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peppy197

always turning left

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For starters, I'm not a real fan of X-Plane and may never be. I still prefer FSX with FS9 close behind.However, in regards to the airplane pulling left --------- single engine planes will do that. At least if the prop turns clockwise from the cockpit view.As far as sims go, I find that some over do the effect, some are not enough, and some seem to wander from right to left too easily. This applies to both X-Plane and MSFS. Jet's won't do it because there is not a spiral prop blast hitting the tail. Twins may not have the problem because the props are counter-rotating, or the spiral blast misses the tail. There is also a torque effect, but that usually depends on engine size versus aircraft size and weight, and there is also P-factor which occures when the prop is at an angle to the oncoming airstream ---- as in a climbout.Generally, trimming isn't enough. You need some good right rudder; even in a Cessna 172. If you don't have rudder pedals, then you can use auto-rudder in MSFS; and I'm not sure of the X-Plane setting. Twist grips and keyboards also work, but I much prefer pedals. Otherwise, I'd go with an auto-rudder setup.Using my "full size" Van's RV6A as an example........I have to use a lot of right rudder on the takeoff roll and climbout. If I didn't, it would hit the left side runway lights in just a few hundred feet. It's got an engine that produces a lot of power for the size of airplane, plus a constant speed prop that's like low gear. As I apply the last third of throttle, it even wants to torque to the left, and I can feel it. Once I get up to around 100 knots, the rudder and it's fixed trim tab allow less pressure on the right rudder pedal. In cruise flight, I don't need any rudder at all. But I had to experiment and re-adjust the metal trim tab to keep the "ball" in the center. This is where "in-flight" adjustable rudder trims have an advantage, and you should be able to assign a key/button for both MSFS and X-Plane. L.Adamson
At least on my machine the new version seems to correct this left turn stuff as well as a lot of the twitchies.However, after months of tweaking and trying xplane I find there are only a couple things that keep me coming back to xplane-the feel of the plane in the air once after takeoff, the real prop sounds, and systems failures.With the Carenado Seneca, JF Duchess, and Real Air Duke and frankly better fps on fsx with similar (well no-higher relative settings) I am having trouble using xplane much-especially since there seems to be a nasty nvidia compatiblity problem. I'd like to see it compete-even with a nearly 3 year old product (fsx) xplane appears to be well behind -I'd like to see it at least catch up if not surpass.

Geofa

WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE-the best Flight Sim!

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I'd like to see it compete-even with a nearly 3 year old product (fsx) xplane appears to be well behind -I'd like to see it at least catch up if not surpass.
That's a big problem. I'm use to MSFS, and X-Plane is still noticeably behind --- virtual cockpits, gps, land mass, etc.. I don't see major third party developers jumping on board due to constant revisions. If I found the flight models to be utterly fantastic, and leaps beyond MSFS ( as advertised and promoted) then I'd put up with it more. But I don't. At the end of the day ......... FSX/ FS9 and third party additions just seem closer to my flying reality.But what the heck. If X-Plane surpasses MSFS in the future----------------- it won't be the first time both of us completely switched from MSFS... :( L.Adamson

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That's a big problem. I'm use to MSFS, and X-Plane is still noticeably behind --- virtual cockpits, gps, land mass, etc.. I don't see major third party developers jumping on board due to constant revisions. If I found the flight models to be utterly fantastic, and leaps beyond MSFS ( as advertised and promoted) then I'd put up with it more. But I don't. At the end of the day ......... FSX/ FS9 and third party additions just seem closer to my flying reality.But what the heck. If X-Plane surpasses MSFS in the future----------------- it won't be the first time both of us completely switched from MSFS... :( L.Adamson
That is the honesty variable.... if it is better some with no loyalties will switch.....I am always open minded as I know you are.Bring the competition on...but it has to compete!

Geofa

WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE-the best Flight Sim!

