Guys, I posted this on DF's forum but was interested in getting some opinions from our home forum flyers. Many of you are experts in the 727 area and deal with the 727 in RL so here is my post, please comment.." First off I love the 727 guys but I am at a loss as to why the engine type JT8D-11 is used when this must be a super RARE type for the 727 series? I cannot locate "any" with them that are flying! If one looks here (as of 2002 all existing 727s in the world) (http://bird5.bird.ch/bharms/boeing/b727_f_0.htm) not 1 has the 11s! You certainly can find a few JT8D-11s in use on Dc9-30s and 40s but for the life of me I cannot locate a 727 with them installed.So I am just wondering as to why model a type of engine that is so rare if on any 727 insted of say popular types and here are the lists526 had -15s200 had -17s50 had special JT8D-217 mod w/ from Valsan650 had -7s (old -100 models)350 had -9s60 had Tay651 Rolls Royce, these are 727-100 UPS1880 total 727sJTD8-11s??? zeroStrange and I do not mean this is a bad way guys, but maybe a future update with a more popular (hate to say one that is used) engine type for us?"Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4]http://www.rawbw.com/~bdoolin/shinault/southparkcartmad.gif[h3]PMDG 747![/h3]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)ASUS KV8 DLX | AMD 3200 64 | 1 GIG PC 3200 DDR | GIGABYTE 5700 ULTRA | ViewSonic VP192b 19" |

Delta and United had large 727-200 fleets with JT8D-15 engines (hushkits after 99). and American and Continental operated large fleets with the JT8D-9 engine.Some early -200 and most -100s had the less peppy -7 engine.Cheers,Marc

I think the -11s were probably the standard engine before the 727s were retrofitted with -15s/-17s, and that is what they based their choice off of.

>I think the -11s were probably the standard engine before the>727s were retrofitted with -15s/-17s, and that is what they>based their choice off of. Even if that is the case certainly not ONE 727 in the skys is using the 11s are they NOW? The package has other options NOT just what was "initially" installed on the aircraft like PFD/EFIS. So I am still a little shocked that they would only model one type of engine that in fact is not relevant in the real world TODAY. How many 727s can one find with 11s? I am still looking. I must be clear that I would STILL purchase this great add-on. This engine thing is more of a "what were you thinking" question since I believe DF can model "correctly even an engine type that no longer has any bearing on 727s. Options are GOOD.. Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4]http://www.rawbw.com/~bdoolin/shinault/southparkcartmad.gif[h3]PMDG 747![/h3]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)ASUS KV8 DLX | AMD 3200 64 | 1 GIG PC 3200 DDR | GIGABYTE 5700 ULTRA | ViewSonic VP192b 19" |

Yes, I understand your question, just trying to provide some idea of their thought process. :)Either way, I'm happy with the -11s. Just had the pleasure of handflying a VOR 23 approach into Des Moines this evening, followed by a nice visual 32L into Omaha. Can't wait to wakeup tomorrow morning and fly the return leg to KDTW.

The JT8D is an axial-flow, dual spool, fully ducted turbofan engine. It's design dates back to 1960 Some of the certification milestones are as follows. Feb 1963 JT8D-1 certified @ 14,000 lbs thrust (entered service 1964) Apr 1963 JT8D-5 certified @ 12,000 lbs thrust Mar 1966 JT8D-7 certified @ 14,000 lbs thrust May 1967 JT8D-9 certified @ 14,500 lbs thrust Sep 1968 JT8D-11 certified @ 15,000 lbs thrust APR 1971 JT8D-15 certified @ 15,500 lbs thrust Feb 1974 JT8D-17 certified @ 16,000 lbs thrust APR 1976 JT8D-17R certified @ 16,400 / 17,400 lbs thrust 1988 saw the end of production of the JT8D -7 thru -17's with 11,878 units being produced. Those produced by dash models are: JT8D -1/1A/1B/5 (1,809) JT8D -15A (338) JT8D -7/7A/7B (2,612) JT8D -17 (1,069) JT8D -9/9A (2,832) JT8D -17A (241) JT8D -11 (128) JT8D -17R (312) JT8D -15 (2,525) JT8D -17AR (12) Pretty much by the end of 1988 almost all the -1 and -5 were converted to other dash models or were no longer in service. The JT8D-209, which was the first of the -200 series, was certified in 1979 and entered service in 1980. Since 1989 only the -200 series JT8D's are being manufactured. From http://www.boeing-727.com (under Engine tab, Engine history)

