Hi.I decided to give FS2004 one last chance, but I yet again ran into the autogen visibility distance bug. I was hoping someone would have found a fix or workaround by now.For those of you who still don't know what it is, basically, the

>Also, I find issues like this ridiculous. How can Microsoft>continue to ignore bugs like this one and the CTD bug and keep>selling the flawed product? They PROMISED they would release>patches to fix issues like these.I'm going to "paste" my exact comment from this post at the other forum....I've heard about this bug..........I keep hearing about the CTD bug..........I guess I'm just not getting them---------------- bummer.. Seriously, I run FS2004 on two computers, have had very few crashes to desktop on my old one; not to mention it wasn't only MSFS. And just don't seem to get this auto-gen problem.I DO fly a lot of low level VFR, although my favorite pastime at the moment is scenic F-16 flight at about 20,000' over the mountains & deserts of the western United States, from Denver to the California coast. FS2004 works extremely well for this without a bunch of added mesh scenery.If I had all these problems, I'd certainly be using FS2002 much more than I do, while I'd complain & wait for a patch. But the problem just doesn't seem to appear. So as to what's flawed-------- I must question!edit-- I should mention.......... that in the past, I havn't always been content with MSFS. I dumped FS98 in favor of Pro-Pilot due to topography/mountain airport issues. And I had to take FS2000's scenery and combine it with Microsoft's Combat Simulator to have a smooth running, non "morphing" simulation. But then I see these "giving FS2004 one last chance" statements & know for sure, that it's a problem I don't have. I've even reversed course numerous times to check out the so called auto-gen problem, and sim doesn't loose fps. Athlon 1900XP/Geforce3Ti500/512DDRramP4 2.8/NVidia/512ram laptopLadamsonedit again ---- PS. I have X-Plane too, & use it quite regularly. But nothing beats this latest FS2004 scenic mountain flying I've been doing lately on my laptop during the wee hours of the night on my laptop & cordless joystick. It's a great geography lesson! :) And the laptop still hasn't crashed even once!

Larry, CTD with will appears with 0% no 3rd party addons with this test, attaching it in a zip file, from (rhumbaflappy) DickCTD, and it is seasonal with NO addons ( November 21, 2003 ). LFMR_2.FLTI also then changed the season to a summer date, and NO CTD. LFMR_3.FLTBut now:-If I set the texture size to medium, there is NO CTD-If I set the texture size to max it crash, there is CTD.If I use my addons mesh below, with texture to max there is NO CTDhttp://www.simviation.com/terrain.htmhttp://avsim.com/terrafish/All Orlando Mesh from avsim.it's not any BMP texture in fs2004 cause CTD-It's the mesh-Texture applied to the mesh-Or the texture size thingsI have fixed this with the freeware Mesh 3rd party addons, no a single CTD at all in fs2004 with these mesh. ThanksChris Willis[link:fsw.simflight.com/FSWMenuFsSim.html]Clouds And Addons For MsFs

Well if you fly over mountains mostly, then I understand why you don't get a drop in framerate. None of the xml objects appear in mountains or forest terrain. Most of them are in urban areas and farmland.Also, it's easy to think that the autogen problem is just a case of using too high detail settings - you're flying along and notice it's kind of jerky. You change some display setting and it's all right again. What actually happened was that when you changed this display setting, the sim reloaded autogen and the accumulated autogen was cleared. Do you run the sim with Autogen at Extremely Dense?It's easy to reproduce the autogen problem once you know what to look for.(Set Autogen to Extremely Dense first) Take off from Portland Troutdale airport and fly west towards Portland Intl., then make a 180 so you're heading towards Troutdale again. Look at the framerate. Now, save the flight. Quit and restart FS2004 and load the flight. Look at the framerate again. It will be much higher. You don't even need to quit and restart the sim. Setting Autogen to None, clicking OK, then setting it back to Extremely Dense will also clear things up. It happens anywhere where there are lots of xml autogen objects. Portland area is bad. Much of the Southeast is bad because it contains lots of farmland. The rockies, forest and desert are fine because there's not a lot of xml objects.Anyway, sometimes I can make several flights - don't notice the autogen problem. Then I make an unfortunate turn or fly over some problematic landclass and *bang* I'm down to 6 FPS.Like I said, I would be happy enough with a hotkey to reload autogen. That way I would just have to hit a key when framerate started to go down (every 25 minutes or so). Is it not possible to easily do this with a plugin of some kind? Once the full scenery SDKs are out, it should be possible for the scenery devs to fix this by releasing a replacement set of autogen, even using the stock models and textures.

