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Atlas

Traffic mod compatibility?

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I'm starting my search now for a traffic mod and would like one that works with P2A.  IIRC, World Traffic 3 was somewhat integrated but can someone expound on that?  I got the impression the two programs weren't 100% in sync with each other.

How about other programs like Traffic Global?  It seems like a lot of people like that one and say it is superior to WT.

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I was using World Traffic 3 and now prefer Traffic Global. World Traffic 3 has to generate flight plans for the ai aircraft prior to each flight. This can take several minutes and gets old pretty quickly. With Traffic Global you're ready to go with no delay. You will get traffic alerts from P2A once you set up XP properly, which takes but a couple of minutes and the Traffic Global docs explain how to do this. AI traffic will also show up on your planes TCAS and in the P2A map window. Traffic Global will supposedly reserve a parking spot for you at your destination airport, meaning no ai will park there, but this feature doesn't seem to work very consistently. As far as I know there is no interactivity between P2A and ground ai traffic with any any add-on traffic program, but I could be mistaken.

 

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3 hours ago, Sidney Schwartz said:

World Traffic 3 has to generate flight plans for the ai aircraft prior to each flight. This can take several minutes and gets old pretty quickly.

Several minutes per flight?  What if you do like an A-B, B-A flight, will it still need it for the return trip?

How is P2A integration with WT and P2A integration with TG?  It seems like these two are the best traffic programs so far but which one works best or is more integrated with P2A?

 

3 hours ago, Sidney Schwartz said:

You will get traffic alerts from P2A once you set up XP properly, which takes but a couple of minutes and the Traffic Global docs explain how to do this

Is this per-flight too or a one-time setup in the beginning?

 

3 hours ago, Sidney Schwartz said:

As far as I know there is no interactivity between P2A and ground ai traffic with any any add-on traffic program, but I could be mistaken.

I don't quite understand what you're saying there.

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Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Atlas said:

Several minutes per flight?  What if you do like an A-B, B-A flight, will it still need it for the return trip?

Yes, it has to be done every time you make a flight, even if you repeat the same flight I believe.

Quote

How is P2A integration with WT and P2A integration with TG?  It seems like these two are the best traffic programs so far but which one works best or is more integrated with P2A?

I don't recall if I was getting traffic alerts from P2A with WT. That's about the only interaction you'll get with any traffic program. 

Quote

Is this per-flight too or a one-time setup in the beginning?

This is a one-time-and-done deal.

Quote

I don't quite understand what you're saying there.

By interactivity with ground traffic, I mean that P2A is unable to "see" ai traffic when you are taxiing, nor can it control ai traffic. So at busy airports you will frequently have ai planes taxiing right through you, no yielding for you, and otherwise completely ignoring you. As I said, I believe this is true of any traffic program you use.

One other thing I just remembered. If you are on short final and there is an ai aircraft on the runway, P2A will instruct you to go around and then vector you back to the the approach, so that's another instance of interactivity.

One thing I've been disappointed with with both TG and WT is that it ai traffic in the air is almost impossible to see. 99 times of 100 when I get a traffic alert, I'll never see the other plane. It has to be a near collision before the other plane becomes visible. 

 

Edited by Sidney Schwartz

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So P2A works with both TG and WT?  I thought it was only one and didn't yet have integration with the other?

How is GA AI flight integration in TG?  It seems like more people prefer TG due to not having to generate flight plans but I can't find any info of any ability to set or control number of GA AI aircraft.

I don't suppose you can "hear" AI traffic like default ATC talks to AI traffic?  Does P2A handle calls to AI traffic as well?  Like if there is an aircraft on final, does it "call" to P2A?

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It may be more accurate to say that P2A (and other atc programs) co-exist with TG and WT (and other traffic programs). Due to the way XP works internally, true integration of the two would be extremely difficult...at least that's what I've gathered. When using TG, P2A will give you traffic alerts and will issue a go-around if there is a plane on the runway. It will also have you hold for take off if there is an ai plane on short final, and will caution "wake turbulence" if you are departing right after an ai plane departs on the same runway. It's been too long since I've used WT for me to remember how P2A interacts with it.

