Sesquashtoo

A high z(17,18,19) ortho tile, and the XP11 Texture slider...

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As I finish off a run of new tiles, I have a supposition to the members,

I wonder what the 'filter effect' would be, on a z17,z18, or a top of the line, z19 Ortho Tile, when you have the XP11 Texture Quality Slider at anything less than either Max, or Max (uncompressed)?

I would imagine that there would have to be a dumming down of the full clarity output of those tiles, if you have 'cut back ' the rendering of textures, with the use of the slider, at less than Max.

Also, I wonder if the Number of World Objects, only affects the elements displayed in the Overlay of that tile?

I do run my Texture Quality slider at Max, one below Max (un-compressed)  so there will be no possibility of a dumming down of the highly crisp, well defined, and clear, texture(s) in z17 and higher, that you wanted to have there in the first place.  So...the large question is...IF, by sliding to the left on the Texture Quality control slider, are you making then totally redundant, your creation, or purchased usage of a high z-rated, Ortho scenery tile?  If you can not run on your system, with a good FPS yield, and still have the Texture Quality Slider at Max or higher, are you merely wasting then, your time as well as money?

Perhaps, for the ' I'm thinking about getting into Ortho generation, myself' user, they might want to get the definitive answer from Laminar at the above supposition, for if that Texture Slider, DOES impact the in percentage of rendering out to visual, that ortho tile at z17 and higher, perhaps the user should consider rendering all tiles at a straight z16, with no higher surrounding z-ratings for the airport boundaries.  You will save time, expense, and probably will not have wasted your time, in creating high visual yield tiles, but then XP11 filters that full potential 'highest quality' out in post rendering 'filter' of the elements of that tile, to the screen display, via a dummed down Texture Quality Slider setting,--- internally.

Hmmmmm......

Ses

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Hey Mitch, I think with your keen eye you should be able to just eyeball the image and see if there is any degradation on a lower setting. I did generate one z17 and one z18 tile just as test to see how it looked. I must say that with my max settings I thought they looked a little pale in comparison to Aerofly's tiles. Even at 4000 ft, I decided I just could not live with it. I am so spoiled by the the low and slow effect from FSX/P3D and now XP's scenery.  I did try a z19 but gave up after the size creeped to 10gig.  I may look at other alternatives to see what will work for me. But hey, thanks for your help and keep posting your findings!

Bob

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There is VERY VERY little loss of quality going from Uncompressed to Max but what you do get is a butt load of savings on VRAM cost and so my recommendation is if you fly with a large quantity of Ortho (such as with me having the entire US coverd in ZL16) you CANNOT run with uncompressed.   You'll get a stuttering mess far to often as you easily exceed 12gigs on the VRAM needs.   When I was flying on Uncompressed I saw total VRAM used at 19GIGS!!!!!!!!    Turn down one notch to MAX and my VRAM was at 7gigs.   So if you are an Ortho flyer, don't fly with uncompressed textures imo.  Take it or leave it.

Also, world objects slider has zero effect on the actual Ortho scenery under all the OSM/Autogen data.

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2 hours ago, N1G said:

Hey Mitch, I think with your keen eye you should be able to just eyeball the image and see if there is any degradation on a lower setting. I did generate one z17 and one z18 tile just as test to see how it looked. I must say that with my max settings I thought they looked a little pale in comparison to Aerofly's tiles. Even at 4000 ft, I decided I just could not live with it. I am so spoiled by the the low and slow effect from FSX/P3D and now XP's scenery.  I did try a z19 but gave up after the size creeped to 10gig.  I may look at other alternatives to see what will work for me. But hey, thanks for your help and keep posting your findings!

Bob

Hi Bob...and here I am thinking how much more crisp, my z19 is over default AE2!  

I will tell you the full secret of custom-made Ortho, Bob...I always come across into Canada from Michigan, at the Blue Water Bridge, for my wife and I really love the town of; Grand Bend, Ontario, Canada, and where we love to camp, at The Pinery

https://www.ontarioparks.com/park/pinery

....and so know Sarnia, Ontario really well.  Now, I am flying over that city, and region, following the coast of the lake, to Highway 21 North, and will do a fly-over of the Park, and Grand Bend, north.  (I'm taking a break from tile generating, and am enjoying what I have captured....thousands of square miles of ortho goodness!)   Well...the power of Ortho...at z17 and higher, at 2,800-5,500 AGL...and OSM, is that every refinery, every storage tank, on very real streets...suburbs,  the Sarnia Downtown, the Casino, the Blue Water Bridge....the place were my wife and I get off the Goldwing, and eat some chips from the chip wagon...and watch the boats battle the current at the mouth of the Sarnia River to break out into Lake Huron...is so cool...Bob..it's all there now...not a some-what blurry unfocused, general graphic representation....nope...every element of Sarnia and region...even to the actual curve and banks of the river, is done to the penny!

