DougMatthews

>Hi Juan and Luis.>>It's very strange! Even using an exclusion GUID of>{00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000} you still get traffic!>Even leaving off the -addtocells option.>>I guess this is a bug. :(>>DickThis does indeed appear to be a bug. I've reproduced it and will pass along to the appropriate team members.-Doug

>I've written code in AutoAsm to create the new-style roads,>traffic and shorelines for FSX (thanks for the help, guys).>But I'm unable to select different shoreline textures which>are listed in terrain.cfg. I need to know how to find the guid>to place in the dbf file.>>Roads are no problem because the road textures listed in>terrain.cfg have guid entries.>>Under (texture.n), 'Terrain Cinfiguration File' describes the>parameters that appear in terrain.cfg. The third paramater is>'guid'. Problem is, the third parameter in the shoreline>textures in terrain.cfg is not the guid but a 'LegacyID', for>example 'LegacyId=1029' In fact the shoreline entries do not>have guid values.>>So my question is: how to obtain the guid for a given>shoreline texture?>>Many thanks.>>Best regards,> ChrisThese are the defaults:Generic Lake Shoreline {7b3229d8-18ed-4f4d-ae22-12660862aba1}Generic River Shoreline {fda34c77-39fd-4507-b128-f4f55fec60dc}Generic Ocean Shoreline {68900a2a-6679-4580-88ea-8bfed4dac361}Generic Canal/Channel Shoreline {acc45e7f-a47a-44d6-ada6-59c9271bdb71}Note that you can now right-click on vector features in TmfViewer and Identify things like textures.-Doug

>Hi there,>>KHFY is in North America, correct? If so then you need "-" in>front of the longitude values ;-)>>Cheers, HolgerAnd he'll need to trade the longitudeMinimum and longitudeMaximum magnitudes.-Doug

>From what I understand, this is ACES first release for FS? It>was another group who did FS9 and FS8, etc...Ummmm.... nope.>If this is the case, one would assume that FS11 will>(hopefully) be totally redone taking advantage of multicores,>SLI and 64bit. Ummmm.... we'll see what happens (don't hold your breath on "totally redone").>ACES jumped in the deep end of the pool with no>water wings this time, next version will hopefully see them>sipping a Pina Colada on a lounge chair in the pool, not>drowning at the bottom. Sign me up! Sounds like fun!-Doug

http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho...id=373864&page=

>Thank you Luis,>>I am using {46BFB3BD-CE68-418E-8112-FEBA17428ACE} for the>flatten, but {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000} for the>exclude. (There is no defaullt flatten). However, I originally>did not have an exclude and it still displayed the default>textures so I then added the exclude polygon.>>Doug,>>Do you think it would work if I used>{359C73E8-06BE-4FB2-ABCB-EC942F7761D0} ?>>The final question is why should the GPS polygon be different>from the sea? The problem as I see it, is that the GPS water>is encroaching onto the land.>>George>If there is no default flatten, it would seem you have no need for an exclude at all. The GUID you are using for the flatten ( {46BFB3BD... ) should do the trick. What do you mean by "default textures"?The GPS water poly is merely a low-resolution water polygon used only by the GPS (not the in-game terrain). They can deviate significantly from the terrain water. At the scale used by the GPS the differences are typically not seen.-Doug

Just one note: It won't hurt for the dbf file to have additional fields - they'll just be ignored by Shp2Vec.-Doug >The dbf should only have 2 fields and they are >> - the UUID (the unique identifier for each shape)>> - the GUID (the terrain element identifier from the>terrain.cfg)>> for example, > 140 Concrete 1 Lane Undivided Median>{C288FEA7-B981-44EF-9C3D-EEEFE5A069A6}>

>The dark blue should be the GPS water - it is a hydro polygon>without an elevation value that only displays in the GPS, not>in the terrain. You can turn it off in the menu for more>clarity.>>Please notice the lines in the water - they define the limits>of the Hydro Polygons. If your exclude is set to remove them,>then they will be excluded completely, that is, up to their>limits out into the water. >>So, the question is, are you excluding the default flatten,>and if so, what GUID are you using? >>If you use the GUID for 164 Flatten MaskClassMap>ExcludeAutoGen, then that is all that will be excluded.>>But, if you are using a GUID for all elements>({00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}, then you are also>removing the water, and roads, and shorelines, etc. all the>way to their clip level.Absolutely correct.Note that the GUID for the Airport Bounds (flatten of any flavor) AttributeBlock could also be used {359C73E8-06BE-4FB2-ABCB-EC942F7761D0}.-Doug