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Guest byoung
That is the honesty variable.... if it is better some with no loyalties will switch.....I am always open minded as I know you are.Bring the competition on...but it has to compete!
I am demoing X-Plane 9 and I am really close to purchasing it. I am using the CH USB Yoke and Pedals for my joystick controls.When you upgrade it COMPLETELY resets all of your settings. Is this by design? So I couldn't see what the settings were before I upgraded.9.22 was working really well as far as joystick controls sensitivity, etc. I am not sure if it has to do with upgrading to 9.31, but NOW my Yoke has a constant roll to the left even after being airbone, I have to bank to the right 20 degrees to maintain straight and level flight. NOT VERY REALISTIC! I don't remember this charatictic in RW flying.The devices work fine in FSX, so I know it has to be something with the joystick sensitivities and maybe this version?? I have tried moving the sliders on the joystick calibration page, even adding extra Null Zone because my CH USB devices appear to be a little noisy (flutter). Even 50% null zone, I am still getting a constant roll to the right. Any ideas? I love the sim. But this is a Huge issue that I need to resolve. What are the recommended settings for the CH Yoke and Pedals devices, understanding that every system and individual preference is different?This is a real show stopper for purchassing X-Plane. I am willing to tweak as I have done in FSX. But we need to know how to eliminate this issue. Like Geoff A, I have flown real A/C and this to me does not even come close to realism.The same effect applies to EVERY XP A/C I have flown.I have also posted this on the X-Plane.org forum, and so far the response is delete the calibration file. I have done this, but still the issue exists.THIS IS SOOO FRUSTRATING!Thanks!Barry

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It has been FIVE days since that last comment , by "Barry"... above, about being so frustrated has been posted.AND yet, no comment from anyone in the know at X-Plane :( Come on guys, show some illuminatie :(


                 P3D-v5x  RULES

                                       Allen  Lavigne    in   Canada

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When you upgrade it COMPLETELY resets all of your settings. Is this by design? So I couldn't see what the settings were before I upgraded.9.22 was working really well as far as joystick controls sensitivity, etc. I am not sure if it has to do with upgrading to 9.31, but NOW my Yoke has a constant roll to the left even after being airbone, I have to bank to the right 20 degrees to maintain straight and level flight. NOT VERY REALISTIC! I don't remember this charatictic in RW flying.
Hi Barry,in any case, to prevent issues, when you upgrade it is strongly advised to delete all the content of the Output/Preferences folder (not the folder itself), and this deletes all the in-game settings, including flight controls settings.However, if you skip the Beta versions (as advised for most users) and only go for the Final versions, they are not upgraded so often (one every few months).Re-setting the preferences takes 5-10 minutes.The correct procedure to calibrate the hardware is, IN THIS ORDER:1) Go to Settings->Joystick & Equipment->Axis2) Assign each of the axis to the correct function (pitch, roll, yaw, throttle, left brake, right brake, etc.). Move the controls to check the correspondence between axes and indicators.3) AFTER the assignments have been done, move each of your controls throughout its FULL range (full left, full right, full up, full down, full throttle, idle throttle, etc.).If needed, you can increase the null-zone.To set center position for yoke and pedals, center them and then hit the "CENTER YOKE AND PEDALS AND HIT THIS BUTTON" buttonYou cannot set null-zones for right and left brakes, so if you have rudder pedals, they may be applying some brake pressure even when not pressed.In this case, you have to calibrate them using their calibration software or windows control panel.Marco

"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." [Abraham Lincoln]

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Guest byoung
Hi peppy, and everyone."In XP it seems to be exagerated 100 foldLeft turning tendency."You are correct, there are many other exaggerated behaviors in XP, the worst being Ground handling with Xwind conditions. Some of these issues are Controller related and the inability to select individual axis Null zones, which should be addressed, in the near future, I hope.Post here some more info about your System, XP Version, Controller, Aircraft, etc. that you are having problems with, and you can get better help. Until then you can try to see if the information I have listed below helps you, play with the numbers, but if you are Not having a problem in Straight and Level at Cruise, things get more complicated.In general here are some of the things that I modify in order to make the acfts more stable and manageable. You may also want to set your Controls "Joystick & Equipment" screen, and pull all the six sliders, Control response and Stability augmentation, to full right and increase the Null zone, and see if it helps. Using "Plane-Maker.exe"Fix Left turning tendency, Cruise / max speed / 175 Kts Straight and Level Standard>Control Geometry>Trim &Speed> Aileron>Trim Tab adjust +0.012 Was 0.0You can also try to use the Radii setting, here is an example that I used for the RV6:The basic formulas used to dampen some effects, use the x2 or x3 depending on how much travel / how twitchy the acft. is, you have in your controllers:Pitch_Radius = (wing_span * 0.15)*2Yaw_Radius = ((Pitch_Radius + Roll_Radius) * 0,66)*2Roll_Radius = (total_length * 0.18)*2Radii Rv-6 pitch-4.90, yaw 5.20 rol 2.50 CG Rv-6 long -.70 .00 .70 vert .00TV
Can you please post screen shots of plane maker where you enter this Radi data? Thanks

