These people who say they can't get their money back it's quite simple - do a chargeback - say the company didn't deliver.Credit card companies now slam down hard if a company has too many chargebacks - it also costs the company.Let them know that if they don't refund the money you will tell your credit card company you did not get what you ordered and bingo.I also buy impulsively, and had my card out ready to get the 330 - and still the card is sitting there - but I will try and wait till they fix the bugs.There are lots of protection for consumers - if you know the systems, ask your credit card company what happens if a company does deliver the goods as you requested.

Uhh, what version of the PMDG 737 did you buy? If you've been in their forums at all - anyone can see that it was released (in my humble opinion) as a big oops. Patched, it's OK. Out of the gate - it was pretty bad. And their installation security mess will absolutely, without a doubt make it the last PMDG product I'll buy. I agree that file-awappers have ruined the concept of trust and honesty - but their procedure is overboard, and I'm sure will still get hacked by someone anyway. PSS (any of their products) on the other hand - yes are less functional, but not by much. They are much better out of the box than any other add-on (yes, even PIC - which people say is so perfect - still required a patch if memory serves). In your post, you wonder why people would pay for PSS when they can get equivalent freeware? I'd challenge anyone to find the aircraft, panel and high quality sounds across all engine types for free that equal what you get in PSS. And on the alpha protection, I saw a post that said it didn't work, but I stalled the 330 on a climbout and sure enough, the bus took on a mind of its own and brought itself out of the stall.

Have the PSS A330 and A340. It took me a while to download them (understandable on the first day of a release). Both aircraft work great. Nice intro manual that helps you on your first flight(some small inconsistencies but it does a good job getting you started). Yep the airfile is not giving the special Airbus features (A-floor etc) but within the FS2002/FS2004 limitiations it does a reasonable job (to get those features you need something like the AntiCylone's A320 which works by intercepting all inputs outside FS200x).How realistic is it to try and do a barrel rol in an A330 anyway :-roll you think that a lot of airline pilots try out how good the A-floor protection works?PSS A330 and A340 work great on my PC there are some problems on specific configurations (as you can read on their forum) but hey are working on it as we speak.

>>(yes, even PIC - which people say is so perfect - still required a patch if memory serves). Do a little research mate. Yes it required a patch, but if memory serves, the patch was to fix a few very MINOR issues. There was no bug list of over 100 bugs. And the minor issues did not prevent people from fully enjoying the airplane while waiting on the patch.No company today can claim this track record for 99% bug free release.

I also haven't seen a list of "100's" for the recent PSS releases. Minor is also relative to the user. A patch is a patch.

I did believe the A340 would model alpha protection because they said it would in the pre release blurb. Is it OK with you if someone claims it will be in the product but isn't?EVERYONE knows that complicated software will have bugs at release, due to the vast number of hardware setups. For example, the PSS A340 (for me) is flying at cruise with 8 degrees nose up - I can live with that one for a while.What I can't live with is an aircraft/panel of an aircraft, advertised as autotrimming and alpha protected, that then stalls on every single ILS approach, is capable of any daft manourver I decide to try and does not auotrim.That is shoddy advertising and/or shoddy beta testing.Ray Keattch.

It is our own fault. We don't behave like customers, we behave like- most likely are, addicts! Fortunately for us, the best planes are freeware, i.e. the Dash-8, the Falcon, the Fokker 50. Just hope that they will be updated to FS9 soon. I am sorry, but a PSS release that misses to install the 340 panel or just cannot find the folder were flightplans are stored (at least if installed on other language versions than the English WinXP version) beats me. It is going to be this way next time FS10 is released.Michael

Hey Will, sounds to me like you have a little conflict of interests here?"Are we so PC now that we cant let a guy vent some frustration?The developer doesn't need to be coddled. They are getting "paid". If the developer can't handled any criticism, (productive or not) then they are in the wrong business."No, but that doesn't mean I'll come out here and rant when I willingly purchased a product WITHOUT doing research about its bugs.Now the little contradiction..."Hey, I feel your pain. I understand your frustration. However, It is WE the consumer that willingly hands over our power without due dilligence."So, first you say it's OK for the guy to vent, then you say what he's doing is wrong? You need to decide. Seems to me you're trying a bit too hard to contradict people, to the point where you contradict yourself. :)Jose: Consumers have a responsibility, just like they have power. If you rush and buy, you're giving up that power. So don't blame the developer, he didn't point a gun to your head and rip off your money. This was a voluntary trade, and a FAIR trade. So move on and do your research more carefully next time.DP