>As of 2 days ago, I had committed to myself to not explore>FSX. After reading the first two parts of the SimHQ review, I>tried a mission for the first time. Mission name: Find>Missing Sailboat.>>Amazing; most cool graphics turned on, reflective runways,>rain, clouds, lots of autogen, good terrain, and very, very>smooth.>>That review completely changed my mind about the product,>because it sent me to a place in the sim, very convincing,>which works as expected on my machine.>>I'm sold. Period. Ain't that strange?>>Now I'll ask a direct question of ACES...Does FSX auto-update>if agreed to?>>Anyway, I'm sold.>>bt>Glad you are enjoying it! It's been fun hearing about people discovering that missions are really cool after all. There is currently no auto-update.-Doug

>Thanks Doug and Luis.>>OK. Here is what I found. I created a simple 4 point hydro>poly for my test.>>1. set all points to 500m. Hydro poly compiled fine, but in>game I saw that flattens from default scenery were still in>there. My first thought was to create a new texture in>terrain.cfg and changing the flatten and render priority (I>_think_ smaller number = higher priority?) but couldn't get>this to work (couldn't see my new poly). But thinking about>this, I don't think this is a viable method, since>configuration management of terrain.cfg would be impossible if>everyone was creating new textures with different priority. >So instead, I created an "all hydro poly" exclude (this seems>like the only way to exclude default scenery until a>disassembler is built to determine the specific texture called>out in the poly?). This worked.Use TmfViewer to open the default cvx*.bgl. Right-click on the feature to be excluded and choose Identify Vector Features. This will give you information (such as the actual texture) that can be useful for more surgical exclusions.>2. Set two points to 550m. Didn't do anything to ensure they>were co-planer. Compiled. The tilt seemed to apply to my>hydro poly even without SLOPEX or SLOPEY.>>3. Determined approx slope X based on my poly vertices>(approx 13123m / degree). I was using FSX_KML to build my>shapefiles. Found out this utility is not properly building>the dbf file (the SLOPEX and SLOPEY need to be Float 13>characters). So I fat-fingured the dbf file to get the proper>fields in there and my slope values. Compiled OK (after>fixing some file format problems -- shp2vec needs dbf file in>good format and doesn't report when it can't decode the file)>and ran. Again the poly displayed correctly. So whatever>SLOPEX and SLOPEY do, FSX can get along without them being>set.If by "get along" you mean "won't crash" - sure. But if you are going to the effort to create the sloped polygon it might be considered advisable to finish the job and provide the data that the terrain system was programmed to make use of. Your call.-Doug @ ACES

>>2. Still a little uncertain about this "texture" attribute.>>>I guess for all vectors except for freeway trafic and gps>>water polys, there is a texture attribute with the identical>>value: {1B6A15BB-05FB-4401-A8D1-BB520E84904C}>>Hi,>>My interpretation is:>>- if the XML file has a reference to>{1B6A15BB-05FB-4401-A8D1-BB520E84904C} then it instructs>shp2vec that it should read a "texture guid" from the dbase>for each of the shapes to be processed. In SBuilder, I am>simply copying (and renaming) the XML files into the>../SBuilder/Tools/Shapes folder and do not care about the>{1B6A15BB-05FB-4401-A8D1-BB520E84904C}.Correct. The XML is telling Shp2Vec that it should make a Texture AttributeBlock and which Shapefile field to use to populate it.>>3. Still need to understand how the slpoex and slopey>relate>>to elevations in the shapefile. I see how to compute the>>values, but how is the slope value applied to the shape>>elevations. For example, should the polygon have the same>>elevation for all vertices, or the elevations set to the>>appropriate elevation computed using the slope scales (and>>which vertex is taken as the "base" value that the slope>>scales are applied to?).>>I did not test yet these SlopeX&Y. I am just exporting the>shape files with SlopeX=0 and SlopeY=0. Unless someone tells>us that slopped surfaces are not supported in FSX, I plan to>evaluate the SlopeX and SlopeY according the description in>the SDK. What I recall from high scoll geometry is that if I>have the ground projection of a polygon (eg no altitude for>the points) plus SlopeX plus Slope Y plus the altitude of a>single point, then tye exact position in 3D space of all>polygon points will be know.Sloped water surfaces are supported in FSX. The points of the polygon should be in the same 3D plane. The slopeX and slopeY are the pre-computed (to save runtime) normal to that plane. They are used in extrapolating the plane of the water surface onto the terrain grid.