TG has an option to generate "synthetic ga." Can't say I've notice much in the way of ga traffic. Here's a link to the TG manual on the JustFlight web site. It will probably answer your questions better than I can...

https://downloads.justflight.com/products/JFF003043/Traffic Global X-Plane manual.pdf

P2A does not talk to ai aircraft at all. For realistic atc chatter I use this program...

https://www.stickandrudderstudios.com/x-atc-chatter-overview/

It's another expense but it does a very nice job. There may be freeware chatter programs but I've had no experience with them.

 

 

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Thanks for that link, I'll give it a look! 

If you say programs co-exist together rather than are integrated, that still leaves the question which ones co-exist with each other better?

It's quite disappointing to see that AI traffic will largely ignore you and taxi right through you but I guess that's normal as I have airport AI vehicles drive through my aircraft all the time.  What I find more disappointing is that while you can "see" the aircraft, it seems like there is no way to "hear" the aircraft via ATC chatter.... I think default XP ATC talks to AI aircraft? 

Would it be possible for you to test out TG and synthetic GA by trying it out on some small airport, maybe a grass stirp somewhere?  So far all videos I've found seem to be from major airports.  I fly a lot of FS Economy so I'm usually flying into smaller airports.

Thanks for your help!

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Posted (edited)

Pilot2ATC gets the same info as your TCAS system in x plane. Add the 19 AI planes with a lightweight plane model provided by the traffic plugin, and you and pilot2atc will be able to see them. The issue is that there is no integration beyond that. The AI planes will not communicate with Pilot2ATC and Pilot2ATC cannot control the aircraft. I still enjoy using Pilot2ATC with Traffic Global/WT3 as it's nice to hear the "number 2 for departure", or "hold short for traffic on final" callouts that Pilot2ATC will do. The system isn't perfect, but it gives you something more for immersion. Pilot2ATC does ATC very well, but there is still a desire for more immersion that traffic plugins can't fully fulfill until Pilot2ATC has a way of controlling AI planes and communicating with them, which I'm not sure is in the works or possible.

As far as planes taxiing on the runway for takeoff while you are on final, and driving through you while taxiing. That should be handled by the AI traffic plugin and not Pilot2ATC and I've noticed both Traffic Global and World Traffic 3 will do it.

 

Do note that I have no personal experience with GA and AI traffic. I've only flown commercial airliners with AI traffic enabled. I can't tell you which one does AI traffic better. If you are looking for a free AI traffic plugin to try. You could check out LiveTraffic on the x plane forums.

Edited by denalb

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Traffic Global XP does everything better apart from ground taxing smoothness and some flight phases, that is being improved greatly though. It is aware of you and will give way most of the time on the ground. But it doesn't know where you are going so can't always stop situations where you meet another aircraft head on, that obviously has a lot to do with the airport layout also.

I've uninstalled WT3 and never used it again since Traffic Global for Xplane was released. When Traffic Global was first released I was very critical of its problems and errors and was invited to the beta team to help improve the product and give feedback. Some of the stuff that is coming in future releases will be very welcome.

The best thing of all about Traffic Global is the near zero hit on your frame rate and no stutters and ironically those are the worst things about WT3, really bad frame rates and terrible stutters.

One other note Traffic Global for P3D and FSX etc, is not made by the same developers, they are sold by the same distributor i.e. Just Flight, but they are completely different programs and approaches to AI Traffic. Traffic Global for FSX and P3D is not much more than MyTraffic X with a new skin with all the drawbacks of bgl traffic. I'm not on that beta team but I do own that product and i'm not being using that anymore either, I prefer Ultimate Traffic Live which is another AI package that uses similar techniques to TGXP. You should hold off on buying that too as there is a new version of Ultimate Traffic Live coming out in the near future, again for clarity this is an FSX P3D sim product.


