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Cactus521

White House Evacuated

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Just ran across this. Dont know if you guys have seen this before or not. I havent, so i though i would share for the ones like me, that havent heard or seen about this.Story is a C150 with a CFI and a Student were flying to an airshow and came with in 3 miles of the white house. Every one flipped out over a C150 about 2k up doing 105 or 110mph and sounded their alarm. *rolls eyes* Ahh well, here is the link: http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/05/11/evacuation/index.htmlIm curious to know why this action wasnt taken on 9/11 when a commercial airliner was flying for the pentagon after the attacks on NYC, and by then, every one knew about it.Ahh well, just a few questions in my mind. I think this whole ordeal is a tad rediculous, but then again, its saftey procedures.. Seems pretty comical though IMO. :-lol

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hey that cessna, moving at mach speed, could do a lot of damage with full fuel tanks and a large cargo hold full of who knows what. why it may have torn up the lawn where they put the annual christmas tree. jack wilson

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HSA security in action...They have developed some of the most confusing airspace known to man around DC. Then they have no system of rapidly disseminating the nature of the threat (a C150 would crumple like foil against the WH or Capitol). Folks on the street were in far greater danger to this little plane than inside a building. One "expert" is lamenting the fact that the plane wasn't shot down (coulda been carrying explosives!!) Maybe 50 pounds worth based on the 150 usable load with full tanks and two men on board...As for the press coverage...must be a slow news day, they just went stupid. Jeesh, what a joke...and the officials are touting this as an example of security in action. I hope the pilots don't have to pay too dearly for this mistake (just heard on Fox no charges being filed on the pilots), and that GA doesn't suffer from the standard government kneejerk reaction to this minor incident...and maybe the billions we spend on HSA might come up with a usable, functional, and real aviation security system (like luggage scanners that work, ramp and fuel farm security, etc).Dave

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An aircraft entered prohibited airspace, apparently ignored ATC intructions, and headed straight for the centre of Washington.But some people seem to think that's OK because it couldn't have caused too much damage or killed too many people!

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And others seem to think it's OK because it COULD have caused damage... Haven't heard them here, but they're out there.

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"An aircraft entered prohibited airspace, apparently ignored ATC intructions, and headed straight for the centre of Washington.But some people seem to think that's OK because it couldn't have caused too much damage or killed too many people!"Good catch--never mind the fact that a 150 is all someone would need to deliver a dirty bomb, chemical bomb or even a small nuke device. If the Capitol or White House were closed because of contamination, it would be a huge symbol for any odd terrorist organization or Timothy McVeigh Wannabe. I hate to say it, but three miles is too close IMHO. That's only 90 seconds away from a disaster.-John

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I Agree with John on this one.

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>Good catch--never mind the fact that a 150 is all someone>would need to deliver a dirty bomb, chemical bomb or even a>small nuke device.You completely ignore the fact that your average Geo Metro is capable of carrying a far larger destructive device to the Capitol. Why aren't you whining about that?

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>>Good catch--never mind the fact that a 150 is all someone>>would need to deliver a dirty bomb, chemical bomb or even a>>small nuke device.>>You completely ignore the fact that your average Geo Metro is>capable of carrying a far larger destructive device to the>Capitol. Why aren't you whining about that?A block of c4 could fit in a lawnmower even.. It doesnt make sense to me. Even if this plane was carrying a bomb, it would make a much smaller boom than a 763 loaded with thousand and thousands of pounds of Jet-A. This is just comical. And something else, you arent required to be communicating with a Controller when flying. Alot of times, controlled airspace doesnt start untill about 1600ft or so. I fly at the 4th largest city in the US, and only a few times am i communicating with controllers. Because of the fact that im flying, doesnt require ATC. If your in a 152, below Bravo airspace, and your at 1100ft or so, thats uncontrolled airspace. Which the closer you get to the major airports, IAH, HOU, etc etc, the lower airspaces become controlled. Confusing, im trying to figure out how to explain this all, i think all the real pilots understand what im trying to say though. :)I just think this was a bit rediculous over a 150 not even doing 100mph. Read on a post above this one, i 150 would crumble like foil against the White House. Common,, think about it... Yeah, there would be damage, but nearly all would be cosmetic. May damage a few blades of grass, but for the main part, if this would of been an act of terrorism, the only idiots dead would be the ones flying. Like i said, seemed like this was a little bit of over reacting. How come this action wasnt taken on the commercial airliner flying towards D.C after the attacks on NYC? The pentagon was well aware of the situation, but how come the attacks on the pentagon werent prevented? It seriously could have been IMO.Every one is allowed there opinion, and this is mine.. :)