>>The slope values are not used by Shp2Vec itself. It is just>>pre-computed data (to save time at runtime) that Shp2Vec>>passes through to the game.>>Hello Doug,>>In FS9 we could make slopped flattens using LWM3 polygon>types. In the past I had a tool to set the altitude of all>points of a polygon so that the points were in the same 3D>plane. That was sufficient for getting slopped surfaces in>FS9.>>Shall I set the altitude of the points plus these SlopeX and>SlopeY? In other words, will we be able to make slopped>surfaces in FSX?>>Kind Regards,>>Luis>Yes, you will be able to make sloped water surfaces in FSX. The points of the polygon should be in the same 3D plane. The slopeX and slopeY are the pre-computed (to save runtime) normal to that plane. They are used in extrapolating the plane of the water surface onto the terrain grid.-Doug

>Thanks for the explanation, Doug. Does that mean if I have>platforms defined for my custom bridges, and a traffic vector>is drawn across it, the traffic will follow the platform>surface?That's the idea.>And it looks like I shouldn't try to run traffic over the>railroad bridges ... ;)Not the default ones anyway.-Doug

>I was wondering if I'm doing something wrong or if there is>something funky in FSX... When doing ILS approach to RWY 9L>at Philly Intl KPHL, the autopilot brings me in on the right>edge of the runway, instead of the runway centerline. It did>it in the Airbus and in the 737. I'm going to try another>airport (JFK) next, but it seems odd to me. I believe I have>the right freq (108.95) for the 9L localizer. I'm using APP>mode on the autopilot.I spoke with our data manager about KPHL 9L ILS alignment. Here is a summary:We receive runway placement information in two ways: 1) Center Lat/Lon, length, width and heading. 2) Threshold Lat/Lons, width (typically more accurate).KPHL 9L was received via method 2, and we calculated the length (9487 ft.) and heading (85.45). The associated ILS was received as heading 85.0.The ILS is category 1 - for use with some visibility (2400 feet RVR / 1800 feet RVR with runway TDZ and centerline lites). These do not necessarily line up exactly with runway centerline.Remember that ILS has a course width aspect (it's not just a straight line).As such, we allow for a certain amount of discrepancy with Cat 1 ILS before we start investigating. Cat 2 and Cat 3 ILS we make sure line up exactly.Hope this explanation helps.-Doug

>Luis,>>Have you figured out how to get traffic to cross bridges? I'm>very impressed that MS does this with the default bridges...>>JonThe default road bridges (Extrusion Bridges) have platforms in their extrusion definitions (note that the default railroad bridges are encoded to ignore platforms). Most, if not all, of the default modeled bridges do as well.Traffic vectors are 2D. You merely need the traffic vectors to line up with the bridge surface. Note that it gets really interesting (vehicles nose-diving off the edge and potentially jumping back up) when the traffic vectors deviate from the bridge surface.-Doug

>Luis is correct, you can exclude the default flatten with an>exclusion polygon and add you new flatten in the same cvx>file. Here is an example at EGCC. The inner yellow polygon is>the default flatten, the cyan polygon is the exclusion and the>outer yellow polygon is the new flatten.>>George>>>>>Looks sweet! Note that the exclusion does not need to enclose the shape to be excluded. The ENVELOPE of the exclude needs to intersect the ENVELOPES of all of the clipped pieces of the shape to be excluded. In this case, you're fine and what you did is easier. In some cases, where you wish to surgically remove one shape when others of the same type are close by, you may need to more carefully craft multiple exclusion polygons.-Doug

