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Dave Morgan

Short runways in RC's database

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Posted (edited)

Hello from breezy Mid-Wales.

Many years ago I had a problem with RC not picking up a short runway at my departure airfield. In my memory there's a hint of something about modifying a parameter or adding a switch, possibly to makerwys or maybe in one of the csv files, in order to allow shorter runways down to 1000' or so into RC's database but I can't find it in the suspect thread (or in my memory).

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/374050-airfield-doesnt-show-in-rc-plan/

Am I only imagining that there was such a simple solution? It may have been in Ronzie's second link but that one goes nowhere now.

I'll just add, a propos of nothing, that I'm enjoying some fantastic early spring weather today: sunshine, hail and a seriously fresh breeze.

D

Edited by Dave Morgan

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Hi Dave,

This is from the readme for MakeRwys...

MINIMUM RUNWAY LENGTH
By default MakeRunways imposes a minimum runway length of 1500 feet, otherwise runways are omitted from the data files. This is to eliminate so-called "ghost" runways being
included -- very small runways provided only to allow AI Traffic to be directed better for landings and takeoffs.
If necessary you can override this value. Just use a command line parameter in the form:
/>n where n gives the number of feet to be considered the maximum for exclusion. Take care not to make this too small for fear of including those "ghosts", but if you really do want to see all, you can set />0.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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Thanks Ray.

I'd assumed that clicking Rebuild Scenery DB in RC4 copied the /FS2004/ files into /RCV4/data/ but by watching the timestamps change, I see it's actually overwriting the /FS2004/ files. I guess that means I just have to rerun MakeRwys manually with the />1000 parameter after finishing Rebuild Scenery DB.

Should I copy the correct csv files into /RCV4/data/ and will I need to add the appropriate lines to a4.csv or to any other files?

D

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Dave,

I've not tried this switch method as I don't need very short runways. But assuming everything is installed on the same PC you run MakeRwys first with that switch and once it's completed the relevant files are ready to be copied and converted by RC4.

Open RC4 and select Rebuild Scenery DB. Respond to the WideFS question after which the relevant files are updated automatically by RC4. No need for any manual intervention.

Just check your data\r4.csv and r5.csv have been updated by the process.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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Thanks again Ray.

Using SAYJ as an example, what I've found is this:

I run C:\fs2004\MakeRwys with no switch.
That creates C:\fs2004\r4.csv for only runways longer than 1500 feet, which excludes SAYJ.

I then run it again with the />1000 switch.
That updates C:\fs2004\r4.csv with entries for shorter runways so now it includes SAYJ.

The files in C:\RCV4\data\ are so far untouched.

I launch RC and click Rebuild Scenery DB, going through standard responses. That updates a4.csv, c4.csv and r4.csv in C:\RCV4\data\ but still with no SAYJ. The other data files in there still have a 2006 date. It has also overwritten C:\fs2004\r4.csv with the normal >1500' entries so SAYJ has disappeared again.

At this point, can I redo the manual run with switch and then copy the custom files from C:\fs2004\ into C:\RCV4\data\ ?

Would I also need to add SAYJ manually to C:\RCV4\data\a4.csv ?

The question has arisen only because I've just filled in some more of the gaps in my UK2000 collection and I wanted to clean a few things up before installing the new airports. It's largely academic as I'm only doing short VFR flights but that half-memory has been niggling for a couple of days.

D
 

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Dave, you’re running FS2004 which uses a different MakeRwys.exe. I didn’t check the readme for that version. Check on Pete’s site for the relevant version and the readme inside it.

I would have thought the option would still be available but I haven’t used FS2004 for many years so there might be a slightly different process.

Run MakeRwys again with the switch and then copy r4.csv manually to RC4\data. That’s the runway file. A4 is the airport file and I think c4 is the comms file.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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Hi Ray.

I believe the two versions work in a similar fashion. While I had P3d I was using RC (and MakeRwys) with that sim too.

I have a couple of tangential questions while I work out whether or not I've got this short-runway thing right.

What is the second term in each row of m4.csv? I can see the airport ICAO and the transition altitude but I can't find anything that matches the bit between them.
EGCC , 1515 , 5000

What is indicated by the letters B, D and G in the ILS term in r4.csv (or r5 depending on where you look)? The 180° error in runway heading in this example is the developer's fault. I've never flown there and can't be bothered to investigate...
EGCJ , 0240 , 53.786304 , -1.223475 , 26 , 62.800 , 2598 , 109.30BG , 59 , -4.000 , 53.788151 , -1.218316 , 0 , CT , CL

Alright, three then:
What are CT and CL, the last two terms in r4.csv?

Finally, for FS9 the MakeRwys.bat launched by clicking Rebuild Scenery DB copies r5.csv from \FS2004\ to \RCV4\data\ and renames it. Copying r4.csv (the logical & obvious action) causes a runtime error to do with departure information. A small historical window upon development problems?

D

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Hi Dave,

I can't answer the m4.csv question, but the BG against the ILS frequency in r4.csv indicates the ILS has backcourse and glideslope (could also have D for DME). CT means closed for takeoff and CL is closed for landing.

  • Upvote 1

Ian Box

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14 hours ago, Dave Morgan said:

What is the second term in each row of m4.csv? I can see the airport ICAO and the transition altitude but I can't find anything that matches the bit between them.
EGCC , 1515 , 5000

Dave, I can find no definitive answer but my guess is it's related to the airfield elevation.

EGEF - Fair Isle is 0 (sea level) and VNLK (Tenzing-Hillary Airport) is 20013.

Sorry I can't be of more help but there's nothing in the manual and JD/DT are out of the loop.


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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@ConstVoid

Ian, thanks for that. As is always the case when a clearer thinker points stuff out, it's obvious now. 🙂

 

@Ray Proudfoot

Thanks for your patience Ray, especially given that none of this is really causing a problem, only frustrating my curiosity.

Copying the expanded csv files into \data\ and adding a row to a4.csv works well but with 2000+ runways between 1000 and 1500 feet, and mostly at uncontrolled airfields, I can see me resorting to simply requesting clearance once I'm up...

D

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@Dave Morgan, you must be the first person to need that feature. Good luck! 🙂


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.2 & v3.4, Intel i7-8086K o/c to 4.6Ghz, Nvidia GTX 1080 Ti 11Gb, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, 1Tb Samsung 860 EVO SSD, Asus Prime Z370-A mobo, 32Gb G.Skill DDR4 3000Mhz RAM, Win 10 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

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