Why is it that the flight simulator scenery is so poor, and yet many other games, such as "Sim City", have great realistic detail? Our hobby is crippled by this, the aircraft improve daily, but it is add on after add on of scenery that puts a damper on this hobby I love so much.

Sorry, but the cartoon details like in "Sim City" left around FS4.

Go land Innsbruck!In winter.

>Why is it that the flight simulator scenery is so poorMSFS is sold as a game and has to compete in that marketplace. Detailed, quality scenery is expensive to create. I own VFR photographic scenery for the UK and it cost me twice as much to buy as FS2004 did. And just look at the price of the Switzerland Professional photographic scenery. Photographic scenery is the most realistic you can buy at the moment so imagine what FS2004 would cost if MS were to make the whole world's scenery to anything like the same level of quality.Neither can you really expect, for the few bucks that FS2004 costs, for MS to populate anything near every airport and airfield in the world or make them very realistic in layout. Just look at the time it takes addon developers to create their masterpieces. Again, I have spent more than the cost of the sim to acquire detailed and realistic renditions of the UK's airfields.What MS has done is to create a fantastic piece of software. You can run it straight out of the box and have endless hours of fun. But if you want more then MS has provided the basis for developers to make incredible addons which just keep on pushing the envelope.So, to sum up, quality scenery costs money and one way or another you have got to pay for it. If you want MS to provide this for you then it will price the sim out of the market and that will be the end of Flight Simulator.David

There are ways to improve on the scenery without having to resort to photographic scenery, just by expanding the current scenery engine:- more landclass types and at a higher resolution- more accurate data for roads, railways, rivers and coastlines- better textures- higher resolution mesh scenery- more detailed and varied autogen sceneryI'm quite sure MS will go this way, and it won't price the sim out of the market. I see no reason why we shouldn't expect improvements on the scenery. Market demands are what pushes flight simulator forward.Paul

Most of the things you've included in your wish list not only cost $$ to develop, but take a serious chunk of HD space to house. I have all of FSGenesis' enhanced mesh terrain and it occupies over 7GB on my system -- and that's only for north and South America and Europe. We still have Arica, Asia and Oceania to go yet.Also these bits do a number on the processor as well and not everyone has a system anywhere powerful enough to handle it. The average FS user doesn't even D/L stuff. They just fly "out-of-the-box" and are perfectly happy. Something about "ignorance is bliss."For us folks that want more, the number and quality of add-ons is almost limitless, so we build a world we like. What I enjoy you may hate but that's okay. To each his own.-------------------Racartronit means something, but I just can't remember what

>Go land Innsbruck!>>In winter.Deserves a LOL :D that one. In poor visiblity as well right?Anyway, If i load up SimCity 4 and look at the houses and everything, then load up OSS Gatwick, or look at Heathrow Pro or.. or.. I have to laugh, SimCity looks realistic?????? Sure it might have moving cars and all but come on man!!If I remember correctly, the airport in SimCity looks like a small hangar made by Fisher Price :D

I think MS should choose a small area such as Vegasand surrounding 100 miles and go absolutely all-out, with super detailed airports, static planes, photographic VFR scenery, ultimatehigh-res mesh plus all the effects tricks. Then we could really see waht could be done, inspire designers, yet not burden down the wholesim for those who wished to avoid such an area.Peter Sydney Australia

I've often thought that maybe MS should make two versions of FS, one for the eastern hemisphere and one for the western hemispere. Half the area, twice the detail.I fly mostly VFR in my home area of upstate NY. It seems unbelieveable that MS didn't even put in the whole Mohawk and Hudson Rivers, which are major VFR references, not to mention railroads, etc.

Yeah-it is pretty poor as these shots show-trouble is I can't remember which is the real shot! :Dhttp://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg

<>In winter.Deserves a LOL that one. In poor visiblity as well right?>>Blizzards, spilling coffee, with a stewardess on my knee. Hey might just make it! (The landing I mean of course)Also my stewardess is, in reality Molly, a Blue Roan cocker spaniel.Ho Hum

Eastern Pilot, "scenery is so poor"First they are far from poor if you compare apple with apple.Performance Performance and Performance is the problems, having more detailed ground scenery, higher resolution texture and details, your sim will get stutters and bad FPS. The video cards memory have to handle the texture and the long loading time. You will have those details with others Msfs version little by little with current market system available etc.Perhaps users always forget about Flight Simulation that's will have limitation with the current system details vs performance impact.ThanksChris Willis[link:fsw.simflight.com/FSWMenuFsSim.html]Clouds And Addons For MsFs

>There are ways to improve on the scenery without having to>resort to photographic sceneryYes, but the only way to get truly realistic scenery is to go the photographic route. Autogen is very good at creating an illusion but it can never be realistic. Textures and landclass are only synthetic - they do not create what is actually there in real life.David

>I've often thought that maybe MS should make two versions of>FS, one for the eastern hemisphere and one for the western>hemispere. Half the area, twice the detail.I'd buy both and merge them. I gotta have the entire world man......Regards

Nice shots Geofa :)Totaly unrealistic of course, but nice....LOL!! P'raps when Mother Nature designs the next mountain, she should stop using Microsofts' ideas on what it should look like eh?LOL!! Can't beat a bit of sarcasm at time ;) Hey, as Geofa has ably shown here, FS9 is capable of some STUNNINGLY realistic terrain. OK, there are parts that don't look as good as others, and at FL300 you do get to see a lot of the repeating texture syndrome, but that is more a limitation of current PC hardware than a lack of effort on the part of Microsoft.Many of the major cities and surrounding areas are based on real photography...you can see that when you look through the scenery texture folders and .cfg files. And go fly over that area...you'll see a remarkable amount of detail. I was amazed when I took a LearJet around Hong Kong and the islands at how much stuff there was...I was astounded when passing over Kowloon heading toward the peak, and just S/W of Kai Tak, to see the streets (with Autogen overlays) in the correct place....even the little insignificant Perth St which is where I used to live when a child, back in the mid 60's. After crossing the peak and flying over the New Territories, I followed the coast line all the way around until the China border and then flew back West across the New Territories and followed a couple of small minor roads that came back over Lion Rock. (OK, they should have gone into a tunnel that runs under Lion Rock, so Microsoft goofed...they suck!!). I was flying this terrain with map in hand, and so could compare reality with virtuality. Amazing how much care was taken with an area of the World that would comfortably fit into the whole of London.Even my current home town in this neglected and forgotten armpit of the UK in East Anglia is in the right place, with the railway line, the main and minor roads in place, the main A14, etc....all there. And it looks good too.Of course VFR scenery is a big improvement, but then you lose the Autogen normaly, and I like all those little buildings and phone poles and electricity pylons....Overall, when you consider the size of the task, Microsoft did a brilliant job of giving us a pretty good looking world in which to play :)