Re:texture filtering if you have SSAA enabled you need to apply a negative LOD bias in order to maintain texture clarity, otherwise it all tends to get blurred. For each increase in SSAA samples of 2x, you need to apply a -0.5 LOD bias to correct. Give it a shot and see if that helps.

Thanks for the tip but unless you use ATI Tray Tools (which is currently not compatible with the new 5870) I don

One other observation, having spent more time with this card:Having got used to the 8x CSAA setting available from nHancer with the GTX285, I find that the ATI 5870 does not have an exact equivalent. The "super-sampling" AA setting gives superb quality with "box" x4 AA or above - but the framerate cost is too high at 1920x1080. The best compromise seems to be "box" x8 AA with the "adaptive" setting - but it's not quite to my liking: force of habit, I guess. I have also come across shimmering in one or two situations, which I didn't ever get with CSAA on the GTX285.I'm not sure that I understand the technicalities but I THINK this may reflect what Nick_N has been saying elsewhere about ATI's AA being different from Nvidia's at "core" level.All this just reinforces my earlier impression that there's no point in updating from a GTX285 (unless, like me, you're just curious). Equally, if you're still on older kit, then the GTX285 and the 5870 are pretty much on a par: the ATI has (IMHO) a slight performance advantage; the Nvidia has (IMHO) a slight image quality advantage. Let's hope we're at the beginning of an era of renewed competition between these two sloths - ahem, I mean titans - of the GPU industry.Tim

Lets place this into a real world situation where neither ATi or Nvidia are dictating the settings for your test. You run FSX on the Nvidia card using settings that work for what you demand in IQ and remove shimmer.. Instead of letting ATi slip by why dont you set up a repeat of your benchmark flights, except this time demand the ATi card show you IQ with the shimmers removed as you do with Nvidia so the test is actually equal in nature to the user who would run the Nvidia card. First, work with the card to find the settings required to accomplish the task at hand. Look for ways to use the optimal settings if possible of course but if you are sure those do not match the IQ of the Nv card, then find the settings that do regardless of what it takes to accomplish that task. Lets make sure Vsync is locked ON tooLets forget "its all in the driver which will get fixed" and put the card as it stands in a matched state of visual rendering quality to Nvidia in FSX duplicating the test setup as you would use either card in-game and see what those results are compared to the original runs.

Apply the negative LOD adjustment and say goodbye to the shimmering.As has been necessary on previous NV hardware and is still necessary depending upon driver settings utilized by said NV hardware. Clamp is in there for a reason.

Apply the negative LOD adjustment and say goodbye to the shimmering.As has been necessary on previous NV hardware and is still necessary depending upon driver settings utilized by said NV hardware. Clamp is in there for a reason.

That would be great if there was a way to apply it with ATI

It seems that I have to enable DX10 preview to get ok performance in FSX. Is this what others experience ? The problem is that I miss some textures when running DX10 :-(Sometimes I get very poor FPS, actually my old 8800GTX performs better. I think this baby needs some tweaks (and better drivers ?)Does anyone have some tips on optimizing this card for FSX ? Thanks

It seems that I have to enable DX10 preview to get ok performance in FSX. Is this what others experience ? The problem is that I miss some textures when running DX10 :-(Sometimes I get very poor FPS, actually my old 8800GTX performs better. I think this baby needs some tweaks (and better drivers ?)Does anyone have some tips on optimizing this card for FSX ? Thanks

I

Hi dtj01I did a clean install of windows 7 with my old 8800gtx installed. I did not install drivers from nvidia. I then used Driver Sweeper to remove any drivers. I then installed the 5870 and downloaded the latest 9.10 beta driver. My system:i7 920 @3,26 gb ramrunning at 1680x1050

It seems that I have to enable DX10 preview to get ok performance in FSX. Is this what others experience ? The problem is that I miss some textures when running DX10 :-(Sometimes I get very poor FPS, actually my old 8800GTX performs better. I think this baby needs some tweaks (and better drivers ?)Does anyone have some tips on optimizing this card for FSX ? Thanks

How odd that your old 8800GTX sometimes gives you better performance. I used to have one of them and I haven't yet come across a situation where it out-performed the GTX285; and I haven't yet come across a situation where the GTX285 out-performs the 5870 (although I feel rather ambivalent about the 5870 because of what I perceive as its shortcomings on the anti-aliasing front: as Nick_N has pointed out, the inability to set an equivalent of Nvidia's CSAA means that I cannot really compare like-with-like using the quality that I would like to see).To my mind, your experience demonstrates the importance of getting the right BALANCE of components. I'm not for a moment suggesting there's anything wrong with your kit - but maybe a more aggressive overclock would let you see greater benefit from the faster GPU. Going from 3.2 to 3.8, or even 3.6GHz, could make an appreciable difference. I actually notice a difference if I go from 4.4GHz to 4.5GHz (but try as I might I can't get the thing stable above ~4.43GHz). If you have the stomach for it, you might also check that your RAM speed and timings are optimal: Nick_N has made some very useful contributions on this subject.On the other hand, maybe you've found some situations in which the wider bus of the 8800GTX outweighs the faster speed of the 5870. Personally I doubt it but my understanding of this technical subject is even less complete than my understanding of others so, again, Nick might have an insight into this.Tim

I haven't yet come across a situation where the GTX285 out-performs the 5870 Tim

Tim,Have you given the new 5870 drivers that ATI/AMD put up last night a try?

