>>I do not like payware. I never did. I feel like paying for a >prodcut when we already payed for the FS and the hardware is >just wrong. >Being the "picky" person I am when it comes to enjoyable simming, the majority of my "favorites" are now paywhere! Products such as Dreamfleets Archer, FSD's Cheyenne, PSS's Airbus, & Flight 1's Cessna 421 are wonderfully modeled products that you seldom see with freeware, but then I guess you wouldn't know! There have also been a number of truely outstanding freeware projects too, but with the hours involved to produce them, they're getting harder to come by.In otherwords----------- I disagree with your post. I prefer planes where a number of individuals are involved that can master specific tasks of building the simulated aircraft. This usually involves thousands of hours. It can be a labor of love for one or two models, but then compensation for time & materials is truely deserved. If you were into "paywhere" at all, you would probably notice that the most experienced developers who keep getting better & better are payware, or at least involved in payware as well as a few "freebies"! L.Adamson

"which took my attention as they were all much of a muchness"Say huh? I have to get a Brit dictionary. You guys even confuse me, and I have spent way too much time there.... :)"I feel the solution which I believe Tom is arriving at will be the best for the modern face of flight simming."You have WAY MORE CONFIDENCE in me than my wife does. :-lolBTW.. I will be in your neck of the woods on June 23rd. You free to make it to LHR? You're buying of course.

Tom........I said I was "sorry" :)Luckily, the references to commercial products on these forums, at least get me to the front page once awhile!!I'll try a bit harder!! :-lol :-lol L.AdamsonP.S.--- I do hope we can keep some type of references to commercial post's on these boards. It DOES make them more entertaining!

"P.S.--- I do hope we can keep some type of references to commercial post's on these boards. It DOES make them more entertaining!"Had you left out the "entertaining" bit, I would have said; "not to worry, we are working on it". However, in light of that "entertainment" quip, I ain't so sure. I don't know that I like your definition of "entertainment". :-lolAh heck, not to worry, we're working on it and I am sure that you will have ample room to be "entertained". Within the policies of AVSIM, of course. RIGHT???? :)

Joe,I couldn't agree more. :) Developers teasing us with freeware releases to "hook" us for their pay aircraft is very good business strategy. A bit of the old "bait and switch", but certainly without the negative aspects that we all think of it in.The freeware releases would have to be good too... because who would buy a commercial product if the freeware wasn't up to par? :)

>BTW.. I will be in your neck of the woods on June 23rd. You free to make it to LHR? You're buying of course.

LarryI couldnt have said it better myself :-)Peter

First, you are up WAY TOO LATE!!! Go to bed!Second.. I will send you an email with the details.

>Ah heck, not to worry, we're working on it and I am sure that you will have ample room to be "entertained". Within the policies of AVSIM, of course. RIGHT????

Knew I had forgotten to change the clocks to BST ;-) Bon Nuit ;-)Peter

"Tom one of my life mottos has been "keep pushing the limits" the trouble with that is that now and again you loose it and give yourself a fright but gain a lot of experience in the process"Yeah, yeah, yeah.. My wife tells me that at least once every three days. I am tired of hearing it! She seems to put a lot of emphasis on the "fright" bit. As for the experience? I couldn't say. :-lol

I have read through this entire thread. While I agree that commercials should not be allowed, I don't agree with the kneejerk reaction that payware is automatically bad and that freeware is revealed truth. I takes about two minutes to scroll through this thread from top to bottom because of the bandwidth taken up by banner sigs. And most of those sigs are advertisements for something, albeit freeware. I realize they may be moderators and their products are free, but they still advertise. What, without a kneejerk condemnation of the evils of payware, is the difference?bob (no sig banner)

Hi Tom,"Joe, banning letter in the mail. You are giving away too many secrets.":-lol :-lol :-lol :-lol :-lolNahhhh, I'm sure all the commercial developers will now give me a free copy of all of their aircraft as a gesture of goodwill.......And showing them the way... :-lol :-lolJoe....wake up...I said wake up........Huh, was I dreaming......Yes, you have a phone call, some guy named.......:-lol :-lol :-lolBut at least I will always have my sense of humor...Regards,Joe :-wave .http://home.attbi.com/~jranos/mysig.jpg http://avsim.com/hangar/air/bfu/logo70.gif

"I realize they may be moderators and their products are free, but they still advertise. What, without a kneejerk condemnation of the evils of payware, is the difference?" That's an easy one. It is the FREEWARE that brings people to the Host site. Payware is handled at it's own site and benefits the host ZERO %. Hence, a free ride on the backs of others if allowed. Payware should be posted as a news item with a link to it, but that's it. Let them buy space for their $$ products if they want to really advertise it. All other $$$$ making items do.Don

> It is the FREEWARE that brings people to >the Host site. Not here! While a few freeware products have been interesting lately, there are a number of payware products that I've REALLY wanted to read about. It's these general forums that I ususally find out about these new offerings. I seldom read the non-general forums that just deal with advertising, new products, etc. In fact.......... I don't know if new products/advertising forums really exist.I get a lot of firsthand info here, then branch off to support forums such as PSS, PMDG, FSD, Dreamfleet (Flightsim.com), etc.----- when & only when I've found something interesting. Without doubt, connections to both payware & freeware products need to be found HERE first. It's always intersting to see who has the "scoop" on new products first! AVSIM or FLIGHTSIM.com. I never get to the main page of Flightsim. com either!!L.Adamson