Hi, "I have fixed this with the freeware Mesh 3rd party addons, no a single CTD at all in fs2004 with these mesh."Sorry it is an error from me not true:To Reproduce the CTD:Go to Airports ID: ENAN, 25 october, Fs 2004 CTD at loading.Even with my mesh installed, still CTD with this one, it works only with the texture size to Med, at Max it crash.Texture size slider to Med is the real solution for now, until a true fixe.ThanksChris Willis[link:fsw.simflight.com/FSWMenuFsSim.html]Clouds And Addons For MsFs

another reply after city testing, at the other forum:Okay........... took the challange on the P4 2.8 laptopMoved autogen to 100% to the right (extremely dense) & took off in the F-16 VC cockpit from the default Seattle/Tacoma with "clear skies". I should note, that with auto-gen at "normal", I'm getting fps between 20 & 30, but usually closer to 30.Now, with auto-gen full right, and numerous criss-crosses of the city, I did indeed notice a drop in fps. By pushing auto-gen back to normal, fps were restored.Does this bug me? No,.... but it might bug some. I suppose I just don't keep auto-gen at full tilt in large cities due to my desire for higher & fluid fps! Afterall, it's higher fps that X-Plane strives for at the cost of scenery................ which makes many believe it's flight model is superior; when it really isn't! X-Plane will just keep rolling in the "fog" if that's what it takes in high density scenery areas. Maybe MS should do the same! Ladamson

I must admit that I'm not a full auto-gen junkie for large cities. My preference has always been "photo-realistic" which is reserved for slightly higher altitudes. When one of kind buildings have been programmed such as those on the Las Vegas strip, it's great, but multiple auto-gen houses are not my favorite, & I probably don't stick around long enough :)Photo-real FS2004 Phoenix & Southern Los Angeles in FLY

I'm kinda with you on this larry. Maybe I am doing a different kinda flying also. I have it on 2 PCs as well, one low end, one high end and do not have these autogen issues (CTD either). I run with all sliders maxed, except on the low end PC simple clouds, no AA and no to little AI, granted I do fly VFR in the bush quite a bit, but I fly the Eaglesoft jets out of the So Cal area and my home area of Dallas and I can say I don't notice anything unusual in the way of performance. I am not saying Jimmie is full of it or anything, but matbe there is something more to it.Part of the reason for loving FS9 is the added autogen, which is much more dense than FS2002 was, which would explain the added hit.Sorry you are issues that make you want to pack it up, hope you work it out somehow.Regards, MichaelKDFWhttp://mysite.verizon.net/res052cd/mybannercva1.jpgCalVirAir International VACougar Mountain Helicopters & Aviation[link:www.cgrmthelos.com]Cougar Mountain Helicopters

>Part of the reason for loving FS9 is the added autogen, which>is much more dense than FS2002 was, which would explain the>added hit.I do a lot of back country bush type flight myself, and yes.......... auto-gen in FS9 is much, much, & much better than it was in FS2002! FS2002 looks fire ravaged in comparison! :)L.Adamson