Hi dtj01I did a clean install of windows 7 with my old 8800gtx installed. I did not install drivers from nvidia. I then used Driver Sweeper to remove any drivers. I then installed the 5870 and downloaded the latest 9.10 beta driver. My system:i7 920 @3,26 gb ramrunning at 1680x1050

Jorgensen,As I mentioned in my response to Tim I reinstalled the 5870 last night with the new drivers and Vista 64/SP2 this time. I just got done giving the DirectX 10 preview a try but haven

...Have you given the new 5870 drivers that ATI/AMD put up last night a try?

Hi djt01It's strange. When I use DX10 preview, I get ~60 FPS inside the VC in the default 737. When disabling DX10, I get ~14 fps.... so, something must be wrong I might have to do a reinstall. When I use my favorite aircraft the Level-D 767, it seems that I get the same FPS as with the 8800GTX. So does this show, that the VC is very depended on CPU power?It seems that I have a lot adjustments to do.Jorgensenps. a hardware question. I have OC my i7 920 to 3,2. When I boot, the BIOS says that the RAM is running at 1280, is this the right speed ? thanksRam Corsair 6GB DDR3 Dominator PC3-12800C8 1600MHz (3x2GB) Triple Channel DDR3 (TR3X6G1600C8D) 8 8 8 24 V1,65

Hi djt01It's strange. When I use DX10 preview, I get ~60 FPS inside the VC in the default 737. When disabling DX10, I get ~14 fps.... so, something must be wrong I might have to do a reinstall. When I use my favorite aircraft the Level-D 767, it seems that I get the same FPS as with the 8800GTX. So does this show, that the VC is very depended on CPU power?It seems that I have a lot adjustments to do.Jorgensenps. a hardware question. I have OC my i7 920 to 3,2. When I boot, the BIOS says that the RAM is running at 1280, is this the right speed ? thanksRam Corsair 6GB DDR3 Dominator PC3-12800C8 1600MHz (3x2GB) Triple Channel DDR3 (TR3X6G1600C8D) 8 8 8 24 V1,65

Made a restall og windows 7 / fsx. It seems to have cleared the dx9 vs. dx10 problem, and I now have almost the same FPS in both. But still not much better than the 8800GTX. I guess the Level-d is the fault. I have increased the CPU clock from 3,2 to 3,8 and this has increased the VC FPS with about 5 FPS. Is there something in the BIOS I should be aware of regarding the new 5870 card ? Thanks to all of you - just love FSX :-) (ps. the 5870 really kicks &@($* in other games compared to the 8800GTX, and without any more noise)

Hi djt01It's strange. When I use DX10 preview, I get ~60 FPS inside the VC in the default 737. When disabling DX10, I get ~14 fps.... so, something must be wrong I might have to do a reinstall.

Let me know what your exact settings are in FSX and the location where your getting 60 FPS in DirectX 10 preview with the default 737 and I

In case an update is of interest:I installed the latest Catalyst drivers. They added a couple of fps. But they do not provide improved anti-aliasing settings, or any option to change the LOD settings. The 5870 can give a really good image, but you have to set "super sampling" anti-aliasing, which brings FSX to its knees.Unable to reconcile myself to the (few) instances of shimmering and to the (IMHO) poor anti-aliasing on the 5870, I have now re-installed my GTX285. It's odd. When I installed the 5870, I did not at first notice any real difference in visual quality: just faster framerates in the default aircraft. But going back to the GTX285, using Nick_N's Nhancer settings (pretty much) the improvement in visual quality is instantly noticeable compared with the 5870. IMHO the GTX285 has a definite edge on the 5870 in terms of visual quality at the moment, thanks to the ability to set "combined" mode anti-aliasing at 8x from Nhancer and thanks to the ability to control LOD settings (I assume this is what makes the difference: these are the two things most obviously missing from the Catalyst control panel). For the add-on heavies, the slight loss in framerates compared with the 5870 is negligible. For the default aircraft, the loss in framerates is noticeable NUMERICALLY: but the overall smoothness of the sim is not affected adversely by going back to the GTX285.I would be interested to know what others have found.Tim