> Try finding a small airport when visibility is 3 miles,>ceiling 1000 ft, everything looks the same, and you are too>low to receive a VOR. That's what real SEL pilots run in to. >Often when the fuel is getting low. >These days, not carrying at least a handheld GPS, is about as dumb as having no radio; although some simmers seem to think it's cheating. GPS = instant nearest airports, restricted spaces, and much more. L.Adamson

>>I hope you enjoyed the show.I did indeed. Judge John Deed. Quality BBC drama.Vmc is a variable. You need to grasp the difference between the quoted Vmc for certification purposes and the probable affect conditions on the day will have on Vmc. As you are Google's best customer, do a search with the term "Factors Affecting Vmc" if you don't believe me. Here's a good one to help you out:http://avstop.com/AC/FlightTraingHandbook/...nstrations.html>>NO NO YAWN. Your going to get yourself hurt with mistaken assumptions >>like that! Have you ever seen a chart suggesting that you adjust your >>stall speed assumptions for INDICATED ALTITUDE? Do ya think ya gotta >>run that little Skyhawk up to 80 kts to get her to take off at Denver? >>Or do ya think it just takes you longer to get her to rotate AT NORMAL >>INDICATED AIRSPEEDS??????????It is at this point that I think "more fool me". How it has taken me so long to be convinced that you truely do not know the basics. The general pattern has been confusion on your part until the subject has been introduced and then you've gone away, read up on it and then come back and try a riposte based on the new info. It has been quite entertaining, but I shall do the decent thing as the game's up lad :D"Mornington Cresent!"

<>I KNEW you would chime in with that. LOL (-:You are, of course, correct!Best regards,Jim

><as dumb as having no radio; although some simmers seem to>think it's cheating. >>>>I KNEW you would chime in with that. LOL (-:>>You are, of course, correct!>>Best regards,>>JimOf course! :D It's one of my favorite aviation subjects!L.Adamson --- the moving map GPS adovacate

I know. 258 replies. WOWJimCYWG

Yes, and it has reached the ridiculus.. :) I think 258 is enough as all that could be said has been said, and other topics need some exposure. So, with regret, I am now locking this thread. Consider it a record breaker (or whatever...) :)

Nope again YAWN.<>No, you need to stop changing the game in the middle of the rules. On the REPEATED occasions you have been proven wrong, you either ignore the issue and go on to the next one.What YOU need to grasp is that Air Minimum Control Speed or Vmca is, AS YOUR OWN ARTICLE POINTED OUT (see below) is a FIXED speed determined by the manufacturer with a SPECIFIC definition and has the force of LAW. What you further need to understand is that it is entirely possible to operate an aircraft both above and below such FIXED values as Vmca but the Vmca DOES NOT CHANGE unless the manufacturer were to amend its POH...a practice which they rarely feel the need to do based upon current weather conditions...sir.I readily concur that many writers, including those who contribute to FAA literature, often AS A CONVENIENCE, use the acronmym "VMC" to describe a speed at which a given aircraft, in an engine-out circumstance, can no longer maintain a heading under a given set of environmental conditions. As those conditions change, so does aircraft performance along a number of lines. But the legally defined Vmca does not change with altitude...period.There is someone else who recognized what you fail to...and that is the author of the article you cited! That author writes as follows:"Banking at least 5 degrees into the good engine ensures that the airplane will be controllable at any speed above ***the certificated Vmc***, that the airplane will be in a minimum drag configuration for best climb performance, and that the stall characteristics will not be degraded. By citing "the certificated Vmc" the author CLEARLY labels his other references to VMC as a matter of convenience.Can you at least agree, YAWN, that the certificated VMC does not change with altitude? It would be noble of you to do so.I further admire you for but point out your duplicity in quoting "internet sources" to sustain your arguments after having chastised me for doing likewise.But with respect to the matter of whether the speed at which directional control can be maintained in SE operations at given altitudes, you have quoted authority that it does and I have quoted authority that it doesn't.Personally, not being an aeronautical engineer, I don't have a clue which authority is correct. But this I do know. If I ever have an engine failure after departure at 200 agl (the premise of this sub-thread)I will, at all costs, not operate the aircraft below the OFFICIAL Vmca, regardless of altitude. You go ahead and get out your whiz wheel or hand held computer, and you figure out what the "actual" VMC might be given the current temperature at the moment if you want. But you'll probably be dead before your calculations are complete.<>Right. In the face of overwhelming odds, declare victory and leave the field. The classic tactic of the defeated. What took you so long?(-: