Genista

Airplane is awesome but engine sounds could be improved - here's how

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Good afternoon everyone,

 

So far I've been enjoying this plane on P3DV3. Thanks PMDG for not letting propliner fans down.

 

But there is something wrong with the engine sounds (not talking about directionnal - we're in a cabin ffs - and not talking about the samples themselves, they are good in my opinion).

In the sim it looks like old Cloudmaster's engine sounds are only driven by the rpm. Code be like in default airplaines, "ok prop is turning at 2000rpm, play the 2000rpm sample".

Like your engine could be OFF or ON, your throttles could be closed or wide open, this makes absolutely no difference in sound as long as the props keep turning. (do the test by yourself: take off, get some speed, turn off the magnetos and the fuel and everything, and listen)

Now in real life (I speak as a maintenance guy working and doing runups on prop/turboprop twins regurlarly) it is more complicated. There is a lot more diversity of sounds you can make at the same rpm. I guarantee you, an engine at 30% throttle and 2000rpm low pitch won't sound the same as said engine at wide open throttle  2000rpm high pitch (first one is "normal"; second one, loud prop sound cutting the air). And if your engines stop running mid air, you'll immediately notice how quiet it gets. Only thing remaining is a quiet helicopter-ish prop sound when you're windmilling.

So my suggestion is to separate prop sound and engine roar and make it so that:

- Prop loudness is tied to BMEP (how hard the prop bites the air, thus generating noise)

 - Engine roar loudness tied to MP (easy test: in your car, open the throttle from 1000 to 3000rpm and then release it without changing gear. You'll notice how the engine makes less noise when you release the throttles,even if the RPM is higher)

- Prop and engine "pitch" linked to RPM, like now.

Thank you

 

 

 

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I don't know how to respond, the sound mix is much more complex than you give it credit.  Maybe you've been around too many props?  I know my hearing is so bad the dog goes outside when I turn on the TV.

If you try full throttle and 2000 RPM on these engines they will be destroyed along with someone's career.  I understand what you are saying, but I'm not buying it...with all due respect.

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29 minutes ago, downscc said:

 

If you try full throttle and 2000 RPM on these engines they will be destroyed along with someone's career.  I understand what you are saying, but I'm not buying it...with all due respect.

Thanks for pointing that out, but with all due respect this was not the point of my post at all  !

Like I could argue with you that dogs don't care about the TV volume but I know that this is a (pretty funny) exagerated example to illustrate your idea. This was not your main point so I won't quote 2% of your post and act like I didn't read the rest. So please let's talk about sounds :biggrin:

What I'm talking about was very well implemented in the old PMDG's turboprops so you guys know how to do it...

 

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Yeah but, I hate using that, turboprops really really sound different.  For one they are usually constant speed and it is the torque and pitch that is changing.  The piston props, as you know, do sound vastly different than turbos.  My favorite turboprops are the USAF C-130s, I love the many different sounds and whines that they make with different settings and backup into revetments. On the other hand, a DC-6 is going to be pretty much as PMDG nailed it, in fact there's very little pitch control until you're accelerating through about 40-50 kts when the props finally hit the fine pitch stop and you finally got 2800 RPM.  So for the most part the ramp sounds are just as simple as it appears.

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Hi Aymerick,

 

Thanks for the feedback but there is nothing we can do in relation to your suggestions.

1 The sound system was built and provided by FSX, and in their implementation, all engine sounds are controlled by RPM - we cannot change this within the realm of the sim.

2 For the J41, yes, we did have sounds that were controlled by the Prop pitch, but that was a turbo prop aircraft that uses prop pitch to control thrust.  The DC-6 engines are not turboprops, the only time pitch is significantly used is for reverse, and that has been already implemented.

 

Cheers,

 

 

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1 hour ago, chiswick72 said:

Hi Aymerick,

 

Thanks for the feedback but there is nothing we can do in relation to your suggestions.

1 The sound system was built and provided by FSX, and in their implementation, all engine sounds are controlled by RPM - we cannot change this within the realm of the sim.

2 For the J41, yes, we did have sounds that were controlled by the Prop pitch, but that was a turbo prop aircraft that uses prop pitch to control thrust.  The DC-6 engines are not turboprops, the only time pitch is significantly used is for reverse, and that has been already implemented.

 

Cheers,

 

 

Thanks for your answer. I see. This is why A2A and MJC for exemple went to an external audio generator. But their result is very good in the end-it makes the difference (for audiophiles at least :biggrin:)

 

Btw DC-6 prop is constant speed too, the difference with turbo props is that on the DC6 prop RPM is coupled to engine RPM  while on the turbo props there is 2 to 3 different RPM that are not coupled (N1, N2, prop shaft)

When doing runups on a piston engine (like the in the DC-6 manual), you know, you put MP on atmospheric pressure, full RPM, test the magnetos and then the prop by pulling the lever from low to high pitch, the RPM decreases of course and you hear the engine "forcing" and the prop getting really loud, cutting the air with an helicopter-ish buzz. This give you the audible indication that the prop is working as it should.

And still hearing engines roaring when fuel is cut and mags on off, but prop is windmilling, well... Given the INCREDIBLE attention of detail on the rest of the plane (Lights... Systems.. Gps... Buttons clicks... Fuel management... Amazing documentation...) ... This just feel off... Like drinking 2000 years old roman wine in a plastic cup :tongue:

 

Cheers and have a good day,

 

 

 

 

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PMDG has their own way of doing things and no one will change their mind. 

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4 hours ago, warbirds said:

PMDG has their own way of doing things and no one will change their mind. 

Thanks for that helpful insight.

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