>I think the -11s were probably the standard engine before the>727s were retrofitted with -15s/-17s, and that is what they>based their choice off of. You know what is interesting? I have read this on DF's forum too. I have word for someone in the *know* that only the 100s were availible with JT8D-11s and were *never* on the 200s when produced.... OK here is what I BELIEVE we should have on an update15s on the 2007s on the 100 SINCE these represent real world operations....Better stated "what would be very KIND of DF if they provided us" ;-)Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4]http://www.rawbw.com/~bdoolin/shinault/southparkcartmad.gif[h3]PMDG 747![/h3]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)ASUS KV8 DLX | AMD 3200 64 | 1 GIG PC 3200 DDR | GIGABYTE 5700 ULTRA | ViewSonic VP192b 19" |

www.boeing-727.com is an OUTSTANDING source of info for this great old bird. The -11s should be more than adequate for general sim use and should provide for a very reasonable mean for an "average," powered 727. Perhaps the next update can provide a few more powerplant "choices."Just a side note; I'm sure each airline had different policies and setups, but I remember the powerplants being a mix and match type thing. The 100s only had a 7/9 mix. The 200s could mix all three, 7s,9s, and 15s. DF sounds like the realism is almost 100%, so maybe they could add a mix-match feature for those desiring the ULTIMATE in historical realism. . .

You have got to be kidding me. If they had released it saying that it had -15's, what would you have found to complain about?Tony

>www.boeing-727.com is an OUTSTANDING source of info for this>great old bird. The -11s should be more than adequate for>general sim use and should provide for a very reasonable mean>for an "average," powered 727. Perhaps the next update can>provide a few more powerplant "choices.">>Just a side note; I'm sure each airline had different policies>and setups, but I remember the powerplants being a mix and>match type thing. The 100s only had a 7/9 mix. The 200s>could mix all three, 7s,9s, and 15s. DF sounds like the>realism is almost 100%, so maybe they could add a mix-match>feature for those desiring the ULTIMATE in historical realism.>. . Well show me the ANY 200/100 with 11s on them then maybe your reply would have a little weight to it Hawkman. Looking at that site it list ALL availible powerpants HEREhttp://www.boeing-727.com/Data/type%20cert/spec%20sheet727.html do you see any 11s? I'm not coming down on DF as everyone knowns what I think of them by my many supportive posts but I am correct in regards to the engines and I did ask for a future UPDATE if they were KIND enough to do it. I would still say that this bird is FANTASTIC and providing more engine varients that fit reality more than the unheard of 11s would make the sim that much better...Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4]http://www.rawbw.com/~bdoolin/shinault/southparkcartmad.gif[h3]PMDG 747![/h3]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)ASUS KV8 DLX | AMD 3200 64 | 1 GIG PC 3200 DDR | GIGABYTE 5700 ULTRA | ViewSonic VP192b 19" |

>You have got to be kidding me. If they had released it>saying that it had -15's, what would you have found to>complain about?>>Tony In case you were replying to me I would have hoped you could be a little more creative than that. 15s would have been GREAT, why you ask? Because they ARE FOUND ON THE AIRCRAFT TODAY AND IN THE PAST TOO! Unless you can show ME a 727 TODAY (hell find them in the past too if you can) with 11s fitted then your reply is baseless and based upon personal crud *complaining* insted of any substance to the discussion. It would be like me offering a Croba 427 then saying it really has a 350 ci because these were used at first although no one uses them now..Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4]http://www.rawbw.com/~bdoolin/shinault/southparkcartmad.gif[h3]PMDG 747![/h3]Caution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)ASUS KV8 DLX | AMD 3200 64 | 1 GIG PC 3200 DDR | GIGABYTE 5700 ULTRA | ViewSonic VP192b 19" |

Randy,Give it up dude. I never made any statement about any 100s or 200s actually being powered by -11s. You might want to re-read a message, several times before you post. What I did say was the -11 provides a good "average," powerplant/thrust. I stand by that 100%. The rest of my message is just providing REAL airline experience. . .backed up with several THOUSAND hours of both flight and engineering time in both 100s and 200s. So, why don't you try to weigh that. . .

Tony,I guess there's always bound to be one in every crowd. All told, I have yet to read a single bad review regarding this add-on. In fact, the reviews I've read indicate an immersion AND satisfaction level for this add-on that has yet to be equalled by any other.Heck, I'm really STOKED and can't wait to try the DF727 out. . .and who cares if any 72 operating "today," in in the past has/had -11s? From the sound of it, -11s are working just fine for this sim.

Heh... You know a product has to be good when this is all we're left to find controversy about. Carry on.__Josh

Josh,ABSOLUTELY agreed 100%!