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Can you please post screen shots of plane maker where you enter this Radi data? Thanks
You can find it in the Standard->Weight & Balance menu.I realized there's an error in the formulas I wrote in a previous post. The correct ones are:Pitch_Radius = total_length * 0.18Yaw_Radius = (Pitch_Radius + Roll_Radius) * 0,66Roll_Radius = wing_span * 0.15( Please note that the values you enter in Plane-Maker contain 2 decimals! E.g. enter 6.5 as 006.50 )These formulas should give you values close to real world figures, but if you wish to make X-Plane FM more damped, you can use bigger values for them.Marco

"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." [Abraham Lincoln]

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Guest byoung
You can find it in the Standard->Weight & Balance menu.I realized there's an error in the formulas I wrote in a previous post. The correct ones are:Pitch_Radius = total_length * 0.18Yaw_Radius = (Pitch_Radius + Roll_Radius) * 0,66Roll_Radius = wing_span * 0.15( Please note that the values you enter in Plane-Maker contain 2 decimals! E.g. enter 6.5 as 006.50 )These formulas should give you values close to real world figures, but if you wish to make X-Plane FM more damped, you can use bigger values for them.Marco
So I have to obviously plug in my airplane's demensions into the formulas?Thanks Marco!! I really appreciate your help!

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Having started this thread I wish to finish by saying that the last update; 9.31, seems to have dampened this problem enough to now make X-Plane usable. :( Thanks


                 P3D-v5x  RULES

                                       Allen  Lavigne    in   Canada

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While it is a characteristic of single engine flight to yaw left with power at a high setting, in cruise it should be negligible. I have a Carenado C210 and all it does is yaw left all the time. Seems they all do but this one is really bad. I noticed in all of them, if you trim it out for cruise it will turn and rudder trim does not help because now you are flying with so much rudder the ball is not close to center. I modified "Most realism " settings but still it is a constant battle to keep it straight. After a full day of doing this in the real world at 7500 feet, you would be stressed to distraction. I wanted the Centurion so I can stay up on complicated planes but not this complicated.

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5 hours ago, Capn Tan said:

While it is a characteristic of single engine flight to yaw left with power at a high setting, in cruise it should be negligible. I have a Carenado C210 and all it does is yaw left all the time. Seems they all do but this one is really bad. I noticed in all of them, if you trim it out for cruise it will turn and rudder trim does not help because now you are flying with so much rudder the ball is not close to center. I modified "Most realism " settings but still it is a constant battle to keep it straight. After a full day of doing this in the real world at 7500 feet, you would be stressed to distraction. I wanted the Centurion so I can stay up on complicated planes but not this complicated.

Congratulations on reviving an 8 year old thread :)

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On 7/8/2009 at 1:34 PM, Jacoba said:
peppy197 said:
How can I eliminate the left turning when powering up for a takeoff?Without adjusting trim and or compensating aileron roll to the right which causes subsequent turing to the right once airborne?Allen

What you are experiencing is an accurate portrayal of a take off roll in a prop plane, its called gyroscopic precession which comes from the rotation of the crankshaft and propeller causes the airplane to yaw to the left. This is just one of the physical factors in "left turning tendencies" there are four of them. They are greatest during take off roll at max power, just give your bird a boot full of right rudder and enjoy the realism!

You can experience gyroscopic precession in tail draggers when raising tail during the take of roll, but not that much on tricycle gear aircraft. They are more affected by torque and pro-wash (before lift off). 


flight sim addict, airplane owner, CFI

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