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How is this possible? No ARR runway, N1 constantly red

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I am simulating a flight from Quito to La Paz. Two issues I encounter here that I have never encountered before (I am an experienced PMDG 744 pilot with well over 150 legs, so let's assume I have put the right settings in the FMS):1. N1 is constantly in the red! In the beginning I thought this was because a lot of power was needed to climb out of Quito (ALT >9,000 ft) - but it's in the red all through the CLB and CRZ phases. I changed from CLB to CLB2 just to see if anything happens - still in the red. What could be the cause of this? All the flight is in Autothrottle, the first phase of the climb was done in FLCH mode, and later in VNAV mode. All the other engine indicators seem fine.2. There are no runway entries for SLLP (La Paz, Bolivia). The airport itself is in the FMS, but no runways. When selecting the DEP/ARR page in the FMS, selecting ARR for SLLP, a page opens which has "STARS" and "APPROACHES", with "NONE" underneath both of them. Not even an entry for runways. How can it be that there is an airport with no runways?I can't post screenshots here as each of them is 290kb in size (max allowed here is 150kb, right?)Any help appreciated! CheersChris

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You mention that changing from CLB to CLB2 did not solve the issue. The question is, did the thrust reduce at all when you did this? If the change to CLB2 caused absolutely NO reduction in thrust, then I'd say the A/T wasn't active. Hypothetically, it sounds like you might have not armed the A/T, advanced the thrust levers fully forward, pressed the TOGA switches and because the A/T was not armed, it hasn't done anything, instead of being limited to the nominated thrust limit, the engines have obeyed your thust lever command and gone right to maximum thrust.You say you have screenshots, take a look at one of them that shows the PFD, look at the flight mode annunciator (FMA), can you see an A/T mode in green in the leftmost portion of the FMA? If not, there's your answer.If you CAN see a mode annunciated, let us know what mode is showing and we can offer more assistance.Cheers!EDIT: Just a few other thoughts as well: You're flying out of a very high altitude airport, one that is at the edge of the 744's performance capabilities when carrying a normal load. What were the weather conditions like? Temp, QNH, winds etc? What assumed temperature or fixed derate thrust did you set (if any)?


Mark Adeane - NZWN
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The airport without procedures/runways: Check to see if you have a sidstars file for SLLP (it will be in the sidstars folder with filename SLLP.txt). The airac data provides for the existence of an airport but the procedures are in the sidstars section.I found that there is not a file for SLLP at Navdata, but you might be able to get ahold of the last one put out by Terry for cycle 0610.


Dan Downs KCRP

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>You mention that changing from CLB to CLB2 did not solve the>issue. >>The question is, did the thrust reduce at all when you did>this? If the change to CLB2 caused absolutely NO reduction in>thrust, then I'd say the A/T wasn't active. >>Hypothetically, it sounds like you might have not armed the>A/T, advanced the thrust levers fully forward, pressed the>TOGA switches and because the A/T was not armed, it hasn't>done anything, instead of being limited to the nominated>thrust limit, the engines have obeyed your thust lever command>and gone right to maximum thrust.>>You say you have screenshots, take a look at one of them that>shows the PFD, look at the flight mode annunciator (FMA), can>you see an A/T mode in green in the leftmost portion of the>FMA? If not, there's your answer.>>If you CAN see a mode annunciated, let us know what mode is>showing and we can offer more assistance.>>Cheers!>>EDIT: Just a few other thoughts as well: You're flying out of>a very high altitude airport, one that is at the edge of the>744's performance capabilities when carrying a normal load.>What were the weather conditions like? Temp, QNH, winds etc?>What assumed temperature or fixed derate thrust did you set>(if any)?Thanks for your answer!I went through your points one by one... A/T was definitely set. I have two screenshots of cruise flight, and the FMA shows "SPD" in the leftmost entry. During climb, when I changed from CLB to CLB2, the maximum ETR changed, and the actual ETR set as well. I N1 decreased as well. During cruise flight and descent N1 was at around 94-95, i.e. below the limit indicated by the little horizontal bar, but the numbers indicating N1 were in a red box. I wish I could post that screenshot here... (or can I send it to you by e-mail?)Regarding the settings for departing from Quito at 9,914ft:Temp 14 Celsius, QNH 30.30, Winds 54/19. I used Rwy 35. N1 settings at take-off was 113. I didn't use derate thrust (should I in such a situation?) My takeoff run and initial climb went absolutely fine. It's just that red box around the N1 number that bothers me.

