sadnane

Thank you Mr. Roberts for the update! I'm really looking forward for the Xplane's versions especially when it comes to the flight model! I hope you'll get the most out of the Blade Element theory in order to nail the flight model down and make it "as real as it gets". Keep up the great work!

I think X-Plane got some hidden gems to be discovered yet...some 3PD are now developing a 737-300 for X-Plane and are using custom plugins to enhance the flight model, ground friction model, ground effect model, engine model etc...and they state that their plane simply behaves like the REAL one (I'm taking their word for it) and I'm pretty sure PMDG will be no exception. X-Plane community has a huge void in regards to quality Boeing add-ons (up to the level of PMDG ones), and with a popular product like the 737 NGX taking full advantage of X-Plane's power it will encourage many FSX loyal fans to give XP10 a try and see what it can really deliver as a flight simulator. Eagerly awaiting for the first XP10 project! and thank you PMDG for all your great work!

I might have seen this thread too late but anyway i'd like to know what JV would think about these : http://www.beti-x.com/CZSTstewart.html http://asn-xp.aerosoft.com/?page_id=1256

Thanks for the update! No matter how much time it would take before release...I'm pretty sure it'll be worth the wait! Mohamed Adnane SALHANI

I do agree!! and to me it's the most "erratic" thing about X-Plane : great flight modeling process (Blade Element Theory) with many but poorly designed aircrafts that simply dont do justice to it! you can check out IXEG's blog and read about how they managed to write custom plugins to enhance the flight model. Of course this forum is about PMDG but the point to me is that they should emphasize on improving the flight model since the systems are already modeled (Roberts talked about converting an already existing airplane to XP platform). Mohamed Adnane SALHANI

For me the main thing that would make an aircraft add-on successful in the XP platform is its flight model since (I guess) airplane systems' coding (FMC...) is platform-independent. Developers like IXEG had to code custom plugins for their upcoming 737 where Plane Maker is insufficient in order to take it to the next level! People should not judge X-plane by some poorly designed aircrafts of (unfortunately) by the default ones. Even FSX's ones have poor flight models. Mohamed Adnane SALHANI

Well, according to an ex-member of Flight's team (he quit before Flight was canceled), they already had an SDK which, if it was made public, would have shown the real potential of Flight and made FSX "look like a toy". But since Joshua adopted a different approach, 3PD didn't have that option and Flight was doomed before we can know what it is really capable of as a platform... sad though!

MS Flight is now out of the picture and its team laid off! This doesn't necessarily reflect the failure of Flight's business model, as I learned Microsoft announced their first loss ever since 26 years as a public company, so they'd be rather eager to cut more costs and Flight and Project Columbia weren't in a safe place from the axe. Now can we expect from Microsoft to release/license the Flight SDK to another independent studio or company to continue further development or they'll keep it for themselves (cos after closing ACES studios and now canceling Flight, I (personally) see no reason why they will continue to develop the FS franchise). It will be a total waste in the second case because a huge effort was put to make Flight what it is, unless Microsoft brings back the franchise in the business but even that is doubtful...anyway time will tell

Quite true! I guess that they decided to give up the FS franchise since ESP shutdown but someone had the idea to try the Flight concept for "fast profits". It seems that they had nothing to lose, whether it's gonna work or they'll throw it away anyway. Trying to create a fictitious target market that does not exist is pure suicide.

Since ESP's shutdown it became clear that Microsoft were no longer interested in the FS franchise as we knew it for about 25 years now. With Flight they tried to lock the doors against add-ons developers so they'll be able to control that secondary market the way they feel, but things don't work that way (or at least didn't work that way). Now with Microsoft out of the picture, I would really know if they will hold the Flight SDK even though there'll be no further development. If it's the case then what's the point? and how could the laid-off teams just stay without doing anything in the foreseeable future? it really bums me out how Microsoft have ruined a successful franchise because of their carelessness towards so many loyal fans. Huge corporations work for profits indeed, but at least I hope they'll release Flight SDK and pass the relay baton to other independent developers who really care about their costumers and most of all, are doing it with passion and dedication.

Agree. I think X-plane will catch up if Laminar Research make a better graphics engine (like Flight's one) and a more friendly GUI. it might have a shelf life longer than 5 years since it's constantly updated before it becomes stable and meanwhile the X-plane add on market will grow and mature, too. Until then who knows? life is full of surprises :) Adnane.

Kevin, That's my opinion too but I had a glimmer of hope when I once read on their website : "Not only will Cascade Game Foundry address the significant hole in the simulation market left by Microsoft’s recent departure(...)" I thought that they were talking about Flight Simulation. You've been in the team Kevin and you know how much time, money and energy it takes to make a flight sim but you'd agree with me that it's not an impossible task. No matter how much time it would take, I bet there will be some people who'll still devote themselves to the hobby they believe in and used to make their living out of.

Hi everyone, I just wanna know how could all the ACES and Flight team members just stay without doing anything in the foreseeable future! Since October 2009 former ACES members have launched a new sim studio Cascade Game Foundry (still awaiting for their first game...), maybe Flight's laid off team would do something similar or even better join forces with CGF (daydreaming :) but who knows ?). Honestly I don't know how much money and time is required to make a sim that at least have the visual quality of Flight, but it'll be a waste if ex ACES and Flight teams won't develop anything in the next 3 or four years. I'd be really surprised if Microsoft license Flight's source code to another company, but it's not something to expect from them. Time will tell. Hopefully there will be some good alternative (other that X-plane 10) and a brighter future for flight simulation. Mohamed Adnane.

Great! just few "cleaned up" models will make the difference. Perhaps i've inadvertently used a misleading statement "refining the BET" (sorry :) )! The distinction is relevant indeed, and it's obvious that since developers can customize their codes to get better results X-plane flight model is just fine! there are few people who can afford that! And personally I prefer having few payware aircrafts with a realistic flight model than a load of airplanes whose authors have no clue about the actual inputs in order to get a decent FM to say the least. Thanks Tom for the precisons! Mohamed Adnane.

Greetings everyone, I personally believe that the default aircrafts' flight model is somehow poor and does NOT reflect the real potential of the BET! Sure Austin should have put a "spot on" GA aircraft with a realistic flight model in the demo to give more credit to the BET accuracy and encourage new users to buy XP10, but it's not a reason for trying to "denigrate" LR's efforts to make their sim better with each release/update. Recently I read a post by Robert Randazzo from PMDG (http://forum.avsim.net/topic/358874-some-thoughts-on-flight/page__st__50#entry2217012) where he stated that PMDG was actively supported by LR and were provided with copies of XP10 so they can evaluate the possibility of porting of of their planes to thid new platform. This clearly shows LR's will to make their sim the ultimate platform for the serious Add-ons vendors ahd thus gather a wider audience. If people @ IXEG.net were able to write plug-ins to refine the BET model and make it more realistic I see no reason why other well known vendors won't do the same. Sure no PC based flight simulator is perfect, and sure that LR should have been more attentive to their customers' feedbacks and, above all, give more credit to their product because generally the first impression lasts and it's even harder to regain the "lost customers"' confidence. Only time will tell and with further new updates we might see some changes in X-plane. Mohamed Adnane.