All ILS/LOC are Misaligned

[michael179 0]

Let us know what you think and if it has coverage (e.g. ILS Navaids) for your airports and did it fix specific problems ... like in this AVSIM topic?

 

I will, although I'm away from my Flight Sim PC for about a week currently, but when I get back the first thing I will do is install this, and it's free!

 

Right. Now for the missing chart / procedure for the offset LOC at CYTZ?

 

 

This is the closest I could find to what I found in the CYTZ airport file in P3D, even though this doesn't show it's a localizer. http://imgur.com/2sJl7dr

These are the other charts Navigraph has for CYTZ, but only 1 LOC (really 2 since with the same freq. as 08 is the b/c for 28 as a LOC without G/S). http://imgur.com/AA2QmRX

Something I noticed in the Airport Editor tool was that the LOC for circling was the same freq. as 08 LOC, thus prompting me to think it was for 26 and they messed up somewhere?

 

 

This link has the information and a couple pictures of the approach and the LOC approach chart.

 

http://www.avweb.com/news/probablecause/probable_cause_43_into_the_water_196287-1.html

 

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tuyphywbm228mf3/CYTZ-LOC-APPR.jpg

 

 

I didn't even know this approach existed, amazing! I think they could have removed it since this incident, maybe too risky or expensive.

[mike2060 4]

CYTZ uses Offset ILS Localizers. Nothing is amiss - its how it is in the real world. :)

Check the "Charts" directory and pull up the ILS and Aerodrome charts; you'll see that on both RWY08/26 the LOCs are offset quite a bit (3-6 degrees) to avoid downtown obstacles.

There is no Glideslope on RWY26.

Hence, You will not be able to do any type of "auto-land" at CYTZ - Just like real life. :)

 

****

I did an internet search.

I found the above information in the comments posted ant the bottom of this page:

 http://forums.x-pilot.com/files/file/479-cytz-toronto-island-airport/

 

 

So, as far as I can tell there is nothing wrong with the stock P3D (or FSX) CYYZ or CYTZ airports.

 

There is a glide slope for 08 and 26. Only RW26 ILS you need Ops Spec 607. So sometimes that approach may not be shown.There is also no localizer for RW33.

 

 

The ORBX CYTZ is completely wrong. This an updated version https://www.dropbox.com/s/2smkeb22jjpz2s6/CYTZ_ADEP2_ADE.BGL. I think you have to delete the cytzobjects in this folder as well: C:\Program Files (x86)\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D v2\ORBX\FTX_GLOBAL\FTX_FTXG_AIRPORTS\Scenery. And to note the ILS frequency for RW08 is 110.10 since 26 and 08 share the same frequency.

[vonmar 123]

I found a training manual that tells about the LOC/DME B approach at CYTZ (download PDF file):

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=10&ved=0CGQQFjAJ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.czyz.ca%2Ffiles%2Ftraining%2Fmodules%2F7-YYZSatelliteNov282008.doc&ei=QUuwU-LeMJONqAbnk4CQAw&usg=AFQjCNFUKOV1MK4Id238ExsmBVaxEdR0Ug&bvm=bv.69837884,d.b2k&cad=rja

The manual mentions:

 

"IFR Approaches

There are presently three published IFR approaches serving CYTZ.

Until the end of 2006 these approaches were the ILS/DME 08, the NDB/DME A, and the LOC/DME B.

Near the end of 2006, the LOC/DME B approach was revoked and in its place a new RNAV A approach was created and the NDB/DME A approach renamed as the NDB/DME B approach."

[mike2060 4]

I have the very latest charts for CYTZ and the approaches are ILS RW08, ILS DME RW26, RNAV (GNSS)-A, RNAV (GNSS)-C and (GNSS) NDB DME-B.

 

RW08/26 are the only runways used for commercial flights and are only for turboprops or less. No jets allowed.

[vonmar 123]

I have the very latest charts for CYTZ and the approaches are ILS RW08, ILS DME RW26, RNAV (GNSS)-A, RNAV (GNSS)-C and (GNSS) NDB DME-B.