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>The airport without procedures/runways: Check to see if you>have a sidstars file for SLLP (it will be in the sidstars>folder with filename SLLP.txt). The airac data provides for>the existence of an airport but the procedures are in the>sidstars section.>>I found that there is not a file for SLLP at Navdata, but you>might be able to get ahold of the last one put out by Terry>for cycle 0610.Hi Dan,I use the current AIRAC which I downloaded from Navdata/Navigraph, and the All-in-one SID/STAR package which I downloaded yesterday from Navdata.I have a file called "SLLP.txt", which has the following entries:// SLLP - EL ALTO INTL// Derived from DAFIF cycle 0508.// Valid 04 Aug 05 to 31 Aug 05.//// Copyright 7/31/2005 by Terry Yingling// http://home.sw.rr.com/filesherenow/index.html// These procedures must not be sold or included// with a product for sale unless authorized by// me in writing before the fact.//// Read the '_Read This First.txt' file for// copyright restrictions.FIXESFIX ARPIS LATLON S 17 19.144 W 67 46.646FIX ELANI LATLON S 15 35.777 W 68 11.23FIX ISAMO LATLON S 16 47.28 W 67 54.57FIX PAZ LATLON S 16 30.723 W 68 14.007FIX PAZ08 LATLON S 16 20.699 W 68 13.281FIX PAZ27 LATLON S 16 30.193 W 68 24.408FIX PAZ31 LATLON S 16 26.161 W 68 23.277FIX PAZ50 LATLON S 16 30.459 W 68 19.207FIX PAZ55 LATLON S 16 30.914 W 68 8.282FIX PAZ57 LATLON S 16 48.625 W 68 4.535FIX PAZ70 LATLON S 16 30.353 W 68 21.288FIX TORAX LATLON S 16 44.011 W 67 18.312ENDFIXESRNWSRNW 10RNW 10LRNW 28RNW 28RENDRNWSSIDSSID ARPIS3 FIX PAZ57 FIX ARPIS RNW 10 TRK 97 UNTIL 13725 FIX PAZ55 AT OR ABOVE 13800 TRK 180 UNTIL RADIAL 157 FROM NAVAID PAZ RNW 28 TRK 277 UNTIL 13725 FIX PAZ TRK 127 UNTIL RADIAL 157 FROM NAVAID PAZSID ELANI4 FIX PAZ AT OR ABOVE 20000 FIX PAZ08 AT OR ABOVE 22000 FIX ELANI AT OR ABOVE 22000 RNW 10 TRK 97 UNTIL 13725 FIX PAZ55 AT OR ABOVE 13800 TRK 180 UNTIL 16200 TRK 313 UNTIL RADIAL 163 FROM NAVAID PAZ RNW 28 TRK 277 UNTIL 13725 FIX PAZ AT OR ABOVE 13800 TRK 212 UNTIL 16200 TRK 42 UNTIL RADIAL 192 FROM NAVAID PAZSID ISAMO5 FIX ISAMO AT OR ABOVE 20000 FIX TORAX AT OR ABOVE 25000 RNW 10 FIX PAZ55 AT OR ABOVE 13800 RNW 28 FIX PAZ AT OR ABOVE 13360ENDSIDSSTARSENDSTARSHowever, what bugs me is the following: even if there isn't a SID/STAR file (and thus no approaches), shouldn't the runways at least be listed? Don't the runway data come from the AIRAC, i.e. if the airport is in the AIRAC then it also has runway entries? I can hand-build my own approach procedure in the FMS by copying map data, but I'd love the FMS to know which runway I am going to. So I am doubly confused: even if there wasn't a SID file, I should see the runways of that airport (albeit without procedures). And given that I have a SID file, I should also see approaches.What am I doing wrong here?ThanksChris

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One limitation on the 747 is that you cannot take off or land if the pressure altitude at the aerodrome exceeds 8,400 feet. Quito exceeds this. You were absolutely right not to use a derate, in fact it's surprising you got airborne at all! :(Tell you what, if you would be so kind as to tell me the weights and fuel loads for your flight, I'll attempt to replicate it and we'll see if I get the same symptoms.Cheers!


Mark Adeane - NZWN
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>One limitation on the 747 is that you cannot take off or land>if the pressure altitude at the aerodrome exceeds 8,400 feet.>Quito exceeds this. You were absolutely right not to use a>derate, in fact it's surprising you got airborne at all! :(>>Tell you what, if you would be so kind as to tell me the>weights and fuel loads for your flight, I'll attempt to>replicate it and we'll see if I get the same symptoms.>>Cheers!Hi Mark. I use FS Flight Keeper which records all the flight data, weights, weather, route, etc. I have exported the records for this flight into a readable html. format. Can I e-mail that to you? That would allow you to see all the data.BTW: indeed altitude airports are an issue. Upon approaching La Paz which has an airfield altitude of 13,314 ft I got a "CABIN ALTITUDE" warning message. I had no other choice than to ignore it, as according to the manual this always happens when cabin pressure is >10,000 ft. Well, when going to La Paz, it certainly is higher than that. For my flight out, I used the Ready-for-Pushback 747-200 - which I know does or did flights into La Paz in "the real world". Quite a drag as well though ;-)

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You can email me that file at markDOTadeaneATparadiseDOTnetDOTnz and I'll take a look at the flight.Cheers!EDIT: just checking, are you using and scenery enhancements or is it just the default FS scenery?


Mark Adeane - NZWN
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Re your confusion: Runway data does come from the airac, but the FMC only uses runways declared by the sidstar file section RNWS. This is handy for locations that have unuseable runways. The above copy of SLLP.txt doesn't have any approaches in it -- only a couple of SIDS.Downloading All-In-One from navdata doesn't help you, because that site doesn't have a SLLP available.The version you are using is from Aug 05; the last one I have was distributed by Terry Yingling at planepath.com Oct 06, and it includes one approach (DME10). I note that it only lists runway 10/28.I've attached the file, please rename it SLLP.txt and you should be ready to go.


Dan Downs KCRP

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