ILS in AFCAD

[Guest rwooton]

I'm sure this has been asked before, but I am unable to find it, so my apologies guys.My question has two parts:First, why is it that some airport AFCADs that I've installed have ILSs listed for the runways, but every time I go there I'm to expect a visual approach? Why doesn't ATC recognize the ILS?And I guess second, is what do I do about it, and how do you add an instrument approach to a runway that doesnt have it. I can make it show up and actually work, but ATC doesn't know it's there.ThanksRick Wooton

[Guest martin842]

This problem used to drive me up the wall. If I understand the AFCAD help file correctly, there is no easy solution. The only thing that can be done is to delete the present runway and create a new runway from scratch.In order for an ILS to be recognised by ATC, it needs to be

[burle1 0]

Rick,AFCAD can add the ILS facility, but it cannot add the instrument approach procedure for ATC to assign.The approach procedure must be coded and compiled into a BGL scenery file using BGLCOMP from Microsoft, following the meager instructions in the BGLCOMP SDK.Which airport and approach in particular? If these are US Airports I might be able to help.Todd

[Guest rwooton]

One for example is KLAS. I bought Simflyers KLAS, and tried two different AFCADs from Project AI, but neither worked. Now ALL the runways are visual approach only.But I have this one several others too.

[RFields5421 1]

The answer above is correct.AFCAD can add an ILS to a runway - works very well.AFCAD cannot add an APPROACH to a runway - way too much extra XML coding required - and AFCAD does not use the same schema as Microsoft's BGLComp.(Of course AFCAD was released almost six months before Microsoft bothered to let us see the BGLComp program and it's SDK)KLAS is one of the easy ones because Jim Vile has already created the new approach procedures - complete procedures with missed approaches, transitions and turns to avoid terrain.Search for Active ILS in the Avsim library or the author name Jim Vile - he's done many airports - and while he does include AFCAD files - he also includes approach .BGL files which work with other AFCAD files.Just one hint - please put the files in the exact folders which Jim describes in his readme - many people think they "know more about scenery folders" and that's just plain wrong.If you are more interested in adding approaches to airport runways - check the AFCAD section of the Project AI forums - they's been working on this for about two years. http://www.projectai.com/discuss/index.php?board=22.0

[ronzie 21]

You might wish to check out Radar Contact payware V4 ATC. An included utility reads the APxxx.bgl files and then reads the afcad2.bgl's to build its own database. It also works great with the "crossing" runways technique excluding those psuedo runways that do not have start points.This will not affect MS AI approaches but will affect yours.The result is that navaids and runway properties you add with afcad do affect their ATC in relation to you in that your changes will take priority. RC does give a priority to the active AI is using to avoid conflict if AI are present but you still can request the approach (IAP) of your choice. RC also implements AI collision protection to some degree.Their forum is here on AVSIM.

[tgibson 11]

Hi,Luckily, this is not true. AFCAD will assign an ILS to a runway either when you create it or any time after. As stated below, what it doesn't do (ever) is create the ILS approach information needed by ATC to give you the ILS approach instead of a visual one. You need to code that XML by hand.Hope this helps,--Tom GibsonCal Classic Propliner Page: http://www.calclassic.comFreeflight Design Shop: http://www.freeflightdesign.comDrop by! ___x_x_(")_x_x___

[Guest rwooton]

>>KLAS is one of the easy ones because Jim Vile has already>created the new approach procedures - complete procedures with>missed approaches, transitions and turns to avoid terrain.>Now I'm very confused. Jim Vile added ILS appraoches to those runways that didn't have them before. (I've seen that.) So what happened to the approaches that were always there before? 25L and 25R don't have instrument approaches any more. Just because I added the payware scenery?

