygon count on some highly detailed addon aircraft. Markus noted the same thing and his only suggestion is not to use the ones that hurt too bad. I guess that we could start a list of the GA models that do or do not work well as AI traffic. I've heard that Chuck Dome's planes work well. R-

What add-on aircraft are you using to make as AI, Barry? I don't use the high end payware... it still puts too much of a hit on the hardware. Aircraft from developers like Flight1, FSD, Carenado, etc. weren't meant to be used as AI (seems a waste really, considering the high quality developers like these give us).I use aircraft that are low poly to begin with, then run them thru Markus' MakeAI converter. Works well for me... until I get to a busy GA airport.Cheers,Greg

I think you have to be really careful which aircraft you choose for AI. With this program it's really tempting to use anything that looks cool, but frame rates will suffer. All add-on aircraft are not made for AI, even a lot of add-on AI aircraft aren't really, which should be defined by a low poly count and multiple LODs. So when you choose a non-AI aircraft for use, be prepared for slow frame rates. I just wish there more true, AI GA aircraft out there.Todd

I only use the default FS9 aircraft and Bill Lyons' creations. I have given all the Lyons planes and the FS9 "Century of flight" oldtimers low probabilities between 5% and 1%, so I sometimes see an exotic plane but mostly Cessnas, Pipers and Mooneys. I can hardly feel any FPS degradation excpet mabe at Renton (KRNT) or Meigs (KCGX) , where the surrounding scenery and UT traffic are very dense.Just my 2c (EUR),VOlker :]

I can hardly feel any FPS degradation>excpet mabe at Renton (KRNT) or Meigs (KCGX) , where>the surrounding scenery and UT traffic are very dense.yes -- I have been happy using all kinds of freeware a/c as AI a/c -- after using the MAKE AI facility -- BUT I first noticed the bad FPS when I visited Meigs. It was immediately apparent there -- so after I unticked the GA box for all non-default a/c , I got my FPS back to an acceptable (to me) level. But it is obvious that Meigs and freeware GA a/c don't want to mix very well.So -- how do we know what GA freeware is low poly? In fact, I had been thinking that one aspect of GA-TRAFFIC was/is very good and unexpected . And that is that I quite often download a freeware a/c which turns out not to be much to my liking and I don't fly it. But now, even a fairly basic model which I wouldn't want to fly is actually quite desirable to work as AI.So now we have a need for low poly GA aircraft -- something maybe that beginner modellers could easily create??Barry

>I use aircraft that are low poly to begin with, then run them>thru Markus' MakeAI converter. Works well for me... until I>get to a busy GA airport.what low poly a/c have you found? Perhaps we need a whole new section in the Avsim library now for GA AI a/c?Barry

Hi Barry,I use alot of Chuck Dome's aircraft. They convert very well. My routine is to use the MakeAI function in Ga-Traffic, and then use ImageTool to convert their textures to DXT1. Saves CPU cycles while I'm simming.Cheers,Greg

I think trial and error is the best for this matter - I tried to start a thread a few days ago to that end trying to get folks to contribute to a list of "good ai", but that descended pretty quickly.I have had success with the default planes.I use several of mike stones planes such as his aerostar and queen air. I have also had good results with chuck dome's planes (all of the fs2004 planes, in fact). The gforce Cessna 150 for fs2002 also works great. I too use bill lyons waco and swift.Lastly, I find that all payware planes eat frames. There was program called GA traffic manager for 2002 that had a pack of GA planes available. I'll try to post a link later if I can find it in the library - those might be worth a shot.

A rough way to tell if a plane is low poly is by the size of the .mdl file.default 737_400 fs2002 610 kb/5002 poly - fs2004 695 kbaardvark 737_300 153 kb/1871 poly, 4 lodaardvark 737_400 232 kb/1863 poly, 5 lodaardvark 737_200 322 kb/1985 poly, 6 lod - lod1 1985,lod2 1773,lod3 1495,lod4 829,lod5 293,lod6 131default c182 fs2000 372 kb - fs2002 703 kb - fs2004 730 kbdefault c182rg fs2002 391 kb/3107 polydefault pa28_180 fs2002 585 kb - fs2004 601 kbdefault lear fs2002 468 kb - fs2004 2,419 kbdefault mooney fs2002 376 kb - fs2004 1,927 kbChuck Dome bonanza (bon04moz.zip) 293 kbA slightly larger .mdl may be better if it includes several lod levels vs. a smaller .mdl that has only one lod. Unless a plane was made for AI use it probably will not have more than one lod.Comparing the .mdl file sizes is only a rough way of estimating the performance impact.I have just started using GA-Traffic and one thing I've noticed is that all the flight plans are at 10% so far. Setting the traffic slider at 9% means none of the flights are active and at 10% they are all active.Kurt M