 

RW08/26 are the only runways used for commercial flights and are only for turboprops or less. No jets allowed.

 

Yes,

In post #36 above I gave a link to the plates ..

[mike2060 4]

Yes,

In post #36 above I gave a link to the plates ..

 

It doesn't contain ILS 26 though.

[vonmar 123]

It doesn't contain ILS 26 though.

 

Maybe you could provide a link to it (approach plate).

 

ILS26 CYTZ (but not available in default MSFX or P3D scenery)

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3qGXolD7-A

 

 

And Info:

http://www.airnavigation.com/news/first-ils-procedure-for-rwy-26-at-cytz/

[vonmar 123]

https://www.fltplan.com has the latest plates. You have to register though.

 

Thanks for the link information to the site providing the plate.

 

I will skip it as that one missing approach is not available in MSFS anyway.

 

Is it illegal to post a jpg (picture) of it on this forum?

[mike2060 4]

Nevermind, fltpln.com doesn't have it.

[vonmar 123]

Nevermind, fltpln.com doesn't have it.

 

Maybe post a screenshot of the plate you have?

 

****

 

I got the RealAir Duke V2 ready for a KDTW CYTZ flight and noticed the Reality XP 530 WAAS had the ILS 26 approach Navdata for NYTZ.

 

Took a screenshot:

 

http://s8.photobucket.com/user/VMartell/media/RXP-RAD-CYTZ-ILS26_zps208a0cac.jpg.html

[michael179 0]

Kinda off topic...but still with the idea of LOC and ILS: while landing, if I want to take over the vertical portion of flight but have the A/P still control my lateral navigation on the LOC, is it possible? I know I could select NAV which would only fly the LOC part of the ILS but then I have to either use V/S mode or it will maintain pitch, I cannot override.

 

I guess I'm asking for the two main aircraft I fly, the Majestic Q400 and the Airbus Extended A320/321.

 

As for the CYTZ ILS 26...I will be checking it out within the coming days to see how it works, but the default scenery doesn't seem to have it. I'll also try to update the P3D nav data.

 

Thanks

Mike

[vonmar 123]

Michael179,

"I will, although I'm away from my Flight Sim PC for about a week currently, but when I get back the first thing I will do is install this, and it's free!"

Ok, see you back here in a week ..


"As for the CYTZ ILS 26...I will be checking it out within the coming days to see how it works, but the default scenery doesn't seem to have it. I'll also try to update the P3D nav data."

Let us know if the P3D navaids / fixes etc ... like for CYTZ ILS 26 got updated ok and how you like the new data(s) set installation.


Mike2060 (previous post here) has the ILS plate for CYTZ ILS 26 (actually, he has all the newest plates) and we could be seeing it here shortly! That will be very helpful to all pilots.
 

[TrafficPilot 121]

Most pilots disconnect the AP in favourable conditions on landing even if everything pertains for an autoland. AFAIK that's because flying under AP does not count as full flying hours for the pilot.

 

Not sure where you heard that  but it's incorrect. Many commercial pilots prefer to fly the approach manually as it is good practice and helps them to stay current. Whether the autopilot is on or off has no effect on his/her flying hours.

[Lorby_SI 2,038]

Not sure where you heard that  but it's incorrect. Many commercial pilots prefer to fly the approach manually as it is good practice and helps them to stay current. Whether the autopilot is on or off has no effect on his/her flying hours.

 

Many thanks, my bad. That was actually what I was trying to say. Guess it shows I'm not a "native speaker".

 

Does anyone know if it is true, that AP hours don't count as full flying hours? I read that somewhere.

[vonmar 123]

Many thanks, my bad. That was actually what I was trying to say. Guess it shows I'm not a "native speaker".

 

Does anyone know if it is true, that AP hours don't count as full flying hours? I read that somewhere.

 

Maybe you could create a new topic in the main forum for you specific question ... this thread is about the ILS alignment.