FMC wind input question yet again sigh

[trisager 2]

When I was on the 6th page, the FMC locked up and all info of winds and RTE data was lost, no chance to make new entries. Strange, probably the same issue as for you.

Thanks for testing this. Maybe something that will be sorted out eventually.

Hmm, about the descent phase, what makes you think this is something that PMDG needs to fix?

I don't think PMDG needs to fix anyting regarding descent winds - that's what I've been trying to say

[falconno 0]

I don't think PMDG needs to fix anyting regarding descent winds - that's what I've been trying to say

I'm sorry for the misunderstanding, my fault.. Thanks emvaos for the explanation of some of the modelling here, very interesting indeed! As for the lock up of the ACT RTE DATA pages as 'trisager' and I found, maybe someone could test this further? Per

[falcon999 24]

I don't think PMDG needs to fix anyting regarding descent winds - that's what I've been trying to say

Gents, EMV wrote the code. Nothing needs to be fixed, changed, modified, adjusted, tweaked, etc.

[falconno 0]

Gents, EMV wrote the code. Nothing needs to be fixed, changed, modified, adjusted, tweaked, etc.

Personally I know that :) as I stated. And I also tried to explain the procedure in my other posts here.But if I may ask, does this also mean that the FMC have some limit on the number of waypoints it will accept cruise wind data as we found in the example above? I know the man said garbage in = garbage out, but I can't figure out the garbage here. Per

[falcon999 24]

Not sure what your asking? There are climb, cruise and decent wind entries. They are limited based on the functionality of the FMC.

[falconno 0]

Not sure what your asking? There are climb, cruise and decent wind entries. They are limited based on the functionality of the FMC.

George, as I tried to explain in my post #8 and #12, everything worked as expected for me in these examples. Then I tried trisager's route. Take a look at post #7 by 'trisager' and my post #14 in this thread. The same issue happened to me when I tried to input cruise wind data. The first 5 pages went ok. Then on page 6 the FMC locked up as mentioned. The FMC refused to accept any more wind entries. And as 'trisager' said: 'At this point existing cruise winds are also lost, and there is also information missing in the right CDU column if I go back to the LEGS page' So my re-phrased question is: Is this per functionality of the FMC? Is there any limit here on number of cruise winds entries? Per

[pcubine 143]

George Morris Is there an answer to falconno's question? Thank youMichael Cubine

[falconno 0]

Some further info on issue. 1. I tried trisager's route again and the same happened this time too:This picture shows cruise wind info 294/13 for waypoint MONTO entered in the scrathpad: (So far so good) When I hit LSK 3R this happens...The info disappears. Also all entries on the other pages are lost. I then hit the EXEC button (it didn't light up though): The PERF INIT page also misses some info.. When this happens and you try to enter something in the scratchpad, it will not show up at all. If you then select another page, the entered numbers in the scrathpad reappears. 2. I also tried the route a third time, but this time just entered cruise wind info just for 1 waypoint on RTE DATA page 6. Then cruise wind info for 1 waypoint on page 8 and then the FMC locked up again. Average crz wind was entered first on the PERF INIT page. 3. If needed, I have the route in .rte format and the navlog with crz wind info I used. 4. Just want to add that I have flown the NGX on several shorter routes with less waypoints(2 - 6 pages with complete cruise wind info) without any issues at all. So this only seems to happen when crz wind info are entered on longer routes with a lot of waypoints(8+ pages). 5. I know PMDG said that nothing need to be fixed, changed etc..and also garbage in=garbage out. I can agree with that, but can someone confirm that this is per functionality? If so, what are we doing wrong here? Per.

[conchulio 0]

I'm not sure if this is a problem, as far as I know (2) is as the 'real thing'. Descent winds should be entered in the DES FORECASTS page. As for (1), I just tried to rebuild a route with 6 pages of cruise waypoints. I could easily enter cruise winds into every waypoint, se pic below. (This reminds to suggest an UPLINK function with winds data from a flight plan/navlog such as in Active Sky, as in RL, hint,hint:)) Per

I didn't know there exist an UPLINK function to put windsaloft data from ASE into the FMC?!? Or have i misunderstood your post? Dominik

[falconno 0]

I didn't know there exist an UPLINK function to put windsaloft data from ASE into the FMC?!? Or have i misunderstood your post?Dominik

Yes, you have ;). The PMDG NGX FMC doesn't have this option. I only made a suggestion for future developement of the FMC. That said, some real NG aircraft has this function(company specific) or more precicely, a REQUEST button for winds uplink (page 1047 in FCOMv2). For FS purposes, it would be nice to have this function/option coded to retreive winds info for your route waypoints from a weather generator such as Active Sky etc. Per