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Dan,If someone can manage to drop(fly) that Geo Metro on the Capitol Dome or in the Oval Office, then I'll voice equal concern. But please don't use words like "whining" when I voice a concern over what happened. I am as big an aviation buff as you are, in the process of getting my license, and fearful that some will use this as a means of saying "look how bad GA is". I believe none of that, but I do believe any light aircraft can do a great deal of harm in malicious hands, just by their ability to do things a Geo Metro can't. And, if you've driven in DC, it takes close to an hour sometimes to go three miles in downtown with the traffic and traffic restrictions in place. And, if you've ever driven a Geo Metro, it takes 20 seconds just to go from 0 to 60. Got one of those as a rental once. Hated the thing!-John

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"Like i said, seemed like this was a little bit of over reacting. How come this action wasnt taken on the commercial airliner flying towards D.C after the attacks on NYC? The pentagon was well aware of the situation, but how come the attacks on the pentagon werent prevented? It seriously could have been IMO."That's already been hashed over by Congress. Action should have been taken on 9/11 but we weren't prepared. I suspect you knew that when drafting your response.I have no idea why simmers here--some of who don't even fly--take this as such a threat against aviation when people voice a concern or agreement over the way an incident was handled. And I should also correct you--a 150--in a dive from 2000 feet 3 miles out, can certainly exceed 120mph--that's only a little over 100kts. It's not about the damage a 150 can cause--it's about the means it can cause the damage, by flying over most of the barriers and means we have in place to prevent damage from vehicles. A dirty bomb just needs to be big enough to contaminate the White House, not destroy it. An aircraft makes it easier to do that since you don't need to risk the same amount of explosive and thus risk of detection.Anyway, there's no excuse for a CFI flying towards central DC given today's fears. That tall white pointy thing should catch his attention even if his radio was down :)

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So, beacuse it's not possible to protect against everything, we don't protect against anything?

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Hi All; Seems memories are awfully short, or maybe people are just awfullyyoung. There was a GA Aircraft flown INTO the side of the White House, I believe during Clintons first term. DennyProfessional Tourist

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When I learned to fly many years ago in the UK I didn't have what was then called a Radio Telephny Certificate so I couldn't use the radio. Nevertheless I was taught to keep the radio tuned to the local ATC and maintain a listening watch just in case. It still seems sensible even now. More so if a pilot has a radio rating.

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That big highway (the Capital Beltway) that circles the city's north side about ten miles from the government center would be pretty hard to miss too. Although that would be about five miles inside the special rules area, that's not near as close as they were when they finally turned away.If the plane was equiped with a single OBI, all they had to do would be to follow an outbound radial of the Fredrick MD VOR until they were near the Chesapeake Bay. If the president's bike ride precluded that, they could have asked for clearance through the Class B near Dulles or diverted a dozen miles west of Dulles.

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>Hi All;>> Seems memories are awfully short, or maybe people are just>awfully>young.>> There was a GA Aircraft flown INTO the side of the White>House, I >believe during Clintons first term.Yes, it scorched the siding even. Took a whole gallon of Sears' Best Latex to repair the damage.

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>So, beacuse it's not possible to protect against everything,>we don't protect against anything?Exactly. The threat posed is so miniscule compared to other threats, that it's not even worth worrying about. It's really embassasing that our country acts so chicken-little about a flying beercan.

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>Dan,>>If someone can manage to drop(fly) that Geo Metro on the>Capitol Dome or in the Oval Office, then I'll voice equal>concern. If they have an explosive device powerful enough to do significant damage to either structure, it won't matter if it is a direct hit, or detonated from a hundred yards away.> But please don't use words like "whining" when I>voice a concern over what happened. It IS whining. It is pandering to the nannystate mentality which has become so prevalent in this country over the past few decades. What you SHOULD be concerned about is the very existance of the FRZ and popup TFRs.

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>>Good catch--never mind the fact that a 150 is all someone would need to >>deliver a dirty bomb, chemical bomb or even a small nuke device.You are eminently qualified to be 'news' reader guy on Fox News. Have the Killer Bees arrived yet?

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"It IS whining. It is pandering to the nannystate mentality which has become so prevalent in this country over the past few decades. What you SHOULD be concerned about is the very existance of the FRZ and popup TFRs."If that's how you choose to make a point, no sense in discussing this with you. I'll bow out of the discussion now, being overwhelmed by your superior insight into the issue...

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"You are eminently qualified to be 'news' reader guy on Fox News. Have the Killer Bees arrived yet?"I'll let Tom or one of the other moderators answer your question for you.

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