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Guest chrishunt

The Blurries - New Thoughts?

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I've been following the blurries threads for a while and think I might be able to contribute something to the debate (or not).A couple of years ago Dave Garewood released a set of superb Hunters for FS9. The only drawback to this Hunter model was that when cycling through the views (cockpit, VC, external etc) the outside world would desolve into a blurry mess and take a long time to clarify. If I remember correctly this was put down to the 32bit textures that Dave used for the external model. This happened with no other aircraft that I used for FS9.Something similar appears to be happening in FSX (SP1 and onwards) with a range of aircraft, albeit that the outside world is slightly less blurry (honestly) than was the case in FS9.Could the answer lie in the interaction between aircraft textures and scenery textures, rather than just within the scenery textures? In all cases aircraft textures stay sharp whilst those of the ground do not.I too get blurries but rarely if I stay inside the cockpit and often a blurry world when viewed from outside becomes significantly less blurry when viewed from inside the cockpit.Just a thought.Regards,Chris

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Great idea, Chris, thanks for the suggestions.This has always been a problem in FS and is not particularly related to image format (32-bit vs. DXT) or to interaction between airplane and scenery (because it is all just textures to the game).Instead, the problem is the quantity of the textures and the resources available.If you stay inside the cockpit, then the game does not load most of the exterior airplane textures, and you can stay within the limits imposed by your memory.Once you switch views, the game must load extra textures, and keep in memory the ones already loaded.Switch views again and more textures get added.For those with a lot of memory, the problem is minimized, but for some of us it is just too much and the problems begin.32-bit textures are always much larger than DXT format and so exacerbate the problem, but it is usually a matter of limited resources and trying to do too much with them.Except of course if it is a driver problem. Or switching to a larger screen resolution that multiplies the number of pixels that must be rendered. Or any number of other possible causes....Best regards.Luis

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Hi Luis,In general I agree with all that you say. In this instance however, the difference in FS9 between the Hunter and other aircraft was so pronounced as to be definately linked to that aircraft. I suspect that aircraft textures are loaded in a different way to those of scenery - perhaps Phil can comment?I understand the issue of resources but to be honest there should be sufficient resources on a 2Gb RAM and 512Mb video card memory system to be able to cope. A lot of people experiencing the blurries have a far better system than I. I don't see the blurries as a resource issue in the usual way, specifically because we see no other affect of this particular "resource" issue, e.g. slower frame rates, ctd etc. I believe this is a texture processing issue where certain textures are caught in a queue where other textures are constantly queue jumping therefore always being refreshed ahead of others, e.g. the queue jumpers being those of the aircraft you happen to be flying.Regards,Chris

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Hi Chris,there's a known issue when some texture formats aren't used as they are supposed to. Specifically, if there's a mix of DTX1 textures with and without mipmaps in the user's "viewshed" then those sudden and persistent blurries will occur. I assume that was the case with the Hunter.That is, however, quite different from the "usual" blurries, which are, as Luis points out, for the most part resource issues. It just so happens that FS uses texture (mipmap) loading as the low man on the totem pole; if the sim is busy with other stuff then mipmap refresh or stepping-up will be delayed. Memory availability is of secondary concern here.Cheers, Holger

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>That is, however, quite different from the "usual" blurries,>which are, as Luis points out, for the most part resource>issues. It just so happens that FS uses texture (mipmap)>loading as the low man on the totem pole; if the sim is busy>with other stuff then mipmap refresh or stepping-up will be>delayed. Memory availability is of secondary concern here.It would appear to me that what you just described is not so much a resource problem as much as problem in the way the resources are utilized by the software.

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Hello Chris,You are right, of course, there could be any number of other reasons for this behavior. Certainly, I am not an expert and there is a lot that I don't know about FS.But, this is very easy to test, isn't it? Just take a look at the Hunter's texture folder - how large is it?Now, copy the textures somewhere and then make a set of them that is reduced in size, for example, reduce all of them to 256 x 256 pixels, and even make another set where they are all 32 x 32 pixels.Now, try each set in turn and see what happens in game.If you still get blurry ground textures, then something else is the reason. But, if they all of a sudden no longer appear, then you have a pretty good chance of having found the reason - too many textures.Please let us know how it turns out.Best regards.Luis

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If a) there is a way to author content such that it doesn't show blurries, and :( content authored to that style doesn't show blurries and c) content authored otherwise does show blurries then there is an existence proof that the blurries in that case are due to the authoring style.

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This certainly is supported by my observations when I upgraded the processor while keeping the video memory the same (256 MB).Before, the scenery could not keep up and I would get blurry textures in front of my plane that would not "crisp up" as I was flying.Now, problem gone.Old system: PIV-2.8 New system: Q6600-2.4.

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