"I have just started using GA-Traffic and one thing I've noticed is that all the flight plans are at 10% so far. Setting the traffic slider at 9% means none of the flights are active and at 10% they are all active."But this is a good thing Kurt. If you remove all of the GA traffic from your default Traffic030528.bgl file, then the traffic percentage slider under the FS9 Options menu will set the amount of commercial traffic that you see (be sure that it is above 10% if you want to see GA traffic). Next use the percentage slider in GA-Traffic to set the ammount of GA traffic that you see. Now you can control the proportion of commercial/GA traffic.Two things of note:1. Project AI has a utility which will remove the GA traffic from your default traffic bgl file.2. The traffic percentage file in Markus's program is not intuitive. All the way to the right gives you 1.5 GA planes for every GA parking space defined in FS9. Two thirds of the way to the right produces one GA plane for every GA parking space and one third up the slider give you one GA plane for every two GA parking slots. It may take a little experimentation to determine how much GA traffic you can use without a frame rate meltdown.I hope that this helps. R-EDIT to add:PS. Thanks for the information about the mdl file size. I was hoping that there was a way to determine/estimate poly count but I did not know how until now. R-

>PS. Thanks for the information about the mdl file size. I>was hoping that there was a way to determine/estimate poly>count but I did not know how until now. yes -- I agree, thanks for that explanation. I will now go away and have a look at my fleet. At this stage I have "turned off" as AI my Maules, Cessna 310 and the AeroCommanders. It was obvious that they are AI FPS eaters. I found an aircraft that was released recently for use explicitly as an AI a/c - a Diamond Katana -- but I found that it was a FPS eater as well. There was no explanation as to why it was an AI a/cThanks to you , for the explanation about how and why to turn off the default GA AI . Who wants to bet that Markus's programme will be incorporated into the next version of Fsim????? I wonder if the freeware inventors of these things that have been incorporated into FS over the years receive anything for it?Barry

>I use alot of Chuck Dome's aircraft. They convert very well. >My routine is to use the MakeAI function in Ga-Traffic, and>then use ImageTool to convert their textures to DXT1. Saves>CPU cycles while I'm simming.Could you kindly explain to us (in mono-syllables please!! :) )how to do this.And also, does doing this have a severe impact on how AI a/c look externally.?Thanks Barry

Chuck Dome's Aero Commander 500 is an excellent substitute for Milton's as AI...Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but the key to having quality AND good frames is the inclusion of multiple LOD (levels of detail) in the model, such that when near, the model shows a higher polygon count, but at a distance, it's polygon count is a bare minimum. Having multiple LODs may make planes more frame rate friendly as the lowest lod may in fact have fewer polygons than many low-poly models, however the file size might be quite large by comparison, because of the inclusion of multiple levels. I'm sticking by my earlier statement - trial and error remains the best approach to this, along with some solid testimonials as to which planes work in practice...Just a thought.Best,sg

Thanks for the nice explanation, Kurt!Barry... ImageTool is easy to use. Download it here (also some nice painting tutorials there, too). http://www.projectopensky.com/files/index....aint-resources/Simply open a file (from the texture folder of the aircraft you wish to work on), look at the right upper corner to find out what format the textures are currently in, and then click on "Image" in the toolbar. Next click on "Format", and you'll see all the choices available to you. Click on "DXT1" and then save the file. That's it! Try a few textures, and watch the size change in the upper right corner as you click on "DXT1". It makes the textures roughly half the size of DXT3 textures.As far as how the aircraft look afterward... best thing to do is check for yourself. Choose a GA-AI plane from a scenario in your sim where you'll know to see that aircraft as AI traffic. Backup the original, and then make the texture changes. Go into the sim where you'll know to see that aircraft and check it out for yourself. For me, they look fine for use as AI... you might not agree.In the end, though, Kurt hit the nail on the head. The key to getting FPS friendly AI is to check the .mdl file. For me, anything over 500KB is too much.Hope this helps,Greg