Cheers, Andy.

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12 hours ago, denalb said:

Add the 19 AI planes with a lightweight plane model provided by the traffic plugin, and you and pilot2atc will be able to see them.

Does that include in the ground or just in the air?

I do like the idea of more aircraft moving on the ground and having to wait to cross runway or not being cleared for departure all the time does add to the immersion; however, the radios are then eerily quiet and having "fake chatter" just doesn't match up.  It's like watching a video where the sound doesn't match the actor's mouth movements.

 

12 hours ago, denalb said:

As far as planes taxiing on the runway for takeoff while you are on final, and driving through you while taxiing. That should be handled by the AI traffic plugin and not Pilot2ATC and I've noticed both Traffic Global and World Traffic 3 will do it.

What do you mean "will do it"?  Will drive right through you?

 

8 hours ago, Andydigital said:

It is aware of you and will give way most of the time on the ground. But it doesn't know where you are going so can't always stop situations where you meet another aircraft head on, that obviously has a lot to do with the airport layout also.

So it just gives way at intersections or if you come at it at an angle?  I guess if P2ATC isn't aware of ground traffic, it might give me taxi directions that go against the flow?

 

8 hours ago, Andydigital said:

I've uninstalled WT3 and never used it again since Traffic Global for Xplane was released. When Traffic Global was first released I was very critical of its problems and errors and was invited to the beta team to help improve the product and give feedback. Some of the stuff that is coming in future releases will be very welcome.

The best thing of all about Traffic Global is the near zero hit on your frame rate and no stutters and ironically those are the worst things about WT3, really bad frame rates and terrible stutters.

I have heard of these issues and is the main reason I'm looking at TG instead of WT3.  The only thing that's keeping me from pulling the trigger really is the GA implementation.  I do not fly airlines and rarely fly into big airports in the sim so GA aircraft and small airport operations are more important to me than perfect AI airline schedules or parking at the right gates.

Everyone that has tried TG seems to have a very, very positive feedback regarding the product but I've yet to find a review that addresses GA implementation.  Can you help me out with that?

Also, since you've moved on to TG over WT, I assume that P2A integration/co-existence in TG is the same as it is in WT or better?

 

8 hours ago, Andydigital said:

One other note Traffic Global for P3D and FSX etc, is not made by the same developers, they are sold by the same distributor i.e. Just Flight, but they are completely different programs and approaches to AI Traffic. Traffic Global for FSX and P3D is not much more than MyTraffic X with a new skin with all the drawbacks of bgl traffic. I'm not on that beta team but I do own that product and i'm not being using that anymore either, I prefer Ultimate Traffic Live which is another AI package that uses similar techniques to TGXP. You should hold off on buying that too as there is a new version of Ultimate Traffic Live coming out in the near future, again for clarity this is an FSX P3D sim product.

Thanks for that info!  However, I am only interested in XP11 implementation as although I have FSX, I don't fly there very often and XP is my main sim.

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6 hours ago, Atlas said:

The only thing that's keeping me from pulling the trigger really is the GA implementation.  I do not fly airlines and rarely fly into big airports in the sim so GA aircraft and small airport operations are more important to me than perfect AI airline schedules or parking at the right gates.

That being the case I don't think either traffic program is going to float your boat.

Here's a link for the WT manual in case you want to have a look at it anyway...

http://www.classicjetsims.com/downloads/WorldTraffic.pdf

 

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Is there any traffic program that would cater more to GA flights then?  I see both WT3 and TG mention some sort of GA implementation but I've yet to find a YT video that shows this in detail.

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4 hours ago, Atlas said:

Is there any traffic program that would cater more to GA flights then?  I see both WT3 and TG mention some sort of GA implementation but I've yet to find a YT video that shows this in detail.

Have you looked in to X-Life? It's one of those free plugins that you may want to check out. I have never installed or read much about it. I just know it exists.

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Bump!  Any help especially regarding the GA flights to small airports please?

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