>The texture flag in the xml defines the attribute block - it>is not the texture itself, but just tells shp2vec to expect a>texture definition, I imagine. The developers would have to be>the ones to give a technical explanantion of this. I wouldn't>dare for fear of being shouted at.Yup. Note that "texture definition" is a loose term.>The slopex and slopey in the dbf confused me a lot at first.>They are not the same as the elevation of the shape in the>shapefile. >>Shapefile elevation is a z-coordinate that is contained within>the shapefile itself.>>The slopex and slopey fields in the dbf tell shp2vec how to>apply a slope - the values should be vertical slope in meters>per degree, and have fun figuring that out. I prefer to use>the mesh-clinging water, myself.The slope values are not used by Shp2Vec itself. It is just pre-computed data (to save time at runtime) that Shp2Vec passes through to the game.-Doug

>i had a very similar problem at STL when landing today. its>not that the headings and courses are different, its that the>ILS doesnt even lead to the runway...i was flying the 12L ILS>there and flying it down the chute perfectly, but ended up>having to pull up quickly after realizing it was leading me to>a point somewhere north of the airport, parallel to the path i>was supposed to be on. i had to pull up the GPS, and zoom in,>and only then did i realize what a complete mess STL is, and i>assume its not the only one. ILS's leading everywhere, and>only 1 of them leading to a runway (the 12R loc happened to>lead to 12L, probably by sheer coincidence)Perhaps you were chasing the LOC/DME (IABW/110.10) associated with 12L. It is located where you describe (north of the airport). There is another one (IFXD/110.55) associated with 30L east of the airport.If you go to Visual Flight Path on the FSX Aircraft pulldown menu you can turn on visual indicators for the ILS.Dial up 108.90 (the Cat II associated with 12L) and you will see that it does indeed drop you onto 12L.Likewise, Dial up 109.70 (the Cat I associated with 12R) and you will see that it does indeed drop you onto 12R.KSTL is a big airport. There ARE a lot of ILS. The ones that are supposed to ALL put you on a runway.And in case something has recently changed, note that the Nav data FSX is built on is a snapshot from February-ish of 2005.-Doug

Bravo! Well done!Coverage of other vector types should be a logical extension of this information.And FYI - Shp2Vec will tolerate either ordering of vertices within a polygon ring.Please cross-post at www.fsdeveloper.com.-Doug

>In FS2004 there is a way to produce the output of the>coordinates of the A/C location at the top of the screen in>the form of:>>dd mm ss.ssss, instead of the default dd mm.mm>>That alteration was made in the fs9.cfg file and was:>>Under the {Main} heading:>>Display_Fractional_Minutes=0>>That does not seem to work in FSX.>>Does anyone know how to achieve a more accurate readout and>care to share that here?>>Jim>Not sure about fractional seconds, but it is possible to get decimal degrees.In your fsx.cfg, replace "Latitude=x,x" and "Longitude=x,x" with "LatitudeDec=x,x" and "LongitudeDec=x,x" in the [TextInfo.x] and [slewTextInfo.x] sections. For example:[TextInfo.1]LatitudeDec=1,1LongitudeDec=1,2...[slewTextInfo.1]LatitudeDec=1,1LongitudeDec=1,2-Doug

>Hi all.>>Concerning XML exclusions. Whether it is an airport or an>object ( such as a building ), the exclusion should be>relatively small. Just take out the refpoint if possible.>Combine the many small exclusions into one XML file. Within>this XML, you should also add the text to replace the airport/>objects/ etc. This way there is one xml-created BGL for the>whole project.>>This avoids the prospect of mutiple BGLs ( which may not work>together, as Luis has found ). Many excludes, many placements>of new objects, in one BGL.>>The same is true of shapefile/vector scenery. The shp2vec tool>will make one BGL of several shapefile types ( including the>exclusions for terrain elements and autogen ). The SDK has a>great example of an entire default project... only missing is>the exclusion shapefile, and an example of that is also>included in the second SDK example. Again, many elements, one>BGL.>>In this way, you have fewer BGLs for a project. One is for>exclusion/rebuilding of XML-type scenery. One is for vector>exclusion/rebuilding. Perhaps another for mesh, another for>photoreal. >>This is a neat and compact way of designing, and guarantees>success. This is not the way we have been doing things in the>past, but it would be a better habit to form. I think we need>to start viewing the excludes as a part of the redesign>process, not as a separate BGL.>>DickPerfect on all counts!-Doug

