From your original post it looks like you can either get (free) announcements of updates and download them yourself or pay a set amount of money and get them sent to you.That sounds like a perfectly reasonable system to me (though for 10 quid a pop they might as well send them out on CD).

Given the attitude of many people towards FS addons you'd hardly know the difference.Our customers (who pay tens of thousands of Euro a year for the privilege) don't complain as much or as loudly as the average FS user and never about such petty things...

ROFLMAO. Yeah, I suppose it is reasonable to expect a small developer of add-ons for a PC flight simulator to offer a support system similar to the single wealthiest corporation on the face of the planet. Excellent analogy...Although I note with interest that MS doesn't offer that same service for any of its entertainment software. Hmmm.......one might also wonder how much that support adds to the cost of the OS itself when you purchase it, whether or not you actually ever take advantage of the service (which I personally choose not to)...

If it bug fixes they must really. Now they obviously do offer bug fixes for free just this service so to me it

Microsoft does offer a service where you can get major updates on CD.Service packs you can order separate for cost of shipping and handling.So can some other things (like the DirectX SDKs).If you want more frequent delivery you can subscribe at a price of several thousand dollar (depending on subscription level chosen) to receive the MSDN collection every other month or so which contains updates to everything Microsoft produces (and at higher levels the full products as well).It sells rather well, mainly to large companies and companies working on development of Windows applications (it also contains tons of technical documentation and SDKs).

TonyWhat is the problem with what they are trying to do?They are offering a for fee update notification service for those that are too lazy to get them themselves for free from their website."Given that they can afford to email 'the world and their dogs' with infomercials, surely notifying paying customers of available bug fixes without charge isn't asking too much.....?"You keep saying this but no other developer for Flight Sim goes to that length to notify their customers of updates so why do you expect any more of Ariane?Troy

When it comes to Ariane and Rauch (and some others), don't expect him to concede to anything, no matter how logical. Of course, I will now be idiotically accused of being associated with Ariane.

Hi Troy (and John & Edam & everyone else)HAPPY NEW YEAR!

Great contribution to the discussion, Edam.Makes you wonder why threads get locked..........

ToniHappy New Year to you as well.What you consider a money grab I would consider an optional service that I might like to take advantage of if I wanted to spend the money(which I don`t)and or did`nt have the time to go crusing the net for all the updates for all my addons.It just seems to me that as long as these updates are freely available to users on their admittedly convoluted website there is just not an issue of concern.Now I know all about PT and his antics in the past as I have been simming since "91" but I have to admit that some of their stuff is`nt too bad (visual models and effects mostly) in fact if they developed their pushback system for all aircraft I would most likly buy it.Just try to remember that Ariane consists of more people than PT and some of them have real talent.It seems to me that it is a shame that they are kept out on the fringe like they have been.I will tell you though Toni that if I ever found out that they were charging for bugfixes and critical updates I would be right next to you handing out torches and pitchforks.Troy

First, my standard preamble to all postings regarding Ariane:1. There's one born every minute2. Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it3. Caveat EmptorYes, there are apparently some talented folks at Ariane beyond just our hobby arch-villain PT...but, as my mother told me once: "when you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas." Anyone even remotely linked to PT should understand what that association brings to the table. And I, for one, think that keeping PT and those kind of predatory business practices on the fringes is the best thing for this hobby. PT's reputation was well-earned, and those associated with that breed can't expect the stink not to follow them as well. We're judged by the company we keep...sorry but that's the way the world works.One need only visit the Ariane website to see the voluminous quantity of pretty pictures and overblown advertising superhype to know that the spirit of PT still lurks in the shadows there. How much has been promised but not delivered?There are some...ostensibly people that haven't already fallen prey to PT and its progeny...that seem to think that one gets to reboot one's reputation at will, and that we should simply forget what has happened. No...sorry...I for one don't see anything to be gained by allowing wolves to roam at will looking for newbie sheep to lunch upon. My own experiences with Ariane were born out of that same uninformed ignorance I might not have had if I could have read about it in a place like Avsim's forums.And Edam...it isn't so much that you're associated with Ariane, as much as you always seem to be on their side whenever you post. So if you're not associated with them, it would still seem that you're at least "with" them. See my previous comments re: the company you keep for further insight.This isn't about Ariane bashing, so much as a recurring reminder to all to consider what happened before PT was driven to the fringes by a wave of popular disgust and disdain. So when Ariane, which I consider to be spawn of PT, comes up with a new way of tapping into their customer's wallets, it's with that long and sordid history attached that I must consider the implications.CheerioBob ScottATP IMEL Gulfstream II-III-IV-V L-300Washington, DC

What is PT?????

>What is PT?????Peter Tishma. The others can fill you in on the things he has done.

Here's the long and short (up to the point this was written): http://www.avsim.com/pages/0902/pt_again.html