I am having such a blast...(just like I did on the weekend at Myrtle Beach, S.C.   Everyplace I have been, and know like the back of my hand...has so far been faithfully rendered, and is 100 percent accurate and with believable visual clarity. Your mind doesn't have to work, to make out, and figure out,  what you believe you are viewing. All of it...wow.

Back to heading up the coast of Lake Huron...and to do a fly-over of The Pinery/ Grand Bend, Ontario, Canada.

Cheers,

Post Edit:  Just approaching it, Bob...and there it is...just looking on the point as in real life...totally, with the beautiful half-moon of Grand Bend Beach to the north of it...WOW! The entire Pinery Provincial Park, is just above my left wing leading edge...

Three fly-over's at z17.

 

Cessna_172_SP_33.png

Cessna_172_SP_34.png


 

Cessna_172_SP_32.png

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1 hour ago, Kuragiman said:

There is VERY VERY little loss of quality going from Uncompressed to Max but what you do get is a butt load of savings on VRAM cost and so my recommendation is if you fly with a large quantity of Ortho (such as with me having the entire US coverd in ZL16) you CANNOT run with uncompressed.   You'll get a stuttering mess far to often as you easily exceed 12gigs on the VRAM needs.   When I was flying on Uncompressed I saw total VRAM used at 19GIGS!!!!!!!!    Turn down one notch to MAX and my VRAM was at 7gigs.   So if you are an Ortho flyer, don't fly with uncompressed textures imo.  Take it or leave it.

Also, world objects slider has zero effect on the actual Ortho scenery under all the OSM/Autogen data.

Yeppers, I am running at Max also, as you, the load-ins in GB's can become crazy, and Max (uncompressed) , and I only have the capacity of a GTX1070 stock.  It all works, though...very happy with the whole enterprise!

 

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My understanding is:

  • going from max to compressed does NOT change the resolution but - as it says - only keeps compressed textures in VRAM (which indeed introduces a very slight quality degradation, but nothing most of us could really spot)
  • every other, lower setting is - step-by-step - reducing texture resolution by cutting it in half. So if you would need to step down a step in this area to - for example - use a z18 ... then you also might - instead - directly use z17 (as the difference between z levels is also similarly the resolution of textures cut in half).
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Mitch, those park areas are gorgeous! I have been to Canada, but only through Washington State at Port Angeles. My wife and I also enjoyed many beautiful areas. Peace and Tranquility, that is our goal, and we are headed out soon in the Big Red Truck and the 5th Wheel, never to look back.  I may take a look at the Ortho down the road, but for now, I will sit back and just fly. But again, I thank you as always for your dedication and of course your eagerness to share what you learn! :ampun:

Bob

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8 hours ago, alpilotx said:

My understanding is:

  • going from max to compressed does NOT change the resolution but - as it says - only keeps compressed textures in VRAM (which indeed introduces a very slight quality degradation, but nothing most of us could really spot)
  • every other, lower setting is - step-by-step - reducing texture resolution by cutting it in half. So if you would need to step down a step in this area to - for example - use a z18 ... then you also might - instead - directly use z17 (as the difference between z levels is also similarly the resolution of textures cut in half).

Thank your for that. That makes perfect sense. That is what had me pondering a couple of days ago..unless you can run at Max or Max(uncompressed), you are probably wasting your time to create, bandwidth, and storage capacity at z17,z18,z19, even if you only use those z factors to surround your airport properties.  That's what made me think of that in the first place. Right now, like Kuragiman, have it down to the Max (compressed) and that's what those The Pinery Pics are shown with, that texture slider setting.  I didn't know that each z factor below what you 'might' want to run with, is actually a full 1/2 acuity reduction. Man...that's huge! :blush:

 

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7 hours ago, N1G said:

Mitch, those park areas are gorgeous! I have been to Canada, but only through Washington State at Port Angeles. My wife and I also enjoyed many beautiful areas. Peace and Tranquility, that is our goal, and we are headed out soon in the Big Red Truck and the 5th Wheel, never to look back.  I may take a look at the Ortho down the road, but for now, I will sit back and just fly. But again, I thank you as always for your dedication and of course your eagerness to share what you learn! :ampun:

Bob

Have fun, with the Big Red Truck and caboose!  The best to you and your wife, Bob!

Have fun!

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1 hour ago, Sesquashtoo said:

  I didn't know that each z factor below what you 'might' want to run with, is actually a full 1/2 acuity reduction. Man...that's huge! :blush:

Thats just a plain "logical" way to reduce the overhead created by texture size ... Cutting by half (along each of the two axis! --> meaning texture area reduction by factor 4) is the only logical (and visually homogenous) way to do it.