>I also would be interested in someone figuring this out. The>terrain sdk document says:>>"2. Exclude general classes of shapes (for example, all roads>or all water polygons) by using one of the GUIDs from the>Vector Attributes table.">>I don't see any GUIDs in the table that would allow for this. >It seems like the same GUID "1B6A15BB..." is used for every>shape type. The example that is supposed to exclude airport>flattens also uses this same GUID.>>Also using this "method 2" it seems like you could exclude>exclusions from lower layers?">>I assume exclusion method 1 (null) is the one that excludes>autogen?>>>I note that the bounding box for the exclusion shape is used,>not the actual shape geometry.>>Not sure how the "clipping level" affects this. Minimum area>excluded?>>scott s.>.>The GUID 1B6A15BB... is the guid for a texture block. Using this in an exclusion will result in all vector types with a texture block being excluded.From the table you mentioned - for all roads, you would use 560FA8E6... for all water polygons use 956A42AD... I believe someone on the beta investigated the exclude an exclude and determined that it did not do anything.Method 1 does NOT exclude autogen. Autogen is excluded by use of "flattens" (bad name) with appropriate GUID:{6c0c6528-5cf1-483a-a586-2c905cf2757e} ExcludeAutogen{47d48287-3ade-4fc5-8bec-b6b36901e612} Flatten{5a7f944c-3d79-4e0c-82f5-04844e5dc653} Flatten + MaskClassMap{1f2baab1-4132-416e-8f6f-28abe79cd60b} MaskClassMap{46bfb3bd-ce68-418e-8112-feba17428ace} Flatten + MaskClassMap + ExcludeAutogen{18580a63-fc8f-4a02-a622-8a1e073e627b} Flatten + ExcludeAutogen{594e70c8-06a5-4e3f-be6e-4dbf50b49d11} MaskClassMap + ExcludeAutogen As far as clipping of the exclusion shape - conceptually think of it like the bounding box gets clipped into sub-bounding boxes.And note that the XML files accompanying the Shapefiles in the given examples are not to be edited. The same XML file (renamed) should be used to compile all Shapefiles of a given vector type. You want to be playing with the Shapefile data file (DBF) values.-Doug

>Hi Luis.>>I think this is about right. We should be using XML excludes>to get rid of objects, and Shapefile/Vector excludes to get>rid of autogen.>>I haven't read of anything like the QMID15-sized minimum for>autogen XML exclusion anywhere else. But it seems true.>>Dick Your summary is correct. XML exclusions for objects, Shapefile/Vector exclusions for autogen. Please don't rely on any accidental XML exclusion behavior for autogen. This would be undocumented and unsupported. Not a good idea.-Doug

>Thank you for the confirmation, Doug, it is good to know.>>I have received messages from people wondering why the>documentation says one thing when excludes don't in fact work>on autogen. So, there has been confusion, to say the least.>>In the absence of communication, the only recourse that we>have is to test and establish the limits ourselves. Which is>what I, and others, have been doing.>>By the way, you were the one who said that this was broken and>that you were looking into it, in this very thread, as a>matter of fact. I was only echoing your comment.>>Best regards.>>LuisI apologize if my earlier statement was not clear. What I intended to say was broken and being looked into was autogen via photo annotations not responding to "flattens" with autogen exclusion properties.-Doug

>>THE ONLY SUPPORTED AND DOCUMENTED WAY OF EXCLUDING AUTOGEN>AT>>FSX IS THROUGH THE USE OF SHP2VEC COMPILED "FLATTENS".>>PERIOD.>>>>Well, Doug. Have a look in the file 'the bgl compiler.html'>found in the folder '...Microsoft Flight Simulator X>SDKSDKEnvironment KitBGL Compiler SDK'. The following>passage is copied from the SDK documentation for FSX:>>"This element is used to create an exclusion region for>scenery. Exclusion rectangles are used to remove scenery>objects from the specified region. Flags can be used to>exclude a subset of objects in the specified region. This>element is not allowed to contain other data and must be>terminated with