"I fly the Eaglesoft jets out of the So Cal area and my home area of Dallas and I can say I don't notice anything unusual in the way of performance. I am not saying Jimmie is full of it or anything, but matbe there is something more to it."It depends a lot on how you fly. Try the Portland-Troutdale experiment above with Extremely Dense autogen to see some pretty sad framerates."Part of the reason for loving FS9 is the added autogen, which is much more dense than FS2002 was, which would explain the added hit."That's exactly why I really want to see this issue resolved. I love the new autogen, but I can't use it. I'm going to experiment with automation software and hotkeys to find a way to just hit a key to reload autogen but I don't know what can be done. I hope Microsoft releases the missing SDK soon so the scenery experts can get busy releasing a replacement autogen set. I would gladly pay for such a set (I know, don't give them any ideas...).The actual density of the autogen does not cause a very big hit. Sure they use a bit more CPU power but not that much. The biggest framerate hit is caused by having the sim render every single barn and fast food house within a 30 mile radius because Microsoft didn't get the distances right. If you want more info on what's going on, just do a search in the Scenery Design forum for "autogen" "default.xml" or something.

On Hotkeys/keyboard automation:I have determined what refreshes autogen and what doesn't.You can refresh autogen by:Changing the Autogen density setting in display setting.Changing seasonMoving very far from the airport, then move back againSome things you might think would refresh autogen, but actually do not:-Using the Refresh Scenery hotkey found under Controls->Assignements in the sim. It refreshes scenery textures, but not the autogen-Changing time of day makes no difference to autogen-Using a top-down view to zoom out very far, then back in again. When zooming back in, FPS is still low-Saving a flight and the loading that same flight again

"If you want more info on what's going on, just do a search in the Scenery Design forum for "autogen" "default.xml" or something."LOL, I am a scenery designer and have seen what Gerrish, Arno, Dick, Bob and everyone has had to say on this matter. Some seem to think it's a huge problem, others are just kinda being supportive, which is cool. I personally don't experience it (both my PCs have the XML enabled) and have no desire to dig into it like Chris is doing (more power to him), I am sure his findings, might help with a solution for some's problems.I look forward to the scenery and autogen SDK as well, but for other reasons. I hope it comes soon, so we can all stop posting and do more flying! LOLThanks for the info though and I do hope you get this fixed.Regards, MichaelKDFWhttp://mysite.verizon.net/res052cd/mybannercva1.jpgCalVirAir International VACougar Mountain Helicopters & Aviation[link:www.cgrmthelos.com]Cougar Mountain Helicopters

What a shame. FSConnect is supposed to support reading AND writing of lat...however...From readme:"note: writing lat/lon into FS2004 does not produce the desired effect :-("If that would have worked, it would have been easy enough (even for me :( ) to write an app to grab the current lat/lon, plug in some random values, then reset to the original lat/lon again. Anyone know if the registered version of FSUIPC has something similar?Close but no cigarr :(Strange - we know this issue affects all users, but the severety of the problem seems to range from "not noticing any problems at all", to "makes the flight sim completely unplayable". I think it still depends on HOW you fly, and if everyone repeated the exact same flight with the same settings, the effect would be the same for everyone. Also note that for me, it makes the flight sim unplayable on two completely different PCs. One Matrox/Athlon Thunderbird, one Radeon/AthlonXP machine.

Sometimes a simple trick can have amazing results :DI programmed two key sequences and assigned them to a joystick button each using the Logitech controller software.First joystick button sends this:(probably different for non-Swedish keyboard layouts)

Hi Jimmi."The biggest framerate hit is caused by having the sim render every single barn and fast food house within a 30 mile radius because Microsoft didn't get the distances right."I think you're right on target with this. In FS9, all default objects are either simple auotgen or library objects. Real autogen is tied to texture files... simple autogen.Object "autogen" is controlled by VTP lines or by the interpreted XML file you have noted in earlier posts... and those are not autogen at all, but library objects!The library objects are the problem. There is nothing we can do about them until a new MakeMDL SDK is released, and we can see how the code for these new object types controls their display range. The new BGLComp SDK is simply an object/scenery/airport placer.If and when the SDK arrives, we may be able to replace the default object libraries with something that is not as resource greedy. Maybe.Dick