Nick Dobda

Overwing exit - config warning horn?

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I watched flightdeck2sim video the other day (great vids btw) and saw a tip to push the throttles up and back quick during taxi to see if you get the config warning. Makes sense to me so I started doing it. 

Tonight I pushed the throttles up and back - got no config warning but did get the master caution to come on. The door warning was illuminated in the caution box and the over wing exit lights in the OH illuminated. 

To me it seemed like the random latching error PMDG programmed in. However it did not go away (the throttles were back down to idle). 

I waited about 20 seconds, then figured I had to do something, so I cycled the door through the computer. The error didn't clear - I figured what the heck, I'll start takeoff and see if the warning clears. 

Clearly I should have pulled to the side and sorted things out - as I'm starting to gain altitude the pressure warning goes off... and its this time I decide to switch to external view and yeah I didn't shut the overwing exit doors.... actually I think I cycled too fast and the doors opened... but didn't close.

 

Anyway, I'm just curious, why does the config horn not sound if a door is really unlatched (or open).


Second, why did the warning lights come on in the first place? The overwing exit doors were not open originally, they were only opened after I cycled too quickly and didn't close them.

PMDG... that random bug error... the way that is programmed, if you are unfortunate enough to have that door bug error come on at a time where you are performing that quick throttle up test, what happens? Does the error clear or do the false indications stay on until you throttle up for the takeoff?

I am just wondering does your bug have a bug? 

 

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the  config  warning  has  nothing  to  do with  the  doors   being  unlatched, it  only  comes on if  you havnt  config the aircraft  for  take  off  correctly

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2 hours ago, pete_auau said:

the  config  warning  has  nothing  to  do with  the  doors   being  unlatched, it  only  comes on if  you havnt  config the aircraft  for  take  off  correctly

Not technically correct; the 737 will throw a warning on advancing the thrust levers if the door latches are not all home. (Exits not latched would be an incorrectly configured airplane) The overwing exit latches sometimes have a small delay in the auto-latch sequence that can trigger a warning on takeoff; I am not sure if this is just a general master caution or if it is considered part of the takeoff config system. This is a known quirk of the real 737NG that PMDG have recreated. I have had it maybe 3 times in all my hundreds of PMDG NGX flights. 

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3 hours ago, 77west said:

Not technically correct; the 737 will throw a warning on advancing the thrust levers if the door latches are not all home. (Exits not latched would be an incorrectly configured airplane) The overwing exit latches sometimes have a small delay in the auto-latch sequence that can trigger a warning on takeoff; I am not sure if this is just a general master caution or if it is considered part of the takeoff config system. This is a known quirk of the real 737NG that PMDG have recreated. I have had it maybe 3 times in all my hundreds of PMDG NGX flights. 

Okay  thx  for the info although  could't  find  the info  in the fcom  only  found   focm  15.20.5   there is no mention of  the overhead  door  triggering  the  take off  alarm  sound?

fcom 1 40 38  says  when the the overhead  latches  are open the the warning lights appear  on the doors annunicator panel  and  master  caution light   doesnt mentioned  anything  about  the  sound

Never mind   only  gives  the  caution  as  you have  explained not  the  take  off  warning   sound see what happens  when its late  at night

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2 hours ago, 77west said:

This is a known quirk of the real 737NG that PMDG have recreated. 

Yes I've had this warning too - and it makes sense that the plane isn't configured for takeoff if the latches aren't engaged. Which is why I was wondering why the horn doesn't sound, just the warning lights.

The background question was in the context of the simulation, can bumping the throttles up and back to test for configuration throw the programmed bug for a loop or is it a non-issue? I say in the context of the sim because obviously there are no real latches that aren't engaged but some code in the programming that triggers that random error. I was wondering for that program to work properly (throw a caution on and back off to simulate the real life bug) do you have to be in at takeoff thrust for longer then just a blip?

I've had the latch bug happen on takeoff several times, and all times it cleared up after a few seconds. When it came on last night I wasn't actually taking off so it wasn't a normal sequence of events.. I had throttled back down to idle and the warning indications stayed on -I couldn't figure out how to clear them.

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some  times  opening  the overhead  door  and  closing  them  again will clear  the  cautions as long   as  your  on the ground

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37 minutes ago, pete_auau said:

some  times  opening  the overhead  door  and  closing  them  again will clear  the  cautions as long   as  your  on the ground

Yeah, the doors wouldn't shut in the air... found that out the hard way, LOL

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18 hours ago, Nick Dobda said:

Yes I've had this warning too - and it makes sense that the plane isn't configured for takeoff if the latches aren't engaged. Which is why I was wondering why the horn doesn't sound, just the warning lights.

The background question was in the context of the simulation, can bumping the throttles up and back to test for configuration throw the programmed bug for a loop or is it a non-issue? I say in the context of the sim because obviously there are no real latches that aren't engaged but some code in the programming that triggers that random error. I was wondering for that program to work properly (throw a caution on and back off to simulate the real life bug) do you have to be in at takeoff thrust for longer then just a blip?

I've had the latch bug happen on takeoff several times, and all times it cleared up after a few seconds. When it came on last night I wasn't actually taking off so it wasn't a normal sequence of events.. I had throttled back down to idle and the warning indications stayed on -I couldn't figure out how to clear them.

All the times I have got it, after advancing to around 50% N1, I just wait a few seconds at this power setting for it to clear before engaging TOGA. If it has not cleared within around 4-5 seconds I would reject and bring back to idle.

What I dont know (dont have FCOMS handy) is what N1 or TLA triggers the latches to lock; and also what triggers the warning horn.

I suppose if you increase power a bit more than normal on taxi (50% would be bordering on naughty) and this triggers the warning and you immediately decrease, it could mess with the logic - warning system waiting for latches to engage, latches are like "nah bro powers at idle now we can chill"

I would think a full latch engagement would need at least 3-4 seconds at above the latch engage trigger to clear the warning.

Dont you just love the quirks of these planes!

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14 minutes ago, 77west said:

All the times I have got it, after advancing to around 50% N1, I just wait a few seconds at this power setting for it to clear before engaging TOGA. If it has not cleared within around 4-5 seconds I would reject and bring back to idle.

What I dont know (dont have FCOMS handy) is what N1 or TLA triggers the latches to lock; and also what triggers the warning horn.

I suppose if you increase power a bit more than normal on taxi (50% would be bordering on naughty) and this triggers the warning and you immediately decrease, it could mess with the logic - warning system waiting for latches to engage, latches are like "nah bro powers at idle now we can chill"

I would think a full latch engagement would need at least 3-4 seconds at above the latch engage trigger to clear the warning.

Dont you just love the quirks of these planes!

Wes  there is no audio  warning sounds   for  the overhead  latches being  opened  only  indication are  the  warning  caution  coming  on  and  the  light  on thee  door annunciating  panel  telling  which  door is  opened.   if you want  to test it  out  open  the  overhead door  an  advanced  the throttles  all you get  is  the master  caution and  the door  annuicater panel light  coming  on

focm  15.20.5

fcom 1 40 38 

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5 hours ago, 77west said:

 suppose if you increase power a bit more than normal on taxi (50% would be bordering on naughty) and this triggers the warning and you immediately decrease, it could mess with the logic - warning system waiting for latches to engage, latches are like "nah bro powers at idle now we can chill"

Dont you just love the quirks of these planes!

Such a cool plane, I agree. The logic - it probably gets more complicated in the sim - I wouldn't think they programmed it to the level of complexity that you are describing in the real plan. I was wondering if when I throttled back down the bug program threw a fit and wouldn't clear. 

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