[NGXfanatic 85]

(This reminds to suggest an UPLINK function with winds data from a flight plan/navlog such as in Active Sky, as in RL, hint,hint:))Per

Amen brother! I have had this idea in my head for as long as I have been tediously entering wind data for every dang cruise waypoint in the FMC on the PMDG 747 and MD-11 on the long hauls I used to fly frequently before the NGX. I'm a stickler for having the correct winds in the FMC, almost to the point that it's OCD, where I obsess with checking ASE for updates every 1/2 hour or so, but maybe that was to combat boredom in the long haul cruises. This whole process of updating wind info is so much more manageable with a short/medium hauler like the NGX, and thankfully, PMDG listened to my suggestion last year asking them to allow the numeric keypad to be used for data entry. But I have longed for something like the satellite data link functionality enjoyed by the real world crews, and as such it would make sense to have a module query the ASE weather log for cruise wind data and populate accordingly in the FMC, saving us the "legwork" I'm not a programmer, but I'd imagine it would be too much work/little reward for the developer, or it's just not possible technically. This idea has potential, wouldn't this be a neat little "value add" for someone like Jim Skorna at HIFI to add to ASE, or for Pete Dowson to add to FSUIPC. All this data is readily available in our computer , we just need a clever programmer to make it possible for the seperate addons to talk to each other. ACARS functionaliity has been shot down for other simjets, but this is one subfunction handled by ACARS that makes perfect sense our virtual airliners.

[pcubine 143]

767fan I fly the MD-11and the MD-11F between Germany and the U.S. west coast every other day. The routes have 36-45 waypoints. Once I figured out how to enter wind direction and speed by waypoints taking into account 3 to 4 different altitudes because of step climbs, climb and descent forecasts I did that for about six months until I became frustrated with the tedinous of the situation. I was at the point that I was mad before I even loaded the plane, cargo ramp, etc. So I went back to just entering a average head or tailwind on the INIT page based upon what ASE indicated. I know this is incorrect because the ASE average is not weighted by the length of the leg. In calculating an average a 25 mile leg is Europe is the same as a 350 mile leg accross the North Atlantic. A ACARS function that imported winds aloft by waypoint would be a valuable addition to the 737NGX and the MD-11. I am entering winds by waypoint in the 737NGX and I guess the most waypoints I have had is about 15. It is nice to have an accurate ETA. Before I read this thread I had started a KTPA-KBOS flight that took about an hour of prefight at the gate and that was not from a cold and dark either. Most of the time was spent screwing around with the winds aloft and ISA deviations in FMC. We need ACARS. Michael Cubine

[NGXfanatic 85]

767fan I fly the MD-11and the MD-11F between Germany and the U.S. west coast every other day. The routes have 36-45 waypoints. Once I figured out how to enter wind direction and speed by waypoints taking into account 3 to 4 different altitudes because of step climbs, climb and descent forecasts I did that for about six months until I became frustrated with the tedinous of the situation. I was at the point that I was mad before I even loaded the plane, cargo ramp, etc. So I went back to just entering a average head or tailwind on the INIT page based upon what ASE indicated. I know this is incorrect because the ASE average is not weighted by the length of the leg. In calculating an average a 25 mile leg is Europe is the same as a 350 mile leg accross the North Atlantic. A ACARS function that imported winds aloft by waypoint would be a valuable addition to the 737NGX and the MD-11. I am entering winds by waypoint in the 737NGX and I guess the most waypoints I have had is about 15. It is nice to have an accurate ETA. Before I read this thread I had started a KTPA-KBOS flight that took about an hour of prefight at the gate and that was not from a cold and dark either. Most of the time was spent screwing around with the winds aloft and ISA deviations in FMC. We need ACARS. Michael Cubine

The MD-11 (IIRC the LevelD 767 also) has the most tedious wind entry procedures, since it also asks for temps and the separate altitudes. And it's trial by error too, if you are going by a step climb profile and enter the winds for say 37000ft in the 35000ft line, you mess things up and have to start over. I remember putting in at least 15-20 minutes in preflight just entering winds, exhausting stuff. I really really think it's time for either FSUIPC or ASE to work with PMDG or other payware developers to concoct some kind of interface between the FMC and a weather program. The PMDG 747 much simpler in that regard, as is the NGX, thank goodness. But I will say that if the MD-11 was using the extra temperature entries to match the real life counterpart in obtaining better fuel/eta predictions, it is worth it in the end, for realism sake.