[RFields5421 1]

One of Jim's cardinal rules, and mine, is to NEVER change the default APnnnnnn.bgl files - which hold the airport approach information.One simple reason is that there is no perfect decompiler.Another is that there is no need. Microsoft built into FS2004 a well documented way to replace almost everything in one airport with additional files in the CORRECT folders.Check your file - SceneryNAMWsceneryAP917190.BGL and see if it is dated May 31, 2003 - if it is different an addon might have overwritten the original.I've just looked at Jim's file again - it does need to be used with Steve Parkinson's enclosed AFCAD file - or another crossing runway AFCAD file setup correctly for the airport.However, Jim's file only adds three ILS approaches for Rwy 1L, 7R and 19R - it has no code to remove the other default approaches in his file.i don't have the SimFlyers scenery on this computer - I'll check to see if I have it at home later this evening.

[Guest rwooton]

>>Check your file - SceneryNAMWsceneryAP917190.BGL and see if>it is dated May 31, 2003 - if it is different an addon might>have overwritten the original.>Good call. Sure enough, that file was last modified last Dec, which is when I got the scenery. I extracted the original file off the FS9 CDs and copied it back in on top of it. Gonna see what it does now... if it doesn't work with the scenery, then I'll just go back to what I had and get rid of the new scenery.Now I need to double check other sceneries I've added and see if they overwrote those files too.Thanks for your help.Rick

[Guest rwooton]

Well, now I'm at a loss.I recopied in the original file, and tried it again. Approaches still aren't listed. So I disabled the Simflyers scenery, and reinstalled my AFCAD file for the default airport and tried it again. They are STILL not listed.Anyone else have a thought?

[jvile 1]

When you say "Approaches still aren't listed" where is it that you are trying to read or list the actual approaches for 25R/L?Also keep in mind that if a scenery designer over-wrote your APnnnnnnn.bgl then it is a sure bet they also added some files that have not been removed properly.Simflyers is one of those scenery's that if you deactivate the scenery it does not fix the problem.You must do a uninstall and then also make sure the uninstall replaces the APnnnnnnn back to the original file and removes all other files from other active folders. What you are seeing is not new to FS9 and the way scenery designers corrupt and break all the original approach Jeppesen plate data which destroys the ILS system at 3rd party airports.What confuses Cloud9 (EHAM), Simflyers (KIAH, KMCO, etc) Flytampa (KMIA), Image software (KDEN) is that the airport scenery owns all the approach data for the ILS runway and the runway owns the actual ILS/GP/DME transmitters (AFCAD) for the User Aircraft panel only.The eye candy is very impressive for these airports but you should expect visual approaches only in clear weather for the airport to work for the User Aircraft and not AI Traffic.

[mikesflight 0]

Hi RickI can understand your frustration, but it is still only an ATC call. When you add an ILS to an airport with AFCAD you can simply approach tuned into the ILS on your Nav button frequency. ATC will stay say "...when you sight the runway.." and so on, but what the heck, just acknowledge and then ignore them and fly in on your newly created ILS. I often add an ILS to airports when I go to new areas.If you haven't made a note of the frequency look at the ILS via your map icon (need to zoom in a bit) and the ILS is displayed.CheersMike

[Guest rwooton]

For example, they say expect a visual approach to rwy 25L. So I go to select another approach, and the ILS approach is not even listed any more.I'm a real pilot, and have flown into Vegas many times, so it's a popular destination in my simming. I'd rather lose the pretty scenery than lose the functionality of the airport.I'll try totally uninstalling the Simflyers scenery, then I'll even go so far as to delete the AP file and recopy it in from the CD so I can be sure that the original is the one that's there and see if that helps.

[Guest rwooton]

I understand that, and I do that all the time too.But my biggest headache is the ILS that existed in the default that are now no longer there. I just deleted the Simflyers scenery and put back what I had, and now it still doesn't work.I have one of the crosswind runway AFCADS that I had for a long time before I got the SF scenery, and it always worked perfectly. Now when I test it, it keeps telling me to expect a visual approach to rwy 23 (which doesn't exist - only as the 10' long crosswind runway), and when I try to change to 25L and the ILS - the ILS approach is no longer available.Now I've gone back and deleted EVERYTHING that has anything to do with Vegas, except that AFCAD file, and I'm testing it again. Putting the default AP file back into the NAMW directory didn't fix the problem.