I was refering to PMDG and Capt. Sim when talking about the 100s of bugs, but let's not forget that the PSS A320 also had a rather long list. (To this day, I cannot recover from a stall in the A320 no matter if I'm at FL370 or 5000ft). Also, the PSS A330/340 has just been released and already there are a few bugs. Just wait for a couple of weeks or so....lets see if this list balloons or is short. Personally I hope it doesn't balloon.>>>How realistic is it to try and do a barrel rol in an A330 anyway you think that a lot of airline pilots try out how good the A-floor protection works?<< Are you suggesting that because real pilots dont go trying it Flightsimmers shouldn't try it? I hope you aren't. You see, one of the selling points of the A330/A340 was the said A-floor protection. Therefore naturally people will test it out to see if it does work. Imagine - if PSS was able to perfect the A-floor in the Airbus it would be as revolutionary as the little GA airfile that perfected the Spin. Personally, I think that alone would be worth whatever they are charging. Therefore since it was advertised, if its not working then it should be added to the bug list. That has nothing to do with what real pilots do or dont do.

<<<>>>Bravo Will!I applaud you and your company. Companies that survive and thrive do so because they remember the very basic golden rule of business....the customer is always right.I always shake my head and marvel at people who staunchly defend MS and other payware manufacturers against legitimate gripes, yet will scream bloody murder if the new product or appliance they buy for their home, car, airplane acts up....Carl

:-xxrotflmaoedit:the above is my humble opinion.

You have way to much time on your hands. Have some fun for a change look at the positive aspects of what you are flying in FS9. If $$$ is a problem there is pleny of freeware out there that is just as much fun to fly as the payware. Come on stop the negativity have fun and go fly an airplane.Tony

>These people who say they can't get their money back it's quite >simple - do a chargeback - say the company didn't deliver.Except if is downloadable there is a log that verifies the credit card # came from a certain IP addy, and the download request/service went to that same IP addy a short time therafter.Regards.Ernie.

T' be straight...I is kinda glad dat I aint big-#### into jet flyin'. Wit' dadamn 'escepshun o' some few payware (down low, dat wuz free prior t' disversion) rehabs dats, in mah eyes, needed likes F-S-U-I-P-f****n'-C an'Activecamera, I have no care t' steal some/c o' scenery. In da last version Ibrought Lago's, Sim Fyla's, Wilco Publishin' an' Flight1 products but wit' dadamn fresh some/c an' da damn betta' fields in F-S-f****n'-9, I iscomplete-like happy. I own U-T an' probably will fiddle around wit' dat whenit gits its update but otherwise, I have no care t' twaik o' trick out disversion. Along wit' da damn fact everyone be goin' wit' payware makes it datmuch aisia'. So's in some way Jose I is on yo' side. If every simma' wuzlikes me den da add-on payware developa's wouldnt be able t' lack in customa'support becuz they would wanna provide service likes how Fsgenesis duz alongwit' some kinda' otha's. I do recon' dat some addon market place kin an'should 'essist 4 all aspects o' simmin' but yo' #### had betta' git yo' customa'service dept in orda' b4 yo' #### relaise cause some few way baaad ordealsreported in some forum got'ta yo' #### closin' down shop quick-like. I dontthink its eva' about da damn braid as much as da time an' haidaches. N-P (Tom A. please dont punish me for putting it in jive, just thought it was funnier spoken in jive instead plain old basic grammer.)

>Do a little research mate. Yes it required a patch, but if memory >serves, the patch was to fix a few very MINOR issues. There was no >bug list of over 100 bugs. And the minor issues did not prevent >people from fully enjoying the airplane while waiting on the patch.>No company today can claim this track record for 99% bug free >release.Do you recall the 1.1 patch document? It was like 5 pages long, they fixed and corrected a lot of little bugs in 767PIC.It was just so long ago and been so well refined people forget that it had any bugs. No way was it 99%, nor did it need to be.Regards.Ernie.