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Guest defpotec

Moving Trains

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We know there are moving vehicles ;) and we know the ACES team developed train sim. So, will this mean FSX will have a capability for moving trains? Please tell us...John.

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Guest tdragger

There's one big difference with trains. Can you guess what it is?

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Guest

> There's one big difference with trains. Can you guess what it is?The AI is alot less difficult to program because trains don't need to give way, over take etc. But they can change to other tracks.

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Guest Robin.B

They're several pieces connected together that have to follow a line, and it becomes complicated in turns?

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Guest Knikolaes

>Maybe he's talking about MSTS...LOL.>>JK with ya Chris :-)**chuckles** Aye that too. Either way, seems like trains are becoming extinct as a transportation alternative even for cargo. Some of my family are retired railroad, and so that is a piece of conversation often around here.Seriously in answer to the original question, I have no idea how they are different from vehicles other than they are on tracks. So I have no idea how that would appear in FS as "animations" LOL.

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>Huh?:-) :-) :-) :-)Maybe because they are articulated and would have to "change shape" everytime they went around a bend/corner/curve/turn etc.Cheers,Chris Porter:-outtaPerthWestern Australia

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Guest tdragger

Ding! Ding! Ding!Kudos to maxter as well, but your answer was posted first. Yes, the big difference for us is that trains are articulated. For cars it's easy to simplify the problem by reducing the object to a point and just have that point follow a line.For trains we need to manage the relationship between cars. There are several techniques for doing this in a game where they are just supporting players but none are perfect. (And there are several differences like greater constraints on grade and turn radius.) We've thought quite a bit about the problem, I just can't say now what will happen to trains in FS. (And no, we can't just take the code from TS and plop it into FS. Wish we could...)

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Guest Robin.B

Isn't it possible to make each carriage of the train have a car logic? For example, make FS think that there are 4 or 5, elongated cars driving right behind each other and each carriage follows a line just like a car, just that they're right behind each other.

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Guest wingnut2

> Isn't it possible to make each carriage of the train have a car logic?This is it, instead of 1 point there are X (as in Xbox). Each car will have its own position on the line, and hence if there is a curve each car will have a different angle based on the gradient. Sometimes you can over complicate things ;)

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Guest cwright

That's exactly what I did when I added dynamic objects support to my AutoAsm scenery design program. If you add a train you can specify the number of carriages and the carriages move together as a single object. However, when going around corners it still looks a bit odd! For anyone interested you can see the thread about this on the FS scenery forum around the end of October 2005. There are some screen shots including trains. Here's an example: http://www.kline.demon.co.uk/as9.jpg Unfortunately the current FS dynamic scenery system seems to have a limit of about 220 objects (could the FS team members who are active on this forum confirm this or make any comments?) and also a limit on the number of path points. I would be fairly confident FSX has a completely new and far more powerful dynamic scenery system that hopefully has no arbitrary limits built into it. Best regards, Chris http://www.kline.demon.co.uk/autoasm.zip

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Guest wingnut2

Thats not a bad effort there, I could believe thats a train :) Even a basic architecture would be better than nothing, and then the addon guys will go crazy..

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Guest Derek D

Didn't CFS1 have moving trains as targets that you could bomb?

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Guest Knikolaes

CFS3 has them, too. I bomb them all the time just because I know they aren't going to turn into a valley and hide from me **chuckles**

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Go to Europe, trains are not dying out there. Gas costs a lot there too. I think that's why trains remain a popular mode of transport in Europe.In fact I think as fuel prices climb in the USA, in the future you'll see a re-appearance of passenger trains in the USA.

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Guest davidvoogd

I agree, with the increased fuel prices in North America, cargo and transit railroads might just get busier. Passenger service by train completely sucks in Canada, it costs less to fly lol. The only train I ever take is the "Go-Train" commuter train to Toronto if I have to go there for some reason, much easier than driving.A little off topic though lol.As for trains in FS, I think having one object that looks funny around turns would get too may complaints to justify doing it. It wouldn't bother me but I could just imagine the forum posts lol. (Mind you if there was a simple on off switch that defaults to off, that could let us have them if we don't mind them taking corners in an odd way).

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Guest nels

Your right trains are very common in Europe. In fact France has an excellent reputation for its famous TGV service.The UKs system however is dilapidated and forever trying to catch up with its ever increasingly thrown together network.I'm not that bothered about trains in flight simulator. Making train stations would be quite a (boring) task too.NelsFrance

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There is another problem with trains - in the US they are usually on single track, and only meet at sidings (small stretches of double track). I assume that FS wouldn't include siding logic, and thus two trains would "merge" on single track when traveling in opposite directions.BTW, trains in the USA are anything but going away (for freight). They haul more freight now than ever before. They just use many less people (and less trains) to do it.If Bush has his way (already announced), long distance US passenger service will end in a year or two, and short distance trains will be the responsibility of the states.Take care,--Tom GibsonCal Classic Propliner Page: http://www.calclassic.comFreeflight Design Shop: http://www.freeflightdesign.comDrop by! ___x_x_(")_x_x___

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Guest Knikolaes

Thanks for that. I onyl know about the US -- I live a secluded life LOL. I just did a check out of mere curiosity to compare transport as I am flying my sweetie here to live with me March 1st.Bus ticket - 23 hour trip - 200 bucksTrain ticket - not possible due to locations (Amtrak doesnt even serve Oklahoma anymore -- can't blame then **laughs** I won;t go NEAR that state -- I even hate flying over it)Plane ticket, gets her here in 3 hours with 1 quick layover in Denver - 230 bucks LOL.Back on topic though, at least having train tracks by themselves, trains or not, is good for VFR purposes :-) Tracks are crucial in a lot of VFR flight :-) I was ever so glad when I installed UT Canada and UT USA and was able to actually find the rail yards in my hometown to be accurate (along with rivers, lakes, roads, etc.)

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Guest Robin.B

Why shouldn't FS have a siding logic? Cars will have to have some kind of a siding logic, so a similar logic can be used on trains. They don't even have to switch tracks if it isn't possible :)

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Guest Bell206freak

Quote:++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++> http://www.kline.demon.co.uk/as9.jpg++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Sorry to derail (no pun intended, LOL) the topic, but I couldn't help but notice how blurry those VC textures are for the default Cessna 172/182 (I'll just say both since they're *nearly* identical). Have you tried the texture fixes by Tony Gould? They add high-resolution 32-bit enhancement that increases the sharpness and reality of the VC.Anyways.. Excellent scenery, though. :)

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Guest Knikolaes

If Bush has his way we'd have nothing at all :-PThat sucks about that Pax trains though. I didn't know that was part of his evil little agenda. He's so busy wanting to hold other country's hands, but even busier tearing us apart :-(

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