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Mitch, funny you should mention CA. Here is my favorite place of all time when I was growing up. http://www.visitmammoth.com/  Have not been there in ages but it is on the list to go there when we begin our ditch suburbia campaign. But..................I will still be able to sit down and tie into the RV's 46 inch TV with my Flight Controls, and break out the Martin by the campfire (as long as the weather won't affect the guitar of course)

(-:

Bob

 

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1 hour ago, alpilotx said:

Thats just a plain "logical" way to reduce the overhead created by texture size ... Cutting by half (along each of the two axis! --> meaning texture area reduction by factor 4) is the only logical (and visually homogenous) way to do it.

Thank you very much for that, Andras! :)  So for my personal re-cap...since I have generated tiles at z17/z19 components, I do NOT want to run at anything less than Max, or Max (uncompressed). Got it.

Mitch

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1 hour ago, N1G said:

Mitch, funny you should mention CA. Here is my favorite place of all time when I was growing up. http://www.visitmammoth.com/  Have not been there in ages but it is on the list to go there when we begin our ditch suburbia campaign. But..................I will still be able to sit down and tie into the RV's 46 inch TV with my Flight Controls, and break out the Martin by the campfire (as long as the weather won't affect the guitar of course)

(-:

Bob

 

.....guitar, of course...

LOL....so there's gonna be a guy sitting at a campfire with a guitar...huh?   That's why I purchased and am learning the Irish Penny Flute in the scale of 'D'.  I can do a pretty good tear-jerker of 'Oh Danny Boy!' and I have one Irish reel down as well.  I played over the Memorial Weekend, with a chap who had a 12 String...and Bob..let me tell ya...does the Irish Penny Whistle, and a 12 string EVER sound good together. We had about four campsites clear out to our little fire, with my total embarrassment, that I was at this date, a two-song, wonder...LOLOLOL.  But that's ok..'cause then I went back to my campsite...brought back my 5 string Banjo...(with my wife rolling her eyes..and muttering' "...ok...here we go...midnight, and they both will still be playing...here we go...":...and we did.  We did Dueling Banjo's, Rocky Mountain Breakdown, Rocky Top (I sang, but scared the kiddies...), Orange Blossom Special...AND...with a lot of foot stompin', hand clapping, and PLENTY of beer and Mexican-inspired, Tequila loaded, eye-crossin' tasty sippers...yeah..all of that!   Seriously Bob, that guy was rockin' good on that 12 string. He and I both very much, enjoyed playing with the other. BTW, I have found my Banjo, within 2 minutes of playing at a campsite sitting on top of the picnic table, to be an absolute GUITAR MAGNET....for as far as the sound travels....oh yeah.  Two minutes or less, and ten guys and gals show up with their guitars in hand...only one other banjo ever showed up in the last 15 years of camp playing...but guitars?.....Too many to count, LOL!

"Bango...I hate autofill!, LOL".... had to edit to Banjo...lol.

Mitch

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Mitch, you crack me up. I have played many times camping and attracted a few myself. Reminded me of the movie "Deliverance" though. So my experience was a little different than yours I am sure. The truth is there is a lot of the picking going on in many of these campsites. We were up in Sante Fe and there was a guy who was giving lessons at the RV Park we were at. He made a living on the road. He would stay in a place for 2-3 months at a time. I plan on picking and grinning too very soon. Love it. Just learned a version of Ed Gurards fingerstyle version of Moon River for my wife. She loves it especially when I talk to her first with a latin accent and then play her the song. Don't tell anybody. Now, I am not sure if I will play that at a campsite, but you never know. Who knows Mitch, we just might meet up one day. I am very interested in meeting you!

Bob

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11 hours ago, N1G said:

Mitch, you crack me up. I have played many times camping and attracted a few myself. Reminded me of the movie "Deliverance" though. So my experience was a little different than yours I am sure. The truth is there is a lot of the picking going on in many of these campsites. We were up in Sante Fe and there was a guy who was giving lessons at the RV Park we were at. He made a living on the road. He would stay in a place for 2-3 months at a time. I plan on picking and grinning too very soon. Love it. Just learned a version of Ed Gurards fingerstyle version of Moon River for my wife. She loves it especially when I talk to her first with a latin accent and then play her the song. Don't tell anybody. Now, I am not sure if I will play that at a campsite, but you never know. Who knows Mitch, we just might meet up one day. I am very interested in meeting you!

Bob

If you see a guy over there, on that other picnic table, playing a banjo, and he looks like Mr. Clean (but with a few more pounds, er...here and there, )..yep...that would be me...c'mon over...and bring that guitar...oh...and a six pack....lol.:cool:

Cheers, Bob!  With that fifth-wheel behind you...don't scare the Moose...!!!!!!

BTW, you slayed me with that 'latin accent routine....I just can hear it in my mind...and then break out laughing, all over again....lol!

...we are bad...now back to the thread content...sheesh